Considering a Test Cycle, constructive opinions wanted.

[glase212]

Hey all,

Been reading along this website for a long time, joined and made an account maybe a year back. Have done some posting but really a lot more reading and learning. Thanks to this forum I opted out of doing a PH cycle as my first go at it after reading and learning. Now I have been really trying to figure out what would be best as a first cycle of the real deal.

I have not yet got the gear as I know there are some ugls online (hard to take the plunge to trust these sources due to laws etc. etc) but I would go with Test E @ 250mg twice a week on a Mon/Thurs or Tues/Fri schedule for 12 weeks.

My Stats:

5'10 - 190lbs - 14-15%bf
Lifting since I was 13, now 26
Bench: 225x10, Squat: ~350, Dead: ~300 (used to be 405, dont train as hard on this exercise)

Diet is relatively on point: Lots of eggs/whites, nuts, chicken, green beans, clean carb foods etc.

The hard part I see is trying to figure out what Aromatase inhibitor (AI) to take during the cycle, so many opinions on what to do so it gets confusing on what is really correct info. Figured best way is to start my own thread. Also, many opinions on post cycle therapy (pct)s.

What I can say is that I am not interested in different substances to begin with, just Test no kickers. Would like to keep the cycle as simple as possible as this would be my first when/if I am able to start. So in regards to post cycle therapy (pct) I have been reading a lot that Clomid is the way to go, possibly a stack of DAA and HCGenerate to boot?

Any information to begin, hope to find a local source at some point of the other as I am in the Los Angeles area.

Thanks all!

 

[Metalhead]

You can take aromasin 12.5mg eod or arimidex .5mg eod. You can also take letro but im not too sure on doses for that one. Pct i would recommend clomid 50/50/50/50 and nolva 40/40/20/20. Hcgenerate would help also

 

[joe d]

your plan looks good. adex or aro for an Aromatase inhibitor (AI).

id run real Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) through the cycle or for a short blast pre post cycle therapy (pct) then do the clomid nolva.

 

[glase212]

I've seen a lot of the two you mentioned at those doses so it seems to be a safe bet on those. That definitely helps. So those compounds basically inhibit the aromatizing of estrogen is due to the testosterone, am I correct on that?

Also, why both on the clomid and nolva? Does each have their own real benefits that just running one would not? I had read people having issues with I believe it was nolva.

To the other reply. I really don't want to do real Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) during the cycle because I want to keep injections to a minimum with only the Test.

You can take aromasin 12.5mg eod or arimidex .5mg eod. You can also take letro but im not too sure on doses for that one. Pct i would recommend clomid 50/50/50/50 and nolva 40/40/20/20. Hcgenerate would help also

 

[trams31]

so your asking what Aromatase inhibitor (AI) and post cycle therapy (pct) to take? The test amount and duration is fine.

 

[trams31]

arimidex and clomid

 

[glase212]

Yes, that seems to be the difficult part when doing a cycle. Choosing the amount of Test and what type is easy, however finding/choosing a reliable source is not.

so your asking what Aromatase inhibitor (AI) and post cycle therapy (pct) to take? The test amount and duration is fine.

 

[Docd187]

I've seen a lot of the two you mentioned at those doses so it seems to be a safe bet on those. That definitely helps. So those compounds basically inhibit the aromatizing of estrogen is due to the testosterone, am I correct on that?

Also, why both on the clomid and nolva? Does each have their own real benefits that just running one would not? I had read people having issues with I believe it was nolva.

To the other reply. I really don't want to do real Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) during the cycle because I want to keep injections to a minimum with only the Test.

What metal said dude. There is SOME evidence pointing to a much shorter half-life of aromasin in men which would necessitate an ED dosing schedule but better to start off lit and adjust as needed depending on symptoms so 12.5mg EOD for aromasin is a great place to start. Aromatase inhibitor (AI) (Arimidex, aromasin, letrozole) stands for aromatose inhibitor. Basically it prevents the aromatization of testosterone into estrogen but does nothing to the receptors like a SERM would. Two different classes of drugs and two separate purposes.

As to your question about clomid and nolva, yes they do similar things but each works through a separate pathway so they're both necessary IMO (some ppl will argue this but they're argument isn't always valid). Nolva is a serm (selective estrogen-receptor modulator) meaning it blocks estrogen from bonding to the receptor, and it does this in breast tissue (prevents bitch tits). It doesn't lower serum estrogen levels it just prevents it from binding to the receptor. Many ppl will tell you to run nolva on cycle instead of an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) now you know why this is a bad idea. During cycle you want to lower estrogen not just stop it from binding. Nolva will not lower estrogen. Technically it's a mixed agonist/antagonist as "nolva is an antagonist of the estrogen receptor in breast tissue via its active metabolite, hydroxytamoxifen. In other tissues such as the endometrium, it behaves as an agonist, and thus may be characterized as a mixed agonist/antagonist"

Clomid is another serm but works differently which is why you need both. Clomid "is a selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM) that increases production of gonadotropins by inhibiting negative feedback on the hypothalamus or inhibits estrogen receptors in hypothalamus, inhibiting negative feedback of estrogen on gonadotropin release, leading to up-regulation of the hypothalamic–pituitary–adrenal axis." Clomid basically blocks estrogen receptors in the hypothalamus which will restart your HTPA through a negative feedback loop since you won't have high levels of estrogen in your hypothalamus telling it to stop endogenous production. Clomid also is used in males to treat hypogonadism so its another option to testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) and they're are several studies posted in some threads here about how clomid alone at 50mg/day can clinically and significantly raise serum test levels.

Both these drugs have their own list of side effects and interactions. It's best that you read up on this on your own to see if they interact with any medications you may be taking. Typically side effects show up in a very low percentage of users so don't base your decision to not use them or nolva on this fact alone. Use them then decide to stop if severe symptoms occur.

Ppl have different opinions on HCG. I am not using it on my cycle but know plenty ppl who do. It's one of those things you have to make your own informed decision on. It will lead to a speedier recovery, it will keep your testicles from shrinking, and I think it also helps with fertility but not positive. It also will shut you down though so discontinue use 4days prior to post cycle therapy (pct) if you get it. Hcgenerate is an OTC supplement version of this and while helpful, nowhere near as effective. Hope this helps man

 

[glase212]

Understandable and like your name says...are you a doctor? Very informative and unbiased information which is what I was looking for. Seems far to often people like to advertise rather than provide real world legitimate information.

This helps my decision on running nolva and clomid together. As Metal Head suggest: run clomid 50/50/50/50 and nolva 40/40/20/20. (Is this tandem to each other or is this 4 weeks of clomid then 4 weeks of nolva, I am assuming tandem and everyday dosages but can never be to sure which is why I ask. I will do more research on Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG), I believe that is injected subcutaneously every day and the dose would be daily alongside the whole cycle of test correct. And Thanks.

 

[Ryan117]

Yea you wanna run them together so clomid and Nova everyday for 4 weeks

 

[Docd187]

Understandable and like your name says...are you a doctor? Very informative and unbiased information which is what I was looking for. Seems far to often people like to advertise rather than provide real world legitimate information.

This helps my decision on running nolva and clomid together. As Metal Head suggest: run clomid 50/50/50/50 and nolva 40/40/20/20. (Is this tandem to each other or is this 4 weeks of clomid then 4 weeks of nolva, I am assuming tandem and everyday dosages but can never be to sure which is why I ask. I will do more research on Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG), I believe that is injected subcutaneously every day and the dose would be daily alongside the whole cycle of test correct. And Thanks.

No I am far from a doctor, I'm just an individual who reads and researches about topics he's interested in (which is what everyone should do with AAS). I'm not in the health or medical field in any way so take my words and advice as such. I can tell you I have doctors in my family and I've spent over a year reading and learning before I decided I was READY to do a cycle so I feel safe that I've covered my bases when it comes to my body but I'm still learning to this day about new things on here. If you spend anytime on here you should be able to figure out who the intelligent helpful ppl are (hint Metalhead being one of them (no homo metal haha)).

Clomid and nolva should be run together and you run increased risk of side effects, delayed recovery, and permanent HTPA shutdown should you decide to not run both. That dosing schedule is to be run in tandem or concurrently NOT consecutively. It's 50mg clomid everyday for 4wks and at the same time nolva 40mg/ every day for 2wks followed by 20mg/every day for 2wks.

HCG is a debated topic. Some run a cruise (low ~250iu 2x/wk dosage), some blast after the end of the cycle but before post cycle therapy (pct) (~500-1000iu/ED stopped 4days before start of post cycle therapy (pct)), and some do both while others don't use HCG. Research it and figure out what's best in your specific case is the best info I can give you.