HCG and Clomid same time?

[MrDavid9000]

Has anyone have experience with taking HCG and clomid together to limit and or reduce hormone suppression when on cycle?...
has anyone taken it as post cycle?
Any information would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers my brothers!

 

[PapaNoel]

Pretty sure latestart does this but you'll have to ask him personally.
You should not take HCG post cycle as its counter productive.

 

[MrDavid9000]

Thanks Santa66 for the information, greatly appreciated!...
I understand the basic science of how and why HCG and clomid works, just wondering if there are any draw backs to taking both on cycle?.... I always take some type of on cycle support with every cycle, I just wondered if there was a draw back to taking both on cycle with the endeavour to minimize as much shut down as possible.
Best regards,

 

[LateStart]

Never used hcg so I cant speak on that. Clomid is a big part of my life. Take it most of the cycle and never miss a dose when cruising. Can DEFINITELY tell the difference when on or off clomid. Clomid keeps my fsh and lh in a low normal state even on cycle. As with anything we do, results vary by individual. Try it and see. Get bloodwork so you're not guessing.
The benefit of clomid over hcg....in my opinion...is that it keeps your whole system working, though to a limited degree. While hcg just keeps the balls working. Thus faster recovery occurs with clomid and hcg is NEVER to be used during pct.
Good luck bro

 

[Megatron28]

You SHOULD use hCG while on cycle. It's stops your balls/Leydig cells from atrophying. This in turn helps you recover faster/better after cycle.

Clomid and Nolva should be used for PCT.

Do not use hCG during PCT as it is suppressive to your HPTA.

There is no point or need to run Clomid during a cycle. An AI should be used.

 

[Megatron28]

Never used hcg so I cant speak on that. Clomid is a big part of my life. Take it most of the cycle and never miss a dose when cruising. Can DEFINITELY tell the difference when on or off clomid. Clomid keeps my fsh and lh in a low normal state even on cycle. As with anything we do, results vary by individual. Try it and see. Get bloodwork so you're not guessing.
The benefit of clomid over hcg....in my opinion...is that it keeps your whole system working, though to a limited degree. While hcg just keeps the balls working. Thus faster recovery occurs with clomid and hcg is NEVER to be used during pct.
Good luck bro

If your LH and FSH are not at zero or effectively at zero during a cycle, your gear is bunk. For one, hCG doesn't show up as LH in blood work. It mimics LH but it is not LH. And Clomid is not strong enough to keep your HPTA from being suppressed during a cycle.

 

[LateStart]

If your LH and FSH are not at zero or effectively at zero during a cycle, your gear is bunk. For one, hCG doesn't show up as LH in blood work. It mimics LH but it is not LH. And Clomid is not strong enough to keep your HPTA from being suppressed during a cycle.

This may be over sharing but when I go on cycle my ejaculate volume drops to almost nothing. When I add clomid on it returns to at or above normal. Three cycles in and this has happened every cycle. This leads me to believe the clomid is telling my balls to produce. I agree....I'm probably not producing much if any of my own test but its doin something. Also, when I come off cycle and cruise on 100mg test with clomid added in.....I go get my bloodwork done and numbers look good. Test level is too high at 1300 on my last visit. Perhaps I am wrong but this tells me I am making my own plus the 100mg injection to get this high.
Wouldnt you think that 100mg cyp per week should produce lower than 1300 5 days after injection? My feeling is that I am producing some of my own to get to this number. The doc believes this as well and keeps trying to talk me into a lower dose of test. Thankfully I always talk him down. Lol
Anyway....my thoughts are different people respond differently. Clomid tells my body I have no estrogen and need to make test to compensate. Looking at my test levels, fsh and lh, and volume of ejaculate....I can only come to the conclusion that it works for me. Curious for your thoughts on this.
And I admitted I have no hcg experience. Only what I've read and learned from the bros on here

 

[MrDavid9000]

Yes “Latestart”, I would agree with you, I have done several cycles over the last two years and I have found that taking clomid on cycle seems to limit the feed back loop and there remains a natural hormone production level, to what degree who really knows???... but my last two cycles I kept the clomid going and going into pct from cycle was virtually seamless and I don’t even think I lost much muscle and mood was just like on cycle.
I started doin research on this after my second cycle I ever did... I listened to a gym bro and he told me it’s best to let my natural test totally shut down and just run on my pinned test, he also told me to up the dose from .75 ml of t-400 per week to 1.25ml twice A week, well you can imagine how well that went?!.. I was bloated, nipples tingling and swelling, and the worst part was I had to quit my cycle early and start pct (my sides where through the roof so bad that even 300mg a day of aromisin barely kept them under control), during the ride out of the very long Esther I had a restong heart rate of 95bpm (didn’t make sleeping very fun), after 3 weeks things started to return to normal and then the crash happened, weird thoughts of fear and sadness, emotional, almost a hollow feeling of no purpose... wasn’t a very fun experience, but a good learning experience.... then I started to study on how people used clomid, Nolvadex on cycle to limit shut down, I tried it and the transition was much much better, a few more cycles after that and I could almost time everything to have a seamless cross over from on cycle to natural and totally feel normal.
Then I became a member here and I read about taking HCG on cycle.... so it appears this would be a helpful strategy as well...
my hypothesis is the HCG keeps testicles rolling and clomid prevents shut down from the HCG, I suppose everyone will respond differently... I will post a log and my results, it would probably help some people.
If there is a flaw in my idea please tell me and explain why, I am here to learn as much as I can and make a positive contribution.
Cheers and thank you so much for the positive feed back and insight.

 

[clman8585]

Clomid will destroy your eyesight over time.

 

[PapaNoel]

Yes ***8220;Latestart***8221;, I would agree with you, I have done several cycles over the last two years and I have found that taking clomid on cycle seems to limit the feed back loop and there remains a natural hormone production level, to what degree who really knows???... but my last two cycles I kept the clomid going and going into pct from cycle was virtually seamless and I don***8217;t even think I lost much muscle and mood was just like on cycle.
I started doin research on this after my second cycle I ever did... I listened to a gym bro and he told me it***8217;s best to let my natural test totally shut down and just run on my pinned test, he also told me to up the dose from .75 ml of t-400 per week to 1.25ml twice A week, well you can imagine how well that went?!.. I was bloated, nipples tingling and swelling, and the worst part was I had to quit my cycle early and start pct (my sides where through the roof so bad that even 300mg a day of aromisin barely kept them under control), during the ride out of the very long Esther I had a restong heart rate of 95bpm (didn***8217;t make sleeping very fun), after 3 weeks things started to return to normal and then the crash happened, weird thoughts of fear and sadness, emotional, almost a hollow feeling of no purpose... wasn***8217;t a very fun experience, but a good learning experience.... then I started to study on how people used clomid, Nolvadex on cycle to limit shut down, I tried it and the transition was much much better, a few more cycles after that and I could almost time everything to have a seamless cross over from on cycle to natural and totally feel normal.
Then I became a member here and I read about taking HCG on cycle.... so it appears this would be a helpful strategy as well...
my hypothesis is the HCG keeps testicles rolling and clomid prevents shut down from the HCG, I suppose everyone will respond differently... I will post a log and my results, it would probably help some people.
If there is a flaw in my idea please tell me and explain why, I am here to learn as much as I can and make a positive contribution.
Cheers and thank you so much for the positive feed back and insight.

This is a textbook example of how "bro-science" looks and why you should never trust it.
Holy fuck there's so much wrong in this I'm not even gonna bother pointing it out.

 

[MrDavid9000]

Santa66,
I know right, looking back I think to myself “wtf was I doing!”... but I’m sure I’m not the only one.
Bro science has hurt more people then it’s helped I would imagine, especially with stuff like this.
I see lots of information here that would have really helped me then, I didn’t really know how complex it really was and how and why certain things are done, I purchased several overseas anabolics medical text books, that helped me quite a bit, but comparing a few different stuff there was conflicting information from one book to another, ie: one said arimidex was a suicide inhibitor And the other said aromisin was.

 

[MrDavid9000]

Clman8585,
How does clomid destroy the human eye?... I know if you take too much it can cause blurred vision, but permitted destruction?

 

[LateStart]

Clman8585,
How does clomid destroy the human eye?... I know if you take too much it can cause blurred vision, but permitted destruction?

My understanding is that there is a theory it can swell the pituitary and pressure on a nerve to the eye. Not sure there are any actual cases though. I am very interested though. Definitely want to hear more because I take it every day.

 

[Megatron28]

My understanding is that there is a theory it can swell the pituitary and pressure on a nerve to the eye. Not sure there are any actual cases though. I am very interested though. Definitely want to hear more because I take it every day.

https://www.karger.com/Article/FullText/319497

 

[LateStart]

https://www.karger.com/Article/FullText/319497

Thank you sir. Your link lead me to many many pages of literature on other sites. It seems that visual problems are more closely associated with the use of high doses....100 to 200mg per day. 12.5 to a max of 25mg per day appears much safer. Very interesting. Visual disturbances reported in 1.5% of users. I will do more research and talk to my doctor at the next appointment in a few weeks. Thank you very much bro.
http://www.bioidenticalhormones101....ormones101.com/Clomid_For_Men_Three.html#2786

 

[MrDavid9000]

Oh dear!.. I hope this isn’t the case, I did notice at 150mg a day (3 caps) my vision did seem to get worse, I got blurred vision in the morning and once when driving, wasn’t very fun!.. but nothing happens at 50mg per day... because of this thread I started doing research and it appears there is something to it, this next cycle I’m starting I’ll just use HCG on cycle and a lighter dose of clomid in post cycle.... I’m 39 so life time trt is probably around the corner anyways.

 

[scorob777]

If you time your PCT right, in terms of both pause after last shot and total duration, you don't need large doses of clomid. 50mg is the max, and after a couple weeks can be cut in half.

There's no point in taking 150 or 100 mg/day, unless you start with too much AAS still in your system - in which case you can just wait a while longer for the esters to clear and skip the risks of the high clomid doses.

As with most things in life the poison is in the dosage.

 

[MrDavid9000]

I would agree with tankmanbob less is better, that’s what I have done the last few cycles, I only dozed high once, then had weird sides and did some reseach in why and the answer and remedy is pretty much what your saying.... simple solution is to start taking it at 50mg for a bit longer then 1/2 it.

 

[casanovaaa]

I would agree with tankmanbob less is better, that***8217;s what I have done the last few cycles, I only dozed high once, then had weird sides and did some reseach in why and the answer and remedy is pretty much what your saying.... simple solution is to start taking it at 50mg for a bit longer then 1/2 it.

Whats with the wierd sides? what happened? how did you manage them?

 

[MrDavid9000]

The sides where:
•Feelings of doom, thoughts of my world is going to end, I might die and leave my wife and kids with no support and they will be left out on the street.
•Blurred vision in mornings
•Dizzy spells
How to remedy:
Reduced clomid from 200mg per day to 50mg
All sides reduced to zero in 3 days.

Whats with the wierd sides? what happened? how did you manage them?