The truth about the medical profession.

Baldur2630

New member
First of all, you can't blame the doctors. Some of them actually mean well, but the rot starts in med school.

Let's look at the process to see why doctors aren't treating low testosterone and other hormonal imbalances in both men and women correctly.

1. To be a doctor, you need to attend med school. Every year, hundreds of doctors are released into the world. In med school they are brainwashed to ignore hormones and many other things and they are taught that STEROIDS ARE BAD, BAD, BAD.
2. Once the doctor is released to the public, he has to be able to make a living. To make a living he needs sick people. So without him realizing it, it is in the interest of the medical profession in general,not keep people sick enough to need to visit their doctors.
3. Now we have to pharmaceutical companies. They churn out hundreds of medicines daily. Most of them have horrific side effects. They have to sell this shit, and to do so, you need sick people and doctors to peddle your shit.
4. Finally we have the pharmacies. They need sick people on medication to keep them in business.

So what we have is a Hamster wheel. To keep it turning, you need to keep churning out doctors and medicines. To do this, we have plastics that lower testosterone, estrogens from "the Pill" that gets into the water table, and above all, we need to keep them unhealthy in any way possible. So never prescribe things t
Like testosterone,, HGH or any natural medication which actually makes people healthy.

Imagine a world, where tomorrow morning, HGH, Testosterone, and other hormones and steroids get automatically prescribed (at low prices) to people as they get older. Imagine if say, 80% of the population in the world or even in America or Europe, never got sick.

Heaven forbid. If this ever happened, the hamster would die. Med schools would start closing, corrupt learned professors out of a job. Pharma conglomerates would have to close, millionaires from peddling drugs would be out of cash cows to milk, millions of people out of work, pharmacies would start closing down throwing millions more out of work.

Bottom line, don't be surprised that your doctor is an arsehole. That's what he was trained to be. Keep drinking the pills and let your testosterone drop to medically accepted levels, get obese, depressed, unstable, get Alzheimer's, dementia, keep swallowing your medicines and make sure the hamster wheel keeps spinning.
 
Actually, testosterone doesn't get a bad rap in medical school. It's that much has been misunderstood about how it impacts us in general, and doctors have to err on the side of caution as insurance costs them a fortune. Too many lawsuits from improper care (even if with good intentions) will end their career, and put that 8 years of education to waste.

I do agree that there is a very blatant (and sometimes obvious) intent to keep people on drugs, but I don't think that is necessarily something that starts at the doctor. Pharmaceutical companies however DO have a great deal to gain, which combined with a lack of ethics, brings misinformation to the table. Some of the most prescribed medicines are unnecessary, but whom is a doctor going to listen to; the peer reviewed study silently funded by big pharma, or the trials in universities that claim the opposite?

We could go round and round about conspiracy theories regarding our hormonal poisoning, but I've got work to do lol. :wiggle:

Edit: I'm NOT saying there aren't greedy or shit-terrible doctors out there, just that I think the problem stems from societies misunderstanding of AAS, and corporate greed.
 
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Imagine a world, where tomorrow morning, HGH, Testosterone, and other hormones and steroids get automatically prescribed (at low prices) to people as they get older. Imagine if say, 80% of the population in the world or even in America or Europe, never got sick.

And how would older people being prescribed these prevent them from ever getting sick?
 
Ok, low T leads to obesity, constant lethargy, depression, loss of libido, erectile dysfunction and the list goes on.

Look at the older people in the street, most of them look tired and overweight, obesity is a huge problem, so is depression, sleeplessness and the list goes on.

As we get older, our IGF-1 levels drop, and this also gives rise to things like osteoporosis, joint, muscle and tendon problems.

When I started on HGH, I was on TRT, had been for a while, but libido was poor and erections difficult and flaccid after a few minutes, I had a torn meniscus in my knee, shoulder impingement, and poor sleep. I was out of breath after even walking fast. Since I started HGH (NO, not the much vaunted pharma grade - I'm a pensioner - cheap CP Somatropin and now also on Gray Top) my shoulder is fixed, my knee is fixed, I think of sex all the time, I'm as fit as a fiddle and at 74 I can Bench 275 lbs.

If people started on HGH when they hit 40 and they checked Free Testosterone in men AND women and put them on necessary hormone replacement BEFORE they got sick, obese, depressed, lethargic, etc., there would be millions LESS people for the medical profession to milk.
 
Ok, low T leads to obesity, constant lethargy, depression, loss of libido, erectile dysfunction and the list goes on.

Look at the older people in the street, most of them look tired and overweight, obesity is a huge problem, so is depression, sleeplessness and the list goes on.

As we get older, our IGF-1 levels drop, and this also gives rise to things like osteoporosis, joint, muscle and tendon problems.

When I started on HGH, I was on TRT, had been for a while, but libido was poor and erections difficult and flaccid after a few minutes, I had a torn meniscus in my knee, shoulder impingement, and poor sleep. I was out of breath after even walking fast. Since I started HGH (NO, not the much vaunted pharma grade - I'm a pensioner - cheap CP Somatropin and now also on Gray Top) my shoulder is fixed, my knee is fixed, I think of sex all the time, I'm as fit as a fiddle and at 74 I can Bench 275 lbs.

If people started on HGH when they hit 40 and they checked Free Testosterone in men AND women and put them on necessary hormone replacement BEFORE they got sick, obese, depressed, lethargic, etc., there would be millions LESS people for the medical profession to milk.

Can I see the studies you are basing this on? Or is it all conjecture and anecdotal personal experience?
 
Out of curiosity, what's your HGH dosing look like OP? Being fit at 72 is no small feat, and it's pretty common knowledge that the folks with money/fame have been on GH for years.

The only worry that I have is that HGH will accelerate growth of tumors. As up to 80% of all men (or something very close to that, Google will give the actual value) suffer from prostate cancer by 80 years old, I'd be concerned that it could speed up the process of metastasis. I've done next to no research on this, but your age and the topic had me thinking in that direction.
 
Try using Google to look for effects of low testosterone. Go to the PeakTestosterone site, ignore the horror stories about the effects of injecting steroids into mice and look at the experiences myself and thousand like me have made.

Likewise Google for non medical propaganda about HGH. There is a story on the web about a woman who was on constant dialysis for kidney failure. A doctor started injecting her with HGH. A month later she was off the constant dialysis and back home. The doctor continued the treatment, but he got caught and instead of giving him a medal for trying to cure the woman, they sent him to prison!

Taking HGH is like being born again. It fixed all my problems and it is doing so for many others. Have a look at Meet Ellis Toussier: The Amazing Cognate Poet, AND The Amazing Dirty Old Man WHO DOES NOT GROW OLDER.

No one is forcing you to do anything. It's YOUR choice. If you want to grow old, suffer from all the symptoms of old age, stop sex, get fat and get dementia, you can at least say "I did it my way".

I choose NOT to do that. I did my research. You don't have to do. I'm 74, still having plenty of sex, feel great, don't get sick and getting stronger and fitter every month. My grandfather made 99. I intend to beat him and if I die in bed coupled with a woman, I'll at least die happy.
 
Hi Halfwit. First, I'm 74 not 72, I pin 1 IU daily. If I had money/ fame, I would be on 2 IU per day. Most people spend money every day on smokes, booze or sweets (candies for the other side of the pond). My one IU daily costs me 2 Euros per day. I bet you spend more than that daily on junk.

I see you have been reading the bullshit that is written by the medical profession regarding the horrors of HGH an testosterone and the studies done with acromegaly in rats after massive doses of (just about everything that works) HGH.

People who take massive doses of anything deserve all that they get. I have zero sympathy. I don't go to the gym and bust my gut benching more and more every week to look good I do it because I enjoy feeling good and watching the faces of younger guys that can't bench anywhere near my 125 kgs and refusing flatly to believe how old I am.

I'll take my chances, I don't believe a word that is written in the so-called 'studies'. Studies are only a means to get more money in grants and to make sure that people keep the cash registers of the medical profession, the pharmaceutical companies and the pharmacies ringing merrily.
 
Halfwit, I quote this from a DOCTOR (probably not s well brainwashed as he should have been, regarding prostate cancer as a result of HGH : -

Correlation of IGF-1 and Prostate Cancer
A good study has shown that a large number of elderly male patients taking HGH over a long time had no increase in prostate cancer.

That rumor got started when it was reported that elderly men with the lowest quintile of IGF- (lowest fifth of HGH) had less cancer than men with the highest 20% (highest fifth). There was no linear correlation of IGF-1 and prostate cancer in the study. They only reported less cancer in the most deficient of an elderly population.

What that report did not point out was that the lowest fifth were so deficient that all tissues of the body were inhibited in growth, healing and maintenance-- healthy as well as cancerous. It is quite a different thing to state that deficiency of essential hormones slows the growth of cancer (and everything else including a healthy body) and, on the other hand, trying to prove that hormones cause cancer. Life and health cannot progress without hormones. Cancer cannot progress without a living body to support its growth. It is quite predictable that if old people are dying from end stage deficiencies, they might have less cancer.

If all of the facts were reported, it is my opinion that the most senile and debilitated of the group would also have been those in the lowest 20% of IGF-1. But that data was not presented.

If HGH is only replaced to an average level present in the body for 30 years, from age 20 to age 50, and if it was safe during that 30 year period, and if it was essential to health during those 30 years, what is the harm in replacing it after age 50 when it becomes deficient? If it's dangerous, why does it not cause problems in the earlier 30 years when it is normally present in the same levels or higher from pituitary production? (Note: Excessively high doses of hormones can be harmful, I am referring here only to normal replacement doses).

E M CRANTON, MD
 
Try using Google to look for effects of low testosterone. Go to the PeakTestosterone site, ignore the horror stories about the effects of injecting steroids into mice and look at the experiences myself and thousand like me have made.

Likewise Google for non medical propaganda about HGH. There is a story on the web about a woman who was on constant dialysis for kidney failure. A doctor started injecting her with HGH. A month later she was off the constant dialysis and back home. The doctor continued the treatment, but he got caught and instead of giving him a medal for trying to cure the woman, they sent him to prison!

Taking HGH is like being born again. It fixed all my problems and it is doing so for many others. Have a look at Meet Ellis Toussier: The Amazing Cognate Poet, AND The Amazing Dirty Old Man WHO DOES NOT GROW OLDER.

No one is forcing you to do anything. It's YOUR choice. If you want to grow old, suffer from all the symptoms of old age, stop sex, get fat and get dementia, you can at least say "I did it my way".

I choose NOT to do that. I did my research. You don't have to do. I'm 74, still having plenty of sex, feel great, don't get sick and getting stronger and fitter every month. My grandfather made 99. I intend to beat him and if I die in bed coupled with a woman, I'll at least die happy.

How about medical studies that you researched? I am more interested in that than anecdotal evidence.

And how do you know that it is the HGH that is causing your changes and not the fact that you increased your testosterone dosage, changed pinning frequencies and started managing estradiol?
 
How about medical studies that you researched? I am more interested in that than anecdotal evidence.

And how do you know that it is the HGH that is causing your changes and not the fact that you increased your testosterone dosage, changed pinning frequencies and started managing estradiol?

I'm not sure how many times I have to say this or if I need to use a different language or what, to convince you that I REGARD SO-CALLED MEDICAL STUDIES WITh COMPLETE CONTEMPT!

What you are trying to say is that if 10,000 people with a medical problem take Preparation X, without the help of a 'doctor' and they are all cured and 10 "Medical Studies" by 'Learned Professors" in "Halls of Learning", say that Preparation X is dangerous and worthless and should be avoided at all costs, you would ignore the so-called anecdotal evidence in favour of the 'Medical Studies".

Let me make this quite clear once and for all. YOU can believe anything that you want. You can die of whatever; years before your time. Its YOUR business, not mine. I really don't give a s**t what you believe, it's YOUR problem.

I share my experiences with others in the hope that it may help and inspire them. When you hit 74 without the help of rHGH or anything else that the 'Medical Studies" say are bad, and you can still Bench 125 kgs, you have a full head of thick, BROWN hair, past your shoulders and you can still have sex almost every night, THEN and only then will I even think about what you are saying now.

FYI - On 1 December 2014, My IGF-1 was 102 and I was told that this was 'normal for my age'.
On 12 March 2015, my IGF-1 was 281. Same lab, tests taken at same time of day on empty stomach. So after taking 2 IU daily for a month and over two months on 1 IU daily, the fact my IGF-1 had gone up, on YOUR book it wasn't due to the rHGH. What did push it up then, the tooth fairy? My so-called 'doctor' now tells me that my IGF-1 is very high for someone of my age and perhaps I should change my diet.

On 1 December 2014 my Total Testosterone was 492 and Free Testosterone - >1
On 12 March 2015, my Total Testosterone was 1021 and Free Testosterone 12

I will let you have the latest results when I get them, not that these will help you. Some people have a mindset which refuses to believe anything that they have already convinced themselves is false.

Once again, whilst I appreciate the help I got from this (and other) Forums when I started down this road, you can shout me down until you go blue in the face. I KNOW how my body has responded to what I am doing to it. I only change one thing at a time and I give it time to settle before changing it again. When I have a problem, I ask for advice. It doesn't follow that I always take that advice because 10 people often give me 11 different answers. What you CANNOT do is to convince me that something I KNOW is right, is actually wrong because some corrupt medical person is after more funding for some more of his moronic studies.

I note that you are a 'Moderator', without being rude, maybe you are somehow associated with the medical or pharma profession or maybe have a lot of shares in them?
 
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I'm not sure how many times I have to say this or if I need to use a different language or what, to convince you that I REGARD SO-CALLED MEDICAL STUDIES WITh COMPLETE CONTEMPT!

What you are trying to say is that if 10,000 people with a medical problem take Preparation X, without the help of a 'doctor' and they are all cured and 10 "Medical Studies" by 'Learned Professors" in "Halls of Learning", say that Preparation X is dangerous and worthless and should be avoided at all costs, you would ignore the so-called anecdotal evidence in favour of the 'Medical Studies".

Let me make this quite clear once and for all. YOU can believe anything that you want. You can die of whatever; years before your time. Its YOUR business, not mine. I really don't give a s**t what you believe, it's YOUR problem.

I share my experiences with others in the hope that it may help and inspire them. When you hit 74 without the help of rHGH or anything else that the 'Medical Studies" say are bad, and you can still Bench 125 kgs, you have a full head of thick, BROWN hair, past your shoulders and you can still have sex almost every night, THEN and only then will I even think about what you are saying now.

FYI - On 1 December 2014, My IGF-1 was 102 and I was told that this was 'normal for my age'.
On 12 March 2015, my IGF-1 was 281. Same lab, tests taken at same time of day on empty stomach. So after taking 2 IU daily for a month and over two months on 1 IU daily, the fact my IGF-1 had gone up, on YOUR book it wasn't due to the rHGH. What did push it up then, the tooth fairy? My so-called 'doctor' now tells me that my IGF-1 is very high for someone of my age and perhaps I should change my diet.

On 1 December 2014 my Total Testosterone was 492 and Free Testosterone - >1
On 12 March 2015, my Total Testosterone was 1021 and Free Testosterone 12

I will let you have the latest results when I get them, not that these will help you. Some people have a mindset which refuses to believe anything that they have already convinced themselves is false.

Once again, whilst I appreciate the help I got from this (and other) Forums when I started down this road, you can shout me down until you go blue in the face. I KNOW how my body has responded to what I am doing to it. I only change one thing at a time and I give it time to settle before changing it again. When I have a problem, I ask for advice. It doesn't follow that I always take that advice because 10 people often give me 11 different answers. What you CANNOT do is to convince me that something I KNOW is right, is actually wrong because some corrupt medical person is after more funding for some more of his moronic studies.

I note that you are a 'Moderator', without being rude, maybe you are somehow associated with the medical or pharma profession or maybe have a lot of shares in them?

While anecdotal info is useful and interesting -- and certainly has its place -- the guys here are generally more interested in science than bro-science.

What if I were to tell you -- as was previously mentioned to you -- that increasing testosterone levels through exogenous administration is proven to increase IGF-1 levels? Well guess what... it is. So since you only change one variable at a time can you tell us how much your Test dosage increase changed you IGF-1 by and how much the HGH changed your IGF-1 by? And how about you GH levels. Where are they coming in at before, with higher test dosage and then with HGH?

Here are some studies that will prove this too you if you can set your prejudices aside for a moment. You can search for more if you have further interest in the topic.

Testosterone administration increases insulin-like growth factor-I levels in normal men. - PubMed - NCBI

Testosterone increases insulin-like growth factor-1 and insulin-like growth factor-binding protein. - PubMed - NCBI


Disclosure: I only own broad market index funds. I do not own any individual shares in any company. Not am I compensated in any form by any company in the medical/drug industry. I am not compensated in any form for my posts here. I am a non-conpensated volunteer.
 
While anecdotal info is useful and interesting -- and certainly has its place -- the guys here are generally more interested in science than bro-science.

What if I were to tell you -- as was previously mentioned to you -- that increasing testosterone levels through exogenous administration is proven to increase IGF-1 levels? Well guess what... it is. So since you only change one variable at a time can you tell us how much your Test dosage increase changed you IGF-1 by and how much the HGH changed your IGF-1 by? And how about you GH levels. Where are they coming in at before, with higher test dosage and then with HGH?

Here are some studies that will prove this too you if you can set your prejudices aside for a moment. You can search for more if you have further interest in the topic.

Testosterone administration increases insulin-like growth factor-I levels in normal men. - PubMed - NCBI

Testosterone increases insulin-like growth factor-1 and insulin-like growth factor-binding protein. - PubMed - NCBI


Disclosure: I only own broad market index funds. I do not own any individual shares in any company. Not am I compensated in any form by any company in the medical/drug industry. I am not compensated in any form for my posts here. I am a non-conpensated volunteer.

Studies involving 11 (ELEVEN) people has no statistical significance whatsoever. Hypotheses do not make something true. FACTS make something true. I guess that this will get 'moderated' but here goes HGH: Growth Hormone Replacement Found Safe for Long Term Use The statistics are a hell of a lot more significant than ELEVEN subjects.
 
Studies involving 11 (ELEVEN) people has no statistical significance whatsoever. Hypotheses do not make something true. FACTS make something true. I guess that this will get 'moderated' but here goes HGH: Growth Hormone Replacement Found Safe for Long Term Use The statistics are a hell of a lot more significant than ELEVEN subjects.

I am not arguing over the benefits of good GH and Igf-1 numbers. I agree it is desirable. We all know both decrease with age (thanks to medical studies on the subject).

You are failing to understand that higher Total Testosterone levels are proven to increase IGF-1. You have boosted and adjusted your protocol for taking exogenous Testosterone.

P.S. I agree an 11 person study is not ideal mid-30's or more would have been better. But I will still take is over one guy's anecdotal reports.
 
Hhh
I am not arguing over the benefits of good GH and Igf-1 numbers. I agree it is desirable. We all know both decrease with age (thanks to medical studies on the subject).

You are failing to understand that higher Total Testosterone levels are proven to increase IGF-1. You have boosted and adjusted your protocol for taking exogenous Testosterone.

P.S. I agree an 11 person study is not ideal mid-30's or more would have been better. But I will still take is over one guy's anecdotal reports.
There is also a hypothesis that vigorous exercise, such as power lifting will also increase IGF-1, but you can't powerlift without FREE Testosterone. My protocol has been the same since my last bloodwork. I doubt it will interest you, but I'll put it on here anyway.

Work done in a laboratory is not done by "learned Professors" or institutions. Lab workers have ZERO interest in the politics of the medical hierarchy.
 
Hhh
There is also a hypothesis that vigorous exercise, such as power lifting will also increase IGF-1, but you can't powerlift without FREE Testosterone. My protocol has been the same since my last bloodwork. I doubt it will interest you, but I'll put it on here anyway.

Work done in a laboratory is not done by "learned Professors" or institutions. Lab workers have ZERO interest in the politics of the medical hierarchy.

You are on exogenous testosterone. I am aware of the vigorous exercise connection to higher IGF-1 levels but it is likely not applicable in your situation.

Again, we know about this connection because of medical studies.

[Relation between physical activity, muscle function and IGF-1, testosterone and DHEAS concentrations in the elderly]. - PubMed - NCBI

And this study to some degree.

Growth hormone, IGF-I, and testosterone responses to resistive exercise. - PubMed - NCBI
 
Baldur, If I may chime in here.... I take testosterone and my igf levels ARE higher.

Question you said you are taking gray tops correct? How do you know its even real??
 
You are on exogenous testosterone. I am aware of the vigorous exercise connection to higher IGF-1 levels but it is likely not applicable in your situation.

Again, we know about this connection because of medical studies.

[Relation between physical activity, muscle function and IGF-1, testosterone and DHEAS concentrations in the elderly]. - PubMed - NCBI

And this study to some degree.

Growth hormone, IGF-I, and testosterone responses to resistive exercise. - PubMed - NCBI

I am aware of the vigorous exercise connection to higher IGF-1 levels but it is likely not applicable in your situation.
And why pray would it NOT be applicable in my case?
 
Baldur, If I may chime in here.... I take testosterone and my igf levels ARE higher.

Question you said you are taking gray tops correct? How do you know its even real??

I'm still on the CP Somatropin. My wife is on the Gray Top and has been since it first appeeared. It has been tested on this and other Forums. How do we know it's real? It's the only thing that she takes. She is 55 years old, 5' 2" and weighs 74 kgs (163 lbs). She has been on this stuff since the day it came onto the market, She can bench 95 kgs (note NOT lbs) and Leg Press over 400 kgs, she can squat more than twice her bodyweight and her maximums just keep going up. as does her IGF-1.

What makes you think it isn't real? Oh, sorry, I should already know the answer - only pharma grade actually works, right?
 
I am aware of the vigorous exercise connection to higher IGF-1 levels but it is likely not applicable in your situation.
And why pray would it NOT be applicable in my case?

Your HPTA is shut down. You get all your testosterone from a bottle. You can lift all you want and it won't change that fact.
 
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