PCT Approaching need help!

G

GReaver

New member
Dear all,

I have been reading vigorously through several forums over the last 24 hours.

My PCT is scheduled to start in 17 days, my last Test E shot is this Friday. I injected 500 IU of HCG twice last week and will continue this until three days before my PCT. Totalling 4000IU of HCG over 4 weeks. I have been running Test e at 300-350ml for the last 15 weeks. Aromasin has been used eod since cycle commencement. At week 4 i tanked my estro. Took a week off of the AI and everything back into normal ranges within 10 days. At week 10 i upped to 25mg from 12.5mg eod as blood results came back at 4240 Test and Estro was at 199.

My current PCT is as follow

Aromasin continuing throughout at 25mg eod and will taper down to around 12.5mg for a fotrnite after PCT ends to minimise estro rebound.

6 Week duration of

Clomid 50/50/50/25/25/25
Nolva 40/40/40/20/20/20

From the reading i have done these previously suggested and planned values seem very excessive and high. Could the brothers here please point me in a more sensible direction? I have read about intratesticular aromatization and how traditional AIs cannot combat this resulting in additional suppression.

This is my first cycle. (Had a blast so far no pun intended)
25 Years of age
5’11 195lbs 13% bf

Pre cycle Test was 637 and estro was 105 (17-beta oestradiol) (199 is the upper limit from the lab i used for bloods) At my peak test of 4200 estro reached 199 right on the edge with dosing of 12.5mg aromasin eod. I have not yet suffered from any perceived high estro symptoms.

Kindest regards
 
You appear to be all set up with what you need. The Test E dosage of 300-350 mg/wk was light, so you'd only need a two week pause between last shot and start of PCT. Keep taking your AI during this pause, though I'd say you could cut your dosage in half. Stop taking it at day +15, when you start the clomid and nolva.

For that low a Test dosage you probably don't need a six week PCT, and if you think the dosages are excessive you could cut it down to 50/50/25/25/25 and 40/40/20/20/20.

For HCG keep taking it right up to the end of the gap.
 
Thank you kindly for your response.

So just to clarify this is the PCT layout you suggest?

My Last test e injection was on the 27th of April. I continue my HCG shots of 2x 500IU until the 11th of May. During this period i continue taking my AI and potentially cut my dosage depending on how i feel regarding estro.

On the following Monday after my last HCG Shot i begin My PCT which will consist of

6 Weeks of Clomid at 50/50/25/25/25 and Nolvadex at 40/40/20/20/20. During this period you suggest to not use an Ai?

Is there any specific reason why the other forum boards recommended me to use an AI during PCT with some even suggesting to use a lower dosage after my PCT was complete?

Again thank you very much for inputting and helping me.

Kindest regards
 
GReaver said:
On the following Monday after my last HCG Shot i begin My PCT which will consist of

6 Weeks of Clomid at 50/50/25/25/25 and Nolvadex at 40/40/20/20/20. During this period you suggest to not use an Ai?
Click to expand...

What is listed is 5 weeks, not 6. 50 the first and second, then 25 third through fifth.

Regarding the other forums, you can find somebody's opinion to support any theory on the internet - regardless of right or wrong. It's up to you to decide who is credible.

Think about what's happening in your body as you ween off the testosterone injections. Test levels bleed down according to their half lives, and if you are lucky your testes will be producing a little bit because of the HCG - i.e. not completely shut down. So after that two week pause what are your testosterone levels? Assuming they are pretty low, then where is the estrogen coming from?

The point is if you use AI on cycle to keep E2 in check, then during the pause, you won't have much at all going into PCT.

Also, during PCT the clomid and nolva trick your hypothalamus into sensing you have low estrogen, so it tries to compensate by cranking out the GRH which kicks your pituitary into gear making LH and FSH, which kick your balls into gear making testosterone. No real need to take AI during this time, and also the point of PCT is to ween off all external drugs (including eventually the nolva and clomid) and get your body back to a natural state. Taking AI is going to continue to jack with that process, and if you get the dosage wrong you will have odd symptoms that you really don't want to experience.
 
My mistake.

Again thank you very much for this.

I will continue into PCT with the plan you outlined here.

Have a nice day
 
Milton said:
have you started pct yet op?
Click to expand...

Hi Milton, my PCT is scheduled to start 10 days from today. I Will inject 2 more HCG shots of 500IU. One on Tuesday and the next on Friday. Then on the following Monday I will start Clomid and Nolva at 50/40mg respectively for two weeks. Then cut dosages in half for the remaining 4.

Kindest regards
 
What would you guys say to starting the SERMS a week later on Monday. So 24 days after my last shot instead of 17? I was shooting Twice a week at 0.5/0.6ml of Test E from a 300mg 10ML Vial. I just don't want to start the SERMS too early where the test E build up still hasn't cleared out. These were my mid cycle bloods from 8 weeks ago. From all my reading my test was ridiculously high for the amount i was injecting, so considering the accumulation i'm thinking 2 weeks is too short of a period before??

Bloods below for reference. Hormones on attachment 3

View attachment 567399
View attachment 567400
View attachment 567401
 
My Estro reading was when i was on only 12.5mg of Aromasin. After that blood test i began dosing at 25mg eod and still continue to do so whilst injecting 2x500 IU of HCG Weekly.
 
tankmanbob said:
What is listed is 5 weeks, not 6. 50 the first and second, then 25 third through fifth.

Regarding the other forums, you can find somebody's opinion to support any theory on the internet - regardless of right or wrong. It's up to you to decide who is credible.

Think about what's happening in your body as you ween off the testosterone injections. Test levels bleed down according to their half lives, and if you are lucky your testes will be producing a little bit because of the HCG - i.e. not completely shut down. So after that two week pause what are your testosterone levels? Assuming they are pretty low, then where is the estrogen coming from?

The point is if you use AI on cycle to keep E2 in check, then during the pause, you won't have much at all going into PCT.

Also, during PCT the clomid and nolva trick your hypothalamus into sensing you have low estrogen, so it tries to compensate by cranking out the GRH which kicks your pituitary into gear making LH and FSH, which kick your balls into gear making testosterone. No real need to take AI during this time, and also the point of PCT is to ween off all external drugs (including eventually the nolva and clomid) and get your body back to a natural state. Taking AI is going to continue to jack with that process, and if you get the dosage wrong you will have odd symptoms that you really don't want to experience.
Click to expand...

Milton said:
have you started pct yet op?
Click to expand...

Any input guys for my last question?
 
24 days would be fine. Test E's half life is 10 days, so starting with your 4,200 TT in 10 days 2,100, day 20 1,050, day 24 would be down around 700 to 800 ish, which might be close to your natural level. Was that the question?
 
tankmanbob said:
24 days would be fine. Test E's half life is 10 days, so starting with your 4,200 TT in 10 days 2,100, day 20 1,050, day 24 would be down around 700 to 800 ish, which might be close to your natural level. Was that the question?
Click to expand...

Yes that was the question. My pre cycle test was 637 and estro was 101. So ideally around 26/28days then?
 
If I understand your questions - you are asking how long to wait after last shot to start PCT???

This has nothing at all to do with your pre-cycle test and E2 levels. My theory is you want to let the steroids you injected bleed down to near natural levels before starting PCT. This will prevent you from losing much muscle you gained (i.e. if you don't wait too long and drop below natural levels), and give you maximum chance to succeed (i.e. by making sure you don't start so soon that the nolva and clomid are not effective, and/or you exit PCT with still too much exogenous steroids in your system).

So with that in mind, the 24 days you mentioned seems about perfect. Debating 26 or 28 days seems like splitting hairs.
 
tankmanbob said:
If I understand your questions - you are asking how long to wait after last shot to start PCT???

This has nothing at all to do with your pre-cycle test and E2 levels. My theory is you want to let the steroids you injected bleed down to near natural levels before starting PCT. This will prevent you from losing much muscle you gained (i.e. if you don't wait too long and drop below natural levels), and give you maximum chance to succeed (i.e. by making sure you don't start so soon that the nolva and clomid are not effective, and/or you exit PCT with still too much exogenous steroids in your system).

So with that in mind, the 24 days you mentioned seems about perfect. Debating 26 or 28 days seems like splitting hairs.
Click to expand...

I understand, thank you for clarifying my misunderstanding. I was under the impression I would want levels to drop to as close as possible to pre cycle levels.

Again I am incredibly grateful for your help.

24 days it is :)
 
GReaver said:
I understand, thank you for clarifying my misunderstanding. I was under the impression I would want levels to drop to as close as possible to pre cycle levels.

Again I am incredibly grateful for your help.

24 days it is :)
Click to expand...

How goes it with your pct bro?
 
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