New to TRT and want to know more

[marathon852]

Hi there!

I'm 48 - in 2014 I was 185lbs, fit, running a 3hr30 marathon, and looked ok in the gym. Over the past couple of years I have piled on the weight and am now 260lbs, with all the usual indicators of low T. I want to look good again - have more energy - plus run more marathons.

My blood test showed T levels of 156 ng/dl versus the 280-1100 range and my doc today gave me my first injection of bioidentical T "Sustanon 250" indicating total T of 250mg. He plans to give me another shot in 3 weeks time and then migrate me onto a bioidentical cream for daily use. Doc told me that the ultimate goal is to get me to the top of the 1100 range.

Doc also said to hit the resistance training hard to boost HGH, plus recommended a bunch of vitamins and mineral supplements.

About three weeks ago I started strict low carbing and exercising every day (gym+hiking). I'm also off coffee and alcohol, plus have committed to trying to sleep 7 hours/night. Have also dusted off my Fitbit and do minimum 10,000 steps/day, usually more.

Although the Doc was very generous with his time, I have some basic questions:

- Many others here seem to be on 200mg per week - does 250mg per week seem infrequent or am I missing something?
- Can daily bioidentical creams achieve the same results as injections?
- What can I expect in terms of results and when will I notice these? I hoping that the T will help speed up losing weight and getting into shape, plus give me more energy. I know I'll also have to work hard, just hoping it will help a little.

Sorry if these are basic questions and I appreciate the help.

 

[rich33584]

Injections are your best bet. You ultimately will want to do injections yourself and twice weekly at 3.5 days apart. Injections every 2 or 3 weeks is insanity...200 MG wk split into two injections. Talk to your dr and let him know you are willing to self inject, or you have someone at home that can do the injections. 25gx1" needle in the glutes is what I use and its very painless.
Stay away from creams, they can get expensive. They also dont work as well. Just tell the dr you have small kids around and you'd rather not avoid touching them or your wife.
Make sure you have your estradol (E2) checked. You dont want that to get out of control. Youll wind up crying on the couch watching Oprah and agreeing with Rosie O'Donnell..

 

[Gainjin260]

250mg every 3 weeks is not a good protocol. Sus has some very long esters, but even so I'd recommend a minimum of once weekly injections to ensure a consistent t level. Twice weekly would be ideal, your doc will probably say it's unnecessary, but if you don't mind needles it is slightly better than once a week The dose is also low. Most guys run btw 120-200mg/wk.

Creams are a less precise delivery method. They also aromatize (convert to estrogen/e2) more and are more expensive. They can rub off on wives/girlfriends/kids and have bad effects. Ie your 2 year old starts growing pubic hair. Stick with injections.

You'll notice an increase in libido within 2 week IME. Greater energy and better sense of well being should be very noticeable by week 5-6. The effects of TRT will continue to improve for weeks beyond that, but after 6 weeks you'll be firing on all cylinders.

 

[Slhardee]

As stated above, advocate for injections. It's much easier and accurate. Monitor your E2 through regular blood work. Ask your Doc to do the "ultra sensative" estradiol test. If your taking 200+ mg per week you will probably need an aromatize innhibator (anastrozole or equivalent)

It sounds like your Doc is on the right track with treating you. Just make sure you advocate for yourself.

 

[SugarMouth]

In addition to what the others said monitor your Hematocrit levels as they can get high with TRT. I live at high elevation which makes it worse but can control it with just one blood donation every three months or so.

 

[tbonexl]

With your current protocol that your doc has you on, it isn't ideal. Injections every 3 weeks of sustanon isn't good at all. Sustanon contains different esters of test. Guys who cycle sust will pin every other day or at the very least, twice per week to maintain steady levels. At this protocal, it could take months to see improvement with using sust every 3 weeks. I wouldn't recommend creams either. I would have the doc switch you over to test enanthate or test cyponate instead of sustanon. You could probably get away with once a week injections with both but twice per week would be ideal. As mentioned, checking hemocrit levels and running an ai to manage estrogen are things that need discussed with doc. I'm not a trt expert but I'm on trt and I'm sure others will chime in also..

 

[marathon852]

Thanks guys. All new to me and so this is really helpful. Seems to me that you really need to understand this stuff well if you are taking it, plus to be in position to properly debate you needs with your doctor.

Read that Sustanon has 4 different esters in it which range in half lives from 4.5 to 15 days, plus all the forums say at to take it at least weekly. Also, I see that everyone says to self inject so it makes sense to go that way. However, I would like to find something more official to show to my doc to get my dosage frequency switched up. Living overseas in Hong Kong now and there are few anti ageing docs here and so I'll have to work with this guy. However, strangely I think there is a local pharmacy that will sell you T over the counter if all else fails.

Unfortunately I'm starting with elevated E2 which may be because of propecia use or just from being a fat bast*rd right now. Doc has told me to take Dim and Zinc, but also mentioned medicinal alternatives (can't remember name, maybe an AI). I know that you guys will shout at me to stop using propecia, but I'm not yet ready to lose my hair. Doc says it works as a DHT inhibitor which sounds sensible, but from reading the forums opinion seems mixed.

Have read that Sustanon isn't FDA approved but is the T of choice in the UK. Not sure why that would be. What are the disadvantages? Just the oiliness and thickness of the needle?

 

[tbonexl]

Thanks guys. All new to me and so this is really helpful. Seems to me that you really need to understand this stuff well if you are taking it, plus to be in position to properly debate you needs with your doctor.

Read that Sustanon has 4 different esters in it which range in half lives from 4.5 to 15 days, plus all the forums say at to take it at least weekly. Also, I see that everyone says to self inject so it makes sense to go that way. However, I would like to find something more official to show to my doc to get my dosage frequency switched up. Living overseas in Hong Kong now and there are few anti ageing docs here and so I'll have to work with this guy. However, strangely I think there is a local pharmacy that will sell you T over the counter if all else fails.

Unfortunately I'm starting with elevated E2 which may be because of propecia use or just from being a fat bast*rd right now. Doc has told me to take Dim and Zinc, but also mentioned medicinal alternatives (can't remember name, maybe an AI). I know that you guys will shout at me to stop using propecia, but I'm not yet ready to lose my hair. Doc says it works as a DHT inhibitor which sounds sensible, but from reading the forums opinion seems mixed.

Have read that Sustanon isn't FDA approved but is the T of choice in the UK. Not sure why that would be. What are the disadvantages? Just the oiliness and thickness of the needle?

Like you said, sustanon has 4 different esters in it. They range from fasting acting to very long as you know. With pinning even once a week, your blood levels won't be very stable with all the different esters. Basically like a roller coaster effect with your test levels. This makes managing estrogen difficult because there is no constant. Sides most likely will prevail due to fluctuations of the test hormone. You will basically be all over the place. Most with experience don't use sust or blends with different esters due to the difficulty of managing hormone levels. You want to be at a constant hormone level as best you can.

 

[SugarMouth]

http://www.steroidology.com/forum/testosterone-replacement-therapy/662394-basic-trt-overview.html

 

[jojo25jj]

Sustanon is no good idea! The longest working ester is also only Enanthate or C. and all other incredecies are short life.
You will have a heavy peak the first 3 days ant then a really low phase of levels. 3 Weeks with this will be a bad rollercoser, if your natty T. isn't produced anymore over time.
Better Protocoll is 100-200mg per week and if you can, in more doses splitted ( I was using T. Enanthate subcutane and have had very stable levels with 1x 100mg/week).

 

[appleton111]

whens the marathon?

 

[marathon852]

Thanks for all the help...sincerely. Also chatted with my ex-trainer who pretty much repeated the above advice.

I went to see the doc ...and:

Firstly, I got Anastrozol - 1 mg twice per week as an AI. I am wondering whether I still need DIM and Zinc. Zinc blocks, and Dim excretes, E2 so maybe lose the Zinc? Should've discussed with doc but there was too much to discuss. Doc says we can revisit dosage when I lose weight as being a fat bast*rd makes you produce too much E2 and I may have less of an issue once I have returned to my former shape (or hopefully a more muscular version of that).

Next, doc agreed cream not the best answer for me. He's putting me on nebido injections starting in a couple of days 1000mg every 10-12 weeks. I know there are downsides, but this is really convenient for someone like me who travels an awful lot and especially since I often go to Aus and even DHEA is on their banned substances list. In Hong Kong docs have access to nebido and sustanon only - not cyp. I can buy anything over the counter here, but want to be medically supervised.

Next, doc agreed to re-do my blood and saliva tests before my next injection in 10-12 weeks. Doc says saliva is a better way of checking T levels - I'm not sure, but it's certainly more expensive! I have poor adrenal function right now so I'm good with all of this testing.

Have agreed to pick up with my ex trainer in a month and he's told me to foam roll every night in preparation. I used to train every day, but was a mix of weight training, functional training and boxing, and I also ran for cardio. This time around I'm planning to focus on weight training say 3-4 times per week and then elliptical/run on the off days. Should I be doing weights every day for max results? Doc says weights are the best natural way to get HGH levels up. I have some weights at home that I can play with as I watch tv at night.

Appleton I didn't run a marathon since the two I did in 2014 - am heading to Da Nang in Vietnam for the (hot) half mara at the end of Aug and am targeting a full mara in early 2018! I'm now 260lbs and my ideal mara weight is 185-190. I used to look and feel best walking around at around 200lbs as I'm 183cm and was reasonably muscular (although not by the standards of most on this forum). Any way I look at it I have a huge amount of work to do.

Good luck to all who are trying to bounce back!

 

[IMT]

Testosterone creams are a less precise delivery method and also aromatize more. They can also rub off on your loved ones and have bad effects on them. Stick with injections please.

 

[Mycelium]

I've never don't the blends. I am with IMT obviously since I'm repping them but my test cypionate split in injections everyb3.5 days, anastrazol, HCG has me back in the game.

I'm on TRT due to epilepsy and medications side effects.