tb 500 for woman with osteoarthritis

[Mrs Sporty]

As the title says, this will be a log about tb 500 on a woman with osteoarthtitis (knee), which happens to be me. I'm not sponsored by anyone or something like that. So I will tell straight away what I experience and will hold nothing back. Did not find too many logs from females about tb 500. I appreciate comments, questions and experiences.

Stats: Female, 33 yo, 168 cm, 63 kg
Weights: deadlift: about own bw 5 reps, bench about 35 kg 12-15 reps, squats: not to speak of, barbell row: 40 kg 5 reps
Currently 1-2 times/week lifting, 1 time swimming, 1 time other stuff or nothing, depending on scedule and joints. Apart from that as much prehab and 30 min light cycling per day as I can manage.

Sports: Lifting since about 10 years, also several years of rock climbing and mountaineering, additionally cycling, swimming, jogging (not any more, because of my knee issue, see below), some martial art (also quit this one)

Injury: I have osteoarthritis (grade 3) of the knee cap right, beginning cartilage defect in trochlea grove. This is due to a totally gross dysplasia of knee cap and grove as well as luxation with cartilage damage in teens, had one scope at age 17. Also passive knee cap instability, chronic subluxation of both knee caps, means gross maltracking, due to dysplasia.

I was symptom free most times. The whole shit startet about one year ago. The arthritis became active and I was not symptom free since then.

I do not expect miracles. I mainly hope to bring down the inflammation and to keep it away for some time after ending the tb 500. With the arthritis comes a whole bunch of tendinitis and burisitis, that I would like to heal. I would like to strength my quads, specially the precious vastus medialis more, which is hard right now, because it aggrevates my knee seriously.

Apart from that I***8217;m still healing from a tenditinis in my foot of the affected limb, because of messed up gait pattern that I sometimes have (plus new shoes). The hip and knee of the contralateral side is also not to happy.

Apart from that I have some minor small ailments in my shoulders, elbows, wrists. Had real bad shoulders some month ago. The last few weeks I increased weights up to my personal max and it was surprisingly okay. No bad feeling at all. Until I did hindu pushups lately and felt some ugly tearing thing that I felt already a few times in my left shoulder. It started to hurt, but has decreased 90 % within one day. Have to keep my eyes open. The other shoulder might by just an recurring impigment, though it would be cool to heal it, since I don***8217;t want to waste my precious rotator cuff over the years.

Okay, aging is not for sissies, I realize lately.



Current training and symptom status:
Running, any leg training that bends my knees under load, lots of walking (like several hours) makes the knee warm and red in the evening and might cause discomport, slight pain and pressure during the day. That means I hve red knees most evenings, cause I walk a lot at work.

Swimming 2 km is usually not causing inflammation, but makes my soft tissue hurt. Swimming a lot doesn***8217;t make my shoulders happy.

Today I did 100 bw squats, which I was not doing for more than a year and surprisingly my knee is still cold, as it should be. Hindu pushups gave me scary tear feeling and little pain afterwards (okay I will give up on that).

I will see how things develop from this point onwards. I already received the peptides. It was no problem to ship them from the US to the EU in a few days but the needles and stuff which I ordered at the same time from a local store have been delivered the wrong way. I hope I can get that tomorrow and start right away.


I will use 2 mg/week for 4-6 weeks, depending on the progress I see. After that 3-4 month maintenance 2mg/month.

 

[Mrs Sporty]

I have read some research papers about thymosin beta 4. As most might know it is already in clinical trails for ulvers, myocardial infacrtion, eye problems, diabetes. In some trails doses where givven that would not reached in a lifetime, if one would stay on maintanance forever. I will not say that this is advisable. I jut want to say, on average people take about 20 mg over the course of the cycle, so will I. In the trails they sometimes give 1200 mg in one shot with no sideeffects. Long term sie effects are a different thing, but obviously in theory they don't expect much.

Something are also seem to by unclear. While some researchers claim thymosin beta 4 is more prevalent in aggressive tumors and aggressive joint inflammation (in the synovia), others say it might be able to cure the exact same things. The anders might be if the thymosin is intra- or extracellular, if it is oxidized or not. If someone has more information, I would be happy to learn.

Also I found thesis and patent registration, where it was said thymosin might not only have posiive effect on inflammed synovia and tendons, but also on the cartilage itself an cellular basis, which makes it a potential drug for various kinds of arthritis, which is my topic. They speek about injecting it into the joint, okay. Still, maybe something reaches my cartilage anyway and protects a bit, while buolding my quards and stability.

 

[riprockwell]

First off, thanks for logging this for us. I have been curious to know about how it works for women as well as the dosing. I personally haven't tried it but I recently gave some to a friend of mine. He is 57 years old, has a torn minicus on the right leg. He couldn't walk without his knee popping. He has spent thousands of dollars and his doc suggested a knee replacement. He was very very skeptical of TB500 but fast forward 6 weeks now and this guy is squatting, leg pressing, and now running. He is a huge believer of it. Additionally, he had a messed up rotator cuff from baseball and his shoulder has felt better than ever. He is a huge believer of it and so am I. He told me that his knee hasn't felt this good in his lifetime. He has no pain and says he is at 90%. This stuff is nothing short of amazing. I have since suggested it to 3 other people and again, all of them are doing great on it and see noticeable differences. I consider it the holy grail of healing. I look forward to your log to see how well you do. Just wanted to chime in.

Note: I know our Mod Jimi has a great log on TB500 as well.

 

[Mrs Sporty]

Thank for your encouragment, riprockwell. Well the story of your friend sounds like a mirracle. I wish a mirracle would happen to my knee as well. (; Nevertheless I'm realistic. I have deformed kneecaps and trochlea groves, it's a birth defect. I need to be gratefull anyway. Most people with such a bad dysplasia like I have, have far more problems. They have pain from childhood on and instability, can't even walk without dislocating.
I might have also gone down this route, but then startet weight training, squatting, deads and stuff. I never could use heavy weights, I think my best back squat was about 50 kg, 8 reps, but I have mastered all those variations and still can do them. front squat, overhead squat, all ATG. That keeps my knees together. I was mountaineering, trekking heavily, no problem until last year.

Said this, I think tb 500 also can't repair damage structure. At best it brings out inflammaion and helps to heal and scar the injury good enough, so that it is stable again and can take some strain. After all the degradation of all structures is a natural process.

I have never used any other compound, so the effects I will experience will be 100% tb 500. Heck, I did not even used specific supplements as of late. I just startet BCAA after workout. It really helps in recovery, which is slowing down with age. It makes my muslces less sore and so it is better than glucosamin and chondroitin. I used both the last month, but stopped it now, cause I saw no improvment at all from that. It just cost me money and gave me gastric problems. In fact BCAA are helping my knees better, because they keep the muscles more smooth. Okay here an there I have some magnesia pill, also to keep muscles smooth. That's it.


My goal appart from healing as good as I can is to improve my cardio ability with it. In the past I build up to 100km tours on my bike by midseason. Although strolling around on my bike makes my knee feel nice, I think even 50 km will aggravate it right now. And when it comes to cardio nothing is as much fun and as effective as biking.
Swimming keeps me fit and burns calories a lot, but there is always the swimmers paradoxon. You burn so much calories, still swimmers always struggle with there body fat percentage. Due to cold water or whatever reason one eats more or I don't now, even elite swimmers, especially females struggle with it. Swimming is exellent conditioning, cardio and muscular endurance, speed endurance, but it is nothing worth loosing fat.
And I would like to loose 3-4 kg, would be better for my knees and for my figure, but it's damn hard without the right cardio or me. I try to keep my diet clean, but well it's hard, I admit that.


Sure, I have read Jimis logand many other logs. I have read lots of research papers. I just have done my research very carefully, before I decided to do that. I never thought I would use such substances and I still have a lot of doubts and anxieties, but I ran out of options.

Comparing rationally, the next step for my knee would be cortison into the joint, some docs still do it, I think it's middle ages. It's really bad for any joint or tendons, just weakens them. The other option would be a scope and a wash out, but that also comes with major sides. It is questionable if I then will be really better of than I'm now, because of the cartilage defect. Also I have (had on ast MRI) osteolysis on my knee cap, due to high pressure on the bone, because missing cartilage. So there is a significant chance that my knee cap will break during a scope. The bone defect might have healed a bit the last year, still a scope is my last resort, because it only brings me closer to partial replacement.

And IF it has to be scoped anyway in the near future the tb 500 will hopefully give me a favorable starting position to heal.


As for my shoulder, I'm just stuppid. Now my front shoulder and piceps tendon hurts a little from yesterdays hindu pushup. I had that in the past and it took me month to heal it, although it never was too bad, but was not 100% either. I had to cut down pushing and up pulling a bit to do something good for both of my shoulders.
Way did I do the damn hindu push up? That's just nothing my shoulders can take. I reduced bench pressing, did more dips, that always felt easier on my shoulders. Now that, damn. Will I ever learn?

So bottom line, I will not increase training intensity or volume for now, since my focus lies on healing.



Oh yes it scares me a bit to inject something that comes from dubious source (means not approved, not from pharmacy) and is not researched very well. Still, lot of stuff is approved and docs would do it to me like cortison shots or taking ibuprofine on a daily basis. So this is approved, but definately harmfull and should be no option for young OA sufferers. If I would be 70 already, I would not mind to destroy my liver and kidneys with pain medication, at that age I would not worry about what is in 20 years (although my grandma nearly lived up to 100). At my age it is inacceptable to do such things. So it might be a mental thing.

 

[Mrs Sporty]

Dosing and potential side effects for women:
My consideration is, I want to strike a balance between best effect and low/now potential side effect long term. After what I have read in clinical trails there should be really no side effects short term. I worry more about long term. Various nasty things like colon cancer and kidney failure at young age (the latter induced with heavy steroid abuse) run in my family.

I had my bloodwork done recently, also had abdominal ultrasound and CT scan. I will have coloscopy within the next month or at least year, as well as gynaecological inspection. Okay this may be weird for you guys, but I really want to log that for women and they need to consider all that: In many woman conditions like uterus myomatosus and endometriosis is present. I also have my share with it. It is nothing to worry about for most woman. It only causes undue pain in a few and causes infetility in a few. But it CAN cause that and that has to be watched, if one is taking stuff that enhances cell proliferation, at least in theory.
Thymosin beta 4 was found in endometrial hyperplasia. So, although it does not interfere with any hormons, which is good for woman, who still may want to have kids, it might be able to interfere in other ways.

In clinical trails they exclude pregnant woman, but at least they do not exclude woman of child bearing potential. If they would, I would have not decided for it. Also they exclude people with known history of cancer as wel as people over 40, who did not had coloscopy lately. This is, because colon cancer rarely starts growing befor the age of 40. The hight of diagnosis is about age 55, at that time it was already present in the body for about 10 years. Colon cancer grows super slow, but remains unsymptomatic for too long. If there are symptoms already it is mostly too late. That's way coloscopy is very effective.


Actually if that would not be a potential problems, I would go for a higher dose, because I think my knee, which is inflammed for half a year now needs a good dose. Anyway, I decided for 2 mg/week at first, 4-6 weeks, maybe longer, if I think that's necissary. This dose anyway is higher for me as a woman of average seize, compared to a heavy guy, who is running that dose.

 

[Mrs Sporty]

Okay, I did my first injection today and have to say, it was hard work or I have to learn, dunno. Was my first time ever.

I think, I only used 1-2 mL to recon, don't know exactly, because I have 5 mL vials with sterile water, but not more that 1/4 was used. And then I thought, damn, that is a lot. The pin itself was okay, but pushing the liquid into me was stinging like hell first. I thought all that into one spot? Never! So I used several spots, also needed 2-3 tries to get everything out of the vial, but finally managed.
It took me one hour to get it done and 7 syringes. I think it is not supposed to be like that. But as I said, I needed several tries to get everything out of the vial and several pins, so I was concerned with hygiene and used various syringes. Some pins are a little reddish, others are not. Guess depending how hard I pushed the plunger or how deep or not deep I got.

Other than that the stinging subsided immediately after I was finished with that shot. Therefore I feel a little dizziness in my head, like a small headache. Have read that in another peptide forum from other people as well. They experienced some ill feeling after the injection.

Okay, first I planned to do side injection to my vastus medialis or shoulder, when everything goes straight on my belly. Now I don***8217;t think I will do that. It will go everthing to my belly. At least there is enough fat. I don***8217;t think there is enough tissue over the said spots, at least not for my taste.

That***8217;s it, will wait for effects.

 

[Mrs Sporty]

Does it work? Yes. Does it has side effects? Yes. I can say that after just one injection and one day after that injection.

Good news first. This morning I woke up and my knee felt just normal, it felt right. Just normal, which is a quantum leap for me. It has not felt normal since more than one year. I would say it is because if the tb 500, because even after several days of resting and trying this and that, I always have the problem, that it feels somewhat stiff in the morning or after sitting for a longer time. Even yesterday in the evening it felt better than normal. No heating up, not redness. Two days ago I thought wow, it is healing finally, did 100 bw squats and no problems. Than I realized, I had taken ibuprofine the day before. Okay, this is still good for me, that the ibuprofine bringt it down for 2 days, but.. next day I did nothing at all, just sitting at the desktop and it became warm again. Yesterday I was cycling a bit a walking lots of stairs and it did not get warm, I did not even felt warming from inside, when I was up. Onl in my warm bet, I might have felt a slight warming from inside, which is the first stage, but definitely no redness and heat noticeable from outside. Also shoulder did fine. Suddenly the slight sting was not there anymore. Normally it does not go away that fast.

Now not so good and bad thing:
Side effects that I definitely attribute to the tb 500: Headache starting half an hour after first injection, ceasing about 3-4 hours later. Then this morning I woke up and my eyelids felt like glued to my eyeballs. No yoke, I needed my fingers to open my eyes. There was no secrete or whatsoever and I can move my eyes and eyelids freely, but a strange feeling remained, getting better now, over the day, but is still present. Hard to describe that feeling. I wonder now one in the bb community has written about that. I have read around in the hair grow community (after I experienced that) ad there others seem to have the same. Thy described it as having lots of sleep in the eyes, despite having slept well and not being tired. For me I would say it felt rough and dry.

But what bothers me seriously is this:
Yesterday in the evening I got a dull pain in my lower back region. I got alarmed, I have to say, I might have a slight phobia regarding health from time to time. So I knew that might be an issue. I was concerned about my kidneys, although I knew, 1. The kidneys are not that low, they are higher up and I had that exact same pain already twice in my life, one time like 10 years ago, the other time 1 year ago. Everytime I got lots of exams (Ultrasound, CT scan, blood, urin), but nothing was found. Anyway I did an urin stick test myself and I found leukocytes, but nothing else. No blood, protein, nitrit. What does that mean? From nearly nothing to acute kidney failure it can mean everthing. Obviously the presents of leukocytes means inflammation. Leucos in female can also come from the outher source, so I did it again, paying attention to clean everything. Again leucos. So I got a super bad panic attack about the whole thing, but tried to sleep. This morning I did again, paying even more attention not to contaminate the sample. This morning everything seems okay, maybe slight protein, but most likely not.
I will test again, but need to buy new sticks.
So although the most likely explanation is that I was going totally crazy, because also when the panic sets in, of cause truckloads of stress hormons are released, making my heart hammer and making me run to the toilet constantly.

Although there might be an psychosomatic factor, there remains the fact that there where leucocytes in my urin, that definitely don***8217;t belong there. That again might be related to the injection or not. But I must take notice, that it was there and the pain is still there.

I realize the pain can be really back pain, weird, but might be. I walk and stay a lot normally and that never gives me backpain. Now I was sitting for some time long hours and I remember the last time I had that and freaked out it was the same situation, means sitting log time, exam stress. I work full time and am back at university and exams just stress me out, because often I can***8217;t visit the lectures, because of my job, so I have to learn everything by myself.

Well, I have learned something more about me and about how I want live.

Might be, I don***8217;t do a second injection, but I have at least one week time to decide that. It***8217;s a shame, because I really think that can help a great deal and could be a solution to my problem for now. Best would be a doctor who controls everything AND to have the powder tested or have a good source, to really play it safe. I mean it is not only the thymosin. We must face it, we never know exactly which other crap is in there, that can be harmfull.

 

[Mrs Sporty]

So I wondered, why I get result so quickly, when everyone says it takes 3-4 weeks?
Well the hair grow and tanning guys also seem to have more immediate results, using tb 500. Maybe, when one is using steroids already or growth hormone stuff the tb 500 is not making such an impact and other sides are present too.

Well, it is weird to no ends. Normally my wrist make a clicking sound, when I rotate my lower arms fast or make a fist fast. I think my arms and hands, just had to take a lot during the years of rock climbing. Not so right now. Only in one hand, when I make a fist, I feel the old tendons snapping against each other, but not as hard as normally.
My knee feels super great. Surely not ready to take a run or deadlift (or I have to pay the prize). But it doesn***8217;t feel like the joint capsule is to tight, which I have nearly everyday for ages. I stretch quads several times a day, so make the capsule more loose, but that never lasts. Today it is not feeling tight, not even with bending.
Even ibuprofen, although taking away pain and inflammation could never take away stiffness and feelings of tightness and pressure. It would just be so great, real great to get that safely.

 

[Mrs Sporty]

It's now one week.
Yes I think it does it's charm. My knee is better than it was in month. Today I had a hard swim training and my knee feels good. Shoulders feel better than normally after swimming, although not perfect. Slight pain in right shoulder. Last gym training I dod leg extension, to work my quads and normally it is poison to me knees. This time only my bad knee was getting little warm in the evening, very slightly and that's it.

Downside is, the first 2-3 days after injection I felt ill and weak. I had elevated heartbeat and breath, headache, dizziness, I just felt weak. About 48 hours after injection I got higher temperatur than normal, about 37,4 degree. Those side effects really concern me. Not to speak of the weird pain in the kidney area and the leucozytes.

If I continue, I would need to pin today or tommorrow. I have not decided yet.

 

[Combat Pillow]

Following this. Thank for the info and keep us updated. I have TB500 in the way for my rat and potentially a few other relative rats that have injuries also.

 

[juced_porkchop]

awesome log, how is it going now?

I am very interested to hear your feed back!

 

[riprockwell]

Bump. Just curious how this run went??

 

[budgismuggler]

@ Mrs Sporty, thanks for the research info. Im about to begin some TB4 research too using your dosage as a guide so Im looking forward to hearing the next episode on this one.