cortisol control for those with post traumatic stress disorder

[israelbur]

Hello everybody!

My name is israel. I am a 22 year old veteran with PTSD and i have become interested in research regarding controlling cortisol levels as well as dopamine and seratonin levels. My assumption is that there will be several members here that are quite knowledgeable about managing cortisol levels at least because of its relation to building muscle and regulation of ones metabolism.

quotes from neurogistics.com/conditions/panicdisorder.asp

"While a stressful life event or chronically high stress levels can be major contributors, many psychological, lifestyle, genetic and nutritional factors can lead to this condition. Panic Disorder can become debilitating to one’s life, as fear of a panic attack coming on while driving, in public, at work, traveling, and so forth can heighten and amplify one’s anxiety, while hindering their ability to carry on as usual."

"The proper release of adrenaline is determined by the brain. The brain must be well balanced so that the Central Nervous System (CNS), and the body, peripheral nervous system (PNS), can communicate properly."


END OF QUOTES
My questions are as follows:#1what are the best methods from personal experience for regulating overall cortisol levels pertaining to diet, exercise, and supplementation? (I realize that working out at any time causes the body to raise cortisol production. i am interested in rest day management mostly because i wonder about the bodys natural response to exercise in terms of cortisol cycles)

question#2
what are some ways to manage seratonin levels in terms of diet, exercise, sleep patterns and tanning?(im intersted in the production of seratonin from exposure to sunlight should i get out in the sun every day and if im not able to should i use a tanning bed?)

question#3
how would you recommend dopamine management by diet, etc? also how do dopamine levels affect muscle building, nutrient metabolism fat burning, etc

i currently weigh 150lbs usually staying around 4-6% bodyfat and have a high strength/weight ratio

I am looking foward to your advice

 

[Buttman3]

Hello and welcome, Israel.

My questions are as follows:#1what are the best methods from personal experience for regulating overall cortisol levels pertaining to diet, exercise, and supplementation?

Whenever I experienced a lot of stress (problems at school, work, etc.), I noticed my muscle hardness and strength decreased noticeably and quickly within 24 hours. If the stress is prolonged for like a week, I always lose weight, I think lean muscle mass mostly, since I’m naturally very lean.

What I found to help control stress (cortisol) and counter its physical effects:

Diet: High carb.

1. Bread, pasta, potato, rice, etc.

I noticed a high carb diet counteracts the muscle shrinkage brought on by stress. This is straight from my experience with stressful episodes and weight lifting.

If you ever have a chance to read about cortisol in science texts, you will probably come across where they talk about cortisol causes the body to convert its own amino acid into glucose/sugar under stressful events to help fuel itself.

Therefore, logically, if we supply the body with extra glucose (by eating more carb) when we experience a lot of stress, then it would reduce the body’s needs to convert its own supply of amino acid (from muscle protein) and prevent muscle breakdown.

2. Frozen yogurt (sweetened and flavored), ice cream, chocolate, sweet deserts, etc.

Whereas high carb foods helped combat against the physical effects that stress had on my muscles, I found sweet tasting foods really helped me combated against the psychological effects of stress. They improved my mood.


Exercise:

I have heard some people say a running, jogging, etc. help reduce stress. I only do weight lifting, but I’m not sure if it helps.

Supplementation:

I’m not aware of any supplementation that actually helps. A word of caution: A vast majority of supplements sold at nutrition / vitamin stores, on tv ads, etc., are junks that only make the manufacturers rich. Even when it comes to muscle building, the most important things are real food, training, and rest. If you want to take it to another level, then it is anabolics (after lots of research and readings). But “muscle building” supplements at vitamin stores are a big waste of money.

Now, with all that said about diet, exercise, and supplementation, these might help a person control or manage stress brought on by normal daily events. I want to be realistic and point out that the kind of stress that you are experiencing -- as a result of PTSD, I'm assuming as the result of combat -- might be more than what diet, exercise, or supplementation can handle and help control.

(I realize that working out at any time causes the body to raise cortisol production. i am interested in rest day management mostly because i wonder about the bodys natural response to exercise in terms of cortisol cycles)

Due to the difference in people’s genetics, life styles, fitness level, age, and many other factors, everyone will have different recovery rate, stress level, etc. after a work out.
Therefore, the best advice I can give you is to pay close attention to how YOUR BODY responses after a workout. If you feel fine training for 2-3 days straight but feel drained and weak after the third day, then it means you should take the fourth day off and come back on the fifth day.

In my experience, there are no fixed rules, as in “train 3 days and take a day off” or anything like that. I make adjustments according to how my body feels. Sometimes, I train four or five day straight and take a day off. Sometimes, I feel super tired after the third day and know I have to take a break and get more rest and food.

Did I answer your question, mate?

(question#2
what are some ways to manage seratonin levels in terms of diet, exercise, sleep patterns and tanning?(im intersted in the production of seratonin from exposure to sunlight should i get out in the sun every day and if im not able to should i use a tanning bed?)

I’m not experienced in this area, so hopefully, someone else can help you answer this.

(question#3
how would you recommend dopamine management by diet, etc? also how do dopamine levels affect muscle building, nutrient metabolism fat burning, etc

No idea, mate. Sorry.

But as far as muscle building is concerned, I have never heard of anyone who uses it for this purpose, so I’m not sure.

I did a quick Google search, and from what I understand, Dopamine is a brain chemical that plays some roles in controlling movement. Lack of it can cause Parkinson’s disease (or its symptoms).

Something interesting I found on Wikipedia regarding Dopamine that I thought you might found interesting to read: (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dopamine#Effects_of_drugs_that_reduce_dopamine_activity)

In humans, drugs that reduce dopamine activity (neuroleptics, e.g. antipsychotics) have been shown to impair concentration, reduce motivation, cause anhedonia (inability to experience pleasure), and long-term use has been associated with tardive dyskinesia, an irreversible movement disorder.[36]

Antipsychotics have significant effects on gonadal hormones including significantly lower levels of estradiol and progesterone in women, whereas men display significantly lower levels of testosterone and DHEA when undergoing antipsychotic drug treatment compared to controls. Antipsychotics are known to cause hyperprolactinaemia leading to amenorrhea, cessation of normal cyclic ovarian function, loss of libido, occasional hirsutism, false positive pregnancy tests, and long-term risk of osteoporosis in women.

The effects of hyperprolactinemia in men are gynaecomastia, lactation, impotence, loss of libido, and hypospermatogenesis.[37] Furthermore, antipsychotic drugs are associated with weight gain, diabetes, drooling, dysphoria (abnormal depression and discontent), fatigue, sexual dysfunction, heart rhythm problems, stroke and heart attack.

Selective D2/D3 agonists pramipexole and ropinirole, used to treat restless legs syndrome (RLS), have limited anti-anhedonic properties as measured by the Snaith-Hamilton Pleasure Scale (SHAPS).

i currently weigh 150lbs usually staying around 4-6% bodyfat and have a high strength/weight ratio

I am looking foward to your advice

What’s your height?

If you’re around, say 5’9”, have a high metabolism (and it seems like you do, judging by your 4-6% bf), and want to gain 5-10lbs, then what I would recommend is increase your overall carb intake in addition to your protein, especially in your post-workout meals.

From my experience as a hard gainer, a high carb / moderate protein diet is much better for muscle building than a moderate carb / high protein meal. Eating real solid proteins from chicken and beef and lots of carb have helped me more than drinking protein shakes.

The timing of your meal is also very important and cannot be ignored.
The sooner you eat right after each workout, the better. Preferably, you should eat as soon as you get home from the gym.

Hope that helps.

Cheers mate.

 

[israelbur]

thank you for your reply

Again thank you I found your reply quite informative. You mentioned a process whereby cortisol plays a part in converting the body's own amino acids into glucose and your recommendation was to consume more carbs. my question regarding this is that rather than consuming more carbs than I already do(I have a modified paleo diet I consume a larger amount of carbs because of my necessity for a high caloric intake), I was wondering if there is possibly an ammino acid product out there i should look into(I use a beverly intl product at the moment). I ask because from the amount of carbs I eat at each meal I find my insulin spikes to the point that I usually become somewhat groggy. I am five feet seven inches tall, and i estimate that I am within 30-40 lbs of my ideal weight(I am more concerned with proportions) so I dont have a ridiculous amount of weight to gain working hard it will probably takes around 2 or three years hopefully sooner if I am able to manage cortisol levels.

 

[Buttman3]

Again thank you I found your reply quite informative. You mentioned a process whereby cortisol plays a part in converting the body's own amino acids into glucose and your recommendation was to consume more carbs. my question regarding this is that rather than consuming more carbs than I already do(I have a modified paleo diet I consume a larger amount of carbs because of my necessity for a high caloric intake), I was wondering if there is possibly an ammino acid product out there i should look into(I use a beverly intl product at the moment).

You're welcome mate.

This is a really good question!

First, I'm assuming that your goal here is to prevent muscle breakdown as the result of cortisol level. If this is your goal, then I have read that there is at least one amino acid that reduces muscle atrophy caused by cortisol: Glutamine!

If you want to try Glutamine, it comes pretty cheap in powder form. You can buy about 1 lb for around $20-25. Don't buy the pills. They're too expensive.

Here is a research article on this topic: Glutamine prevents downregulation of myosin hea... [Am J Physiol. 1995] - PubMed - NCBI

Here is an excerpt :

Title:
Glutamine prevents downregulation of myosin heavy chain synthesis and muscle atrophy from glucocorticoids.

"The aims of this study were to determine whether glutamine infusion prevents the decline in protein synthesis and muscle wasting associated with repeated glucocorticoid treatment. Hormone (cortisol acetate, 100 mg.kg body wt-1.day-1)...

In conclusion, these data show that glutamine infusion is effective therapy in counteracting glucocorticoid-induced muscle atrophy."

Note: Cortisol belongs to a group of glucocorticoid.

PS: If you do more research on Glutamine using Google, you will find several research articles regarding its use in speeding up wound healing after bowel surgeries.

I ask because from the amount of carbs I eat at each meal I find my insulin spikes to the point that I usually become somewhat groggy.

How much carb do you eat? If you know how to count carb, you can give it in grams. If not, then just give a simple description like "1/2 cup of mashed potato for lunch."

Also, you mentioned about insulin spikes - I think you mean blood sugar spikes. Anyway, different types of foods cause your blood sugar to rise at different rate. Some will cause a slow, small rise, whereas some cause a fast, steep rise.

I'm not sure if you heard of the glycemic index. It's basically a chart that gives a score certain foods on how they affect blood sugar: Glycemic index and glycemic load for 100+ foods - Harvard Health Publications

On a scale from 0-100, foods with high glycemic index (GI) scores, spike up blood sugar faster, and vice versa.

Spaghetti, for example, has a GI score of 47, which is relatively low.
Whole wheat bread, on the other hand, has a GI score of 71, which is moderate to high.

So if your goal is to limit your sugar spikes, spaghetti is the better choice than whole wheat bread.

I am five feet seven inches tall, and i estimate that I am within 30-40 lbs of my ideal weight(I am more concerned with proportions)

Is your ideal weight based on personal preference or is it based on the body-mass-index (BMI)? If it's based on the BMI, then you might want to know that the BMI system is outdated and pretty flawed, because it doesn't take into account body fat. Thus, person with low body fat and more muscle can weigh a lot a be labelled as "obese" .

so I dont have a ridiculous amount of weight to gain working hard it will probably takes around 2 or three years hopefully sooner if I am able to manage cortisol levels.

Are you trying to gain more lean mass, or you are happy with your current built?

Since you mentioned about proportion, if you don't mind and have a camera, why don't you take a picture of yourself and post it?

Cheers mate.

 

[israelbur]

Also, you mentioned about insulin spikes - I think you mean blood sugar spikes. Anyway, different types of foods cause your blood sugar to rise at different rate. Some will cause a slow, small rise, whereas some cause a fast, steep rise.

I see, and I stand corrected, Thank you.
My carb intake at each meal is usually around these amounts Breakfast: 1/2 cup hash browns, 1 large biscuit, an apple, 8 oz fruit juice(apple or cranberry) 1 slice of toast.(side note: I usually have 6 or 7 eggs and some turkey sausage)
Lunch: 1 baked potato, 2-4 slices of wheat bread, 1/4 tomato, 12 oz gatorade, 2/3 cup pasta, 1/4 cup rice(protein usually 3-4 chicken breast or similar amount beef)

Supper: about the same as lunch

I know my diet is somewhat atrocious but there isnt much I can do while on deployment(I am currently in Afghanistan)

My ideal proportions are based of of the ratio PHI (1.618) this is the ratio commonly used in sculpture such as Michaelangelos' statue "David" I apply this ratio to my skeletal structure to come up with goal measurements i.e. my hips measure out at 30 inches so 30"*PHI=48.58" an estimate of what my shoulder measurement should be. for other measurements use different areas of the body. for forearms the measurement of the wrist is multiplied by PHI; the upper arm the measurement of the elbow and so on.

I would like to stay around 4-6% bf so I need to gain a small amount of fat but mostly lean muscle.
I will see what iI can do about a picture

many thanks

 

[Buttman3]

I see, and I stand corrected, Thank you.
My carb intake at each meal is usually around these amounts Breakfast: 1/2 cup hash browns, 1 large biscuit, an apple, 8 oz fruit juice(apple or cranberry) 1 slice of toast.(side note: I usually have 6 or 7 eggs and some turkey sausage)

Using this food calculator (WebMD Food-O-Meter: Calorie Counter & Calculator for Over 37,000 Foods and Drinks), here is what it adds up to:

Breakfast
......................................................... Kcal .............. Fat .......... Carb .......... Protein
* 1/2 cup hash browns ........................... 235 ..............16g ........... 23g ................. 2g
* 1 large biscuit .............................. 138-281 .......... 6-13g ......... 3-5g ........... 19-37g
* 1 apple ................................................95 ............... 0g ........... 25g ................. 0g
* 8 oz fruit juice (apple or cranberry) ........ 125 ............... 0g ........... 31g ................. 0g
* 1 slice of toast.................................... 126 ............... 4g ........... 19g ................. 4g
* 6 or 7 eggs.................................. 540-630 ......... 42-49g ............. 0g ........... 36-42g
* some turkey sausage........................... 131 .............. 10g ............. 1g ................. 9g
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TOTAL ...................................... 1390-1623 ......... 78-92g .... 102-104g .......... 70-94g


Lunch / Supper
......................................................... Kcal .............. Fat .......... Carb .......... Protein
* 1 baked potato .................................278..................0g.............63g..................7g...
* 2-4 slices of wheat bread .............178-356................2-4g........34-68g.............6-12g...
* 1/4 tomato ..........................................5..................0g..............1g..................0g..
* 12 oz gatorade ...................................63..................0g.............16g..................0g..
* 2/3 cup pasta ...................................126..................2g.............26g..................5g..
* 1/4 cup rice .......................................42..................0g..............9g...................1g..
* 3-4 chicken breast ......................300-400................6-8g...........3-4g............ 60-80g..
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TOTAL ........................................ 992-1270 ......... 10-14g ... 152-187g .......... 79-105g


......................................................... Kcal .............. Fat .......... Carb .......... Protein
DAY TOTAL ...............................3607-4163.........112-120g......408-478g..........252-304g


Based on this Calorie Calculator (Calorie Calculator - Daily Caloric Needs), with exercise level at "daily + physical job", your daily maintenance caloric intake is approximately between 3,100 - 3,300 Kcal.

Based on how much you're eating (3607-4163 Kcal), it looks like you are above maintenance level and should be gaining weight. Of course, this calculator doesn't take into account your cortisol level, genetics, and the likes, so it's possible you could be just maintaining (or even losing a bit of weight).

I know my diet is somewhat atrocious but there isnt much I can do while on deployment(I am currently in Afghanistan)

I'm no diet guru, but based on the above, it looks like your diet is pretty decent, considering the fact that you're in military service and cannot eat every two or three hours. Of course, if your meals were to become sort of like a bodybuilder mean plan, it would need some adjustments, such as splitting each meals in half, so instead of 3 big meals, they would become 6 small-medium meals.

I don't know if you have ever used a macro-nutrient calculator (protein/carb/fat %), but give this one a look: Carb, Protein, Fat Calorie Calculator
It helps you create meal plans with different macro-nutrient ratios depending on what your goals are.

Here is a thread at bodybuilding.com regarding different macro-nutrient ratio for bulking, maintaining, and cutting: Best Macronutrient Ratio for Cutting, Bulking and Maintenance? - Bodybuilding.com Forums

My ideal proportions are based of of the ratio PHI (1.618) this is the ratio commonly used in sculpture such as Michaelangelos' statue "David" I apply this ratio to my skeletal structure to come up with goal measurements i.e. my hips measure out at 30 inches so 30"*PHI=48.58" an estimate of what my shoulder measurement should be. for other measurements use different areas of the body. for forearms the measurement of the wrist is multiplied by PHI; the upper arm the measurement of the elbow and so on.

This is the first time I have heard of the PHI ratio. I just read up on it, and it seems quite neat! That's an interesting idea about using the PHI ratio on the hip and shoulder width! I suppose this means that if someone's shoulder is a bit short of the ideal PHI width, then he needs to train his middle deltoids more!

This is really neat, mate!

I would like to stay around 4-6% bf so I need to gain a small amount of fat but mostly lean muscle.
I will see what iI can do about a picture

many thanks

From my experience, it's extremely difficult (if not near impossible) to gain lean muscle without gaining fat, naturally. Even when I'm on a light cycle of Tren and Test, I'd have to put on some fat by consuming extra calories in order to gain lean muscle.

Cheers mate.

 

[israelbur]

Im thinking about 1500 calories a meal.with a modified zone diet 50-35-15 that means 187 grams of carbs 131 grams of protein and 25 grams of fat yum pasta (blech) lower protein values because I'm on amino acids so theoretically i should be able to eat more carbs to account for a higher calorie intake but I will still be getting the proper amount of amino acids(as if I were to continue my paleo diet) So with a source of glutamine as well as the amino acids my body is able to glean from the food i consume do you think this will be enough to curb the effect of cortisol on my musculature?
btw do you know of any nutrient calculation programs available for download?

 

[Buttman3]

Im thinking about 1500 calories a meal.with a modified zone diet 50-35-15 that means 187 grams of carbs 131 grams of protein and 25 grams of fat yum pasta (blech) lower protein values because I'm on amino acids so theoretically i should be able to eat more carbs to account for a higher calorie intake but I will still be getting the proper amount of amino acids(as if I were to continue my paleo diet) So with a source of glutamine as well as the amino acids my body is able to glean from the food i consume do you think this will be enough to curb the effect of cortisol on my musculature?

Hey mate, if I understand correctly, you're adding glutamine and amino acids to your existing meal plan to combat against the muscle atrophy from cortisol. If so, I would recommend keeping your current meal plan and everything else exactly the same as you have been doing (at least for a few weeks).

The reason is - if you keep everything the same, the glutamine and amino acids are the only things new to your program. So, if you were to experience ANY new results after a few weeks, such as a reduction in muscle atrophy, you would know for certain that it MUST be the glutamine and amino acids.

OR, if you were to experience NO new results after a few weeks, you would also know for certain that the glutamine and amino acids are not effective.

The idea is to keep all variables (existing meal plan, exercise level) the same and test out the new variables (glutamine and amino acid).

Does this make sense? I'm sorry if I make it sounds too complicated.

btw do you know of any nutrient calculation programs available for download?

I have searched around, and so far, I only found two macronutrient calculator programs that are easy to use:

1. Free macronutrient ratios calculator | Three Coaching: Fat Loss Skype Consultations
(Download: http://www.threecoaching.com/other_files/Three Coaching Macronutrients Calculator.xls)

2. Excel Spreadsheet to Calculate BMR, Maintenance & Macro's. - Bodybuilding.com Forums
(Download: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4452201&d=1336926362)


If you prefer the macronutrient calculator from the website in my earlier post
(Carb, Protein, Fat Calorie Calculator)

There is a way to save it to your computer for offline use.

Step 1: Go to that link
Step 2: At the top left of your window, click File, then Save Page As
Step 3: Save as type: Web Page complete OR HTML only, then click the Save button.

You will see this file on your computer, wherever you downloaded it to.
Whenever you want to use this calculator, just double click to open it as you would with any file, without internet connection.

Hope that helps. Let me know if you have any questions.

Cheers mate.