Shakes vs Solid Food

[athiktos]

dude sometimes you never know with the people on here. They could really think that 100 cals from oats and 100 cals from fruit loops would be the same. Im just not on this forum enough to understand when someone is being serious or not. So, i wasnt trying to be a prick or anything...just stating my knowledge thats all.

 

[Suareezay]

dude sometimes you never know with the people on here. They could really think that 100 cals from oats and 100 cals from fruit loops would be the same.

you got a point.

 

[Suareezay]

I would love to see the results too bro, its the only way to find out!

As someone said already, perception. By comparing a huge steak and potatoes to a MRP shake (both equal in balanced quality calories) one would automatically assume that the steak n' taters will be better for mass. Wrong, they are both a blend of protein/carbs/fats where the body will not know the difference.


And to use your example I guarantee someone would grow more on 4500 calories from only MRPs then someone getting 4000 calories all from whole foods...

on a macro level, yes, the two are more or less the same. on a micro level, which affects hormone and immune system function, no, theyre not the same.

you asked which is a better overall meal, you didnt ask "will i gain the same amount of weight from real food vs shakes assuming calories are the same". you even asked if the body will better utilize real food nutrients as opposed to powders.

 

[GymLift]

I would love to see the results too bro, its the only way to find out!

As someone said already, perception. By comparing a huge steak and potatoes to a MRP shake (both equal in balanced quality calories) one would automatically assume that the steak n' taters will be better for mass. Wrong, they are both a blend of protein/carbs/fats where the body will not know the difference.


And to use your example I guarantee someone would grow more on 4500 calories from only MRPs then someone getting 4000 calories all from whole foods...

Not all proteins are the same

Not all carbs are the same

Not all fats are the same

 

[OC Cartel]

actually..i think i read on article on that t-nation website awhile back about an all liquid diet for bodybuilding...

yes, but was it an all protein shake diet, or were there carbs and fats ect. in them too?

 

[adidamps2]

Not all proteins are the same

Not all carbs are the same

Not all fats are the same

true

true

true

 

[B.Reel]

Not all proteins are the same

Not all carbs are the same

Not all fats are the same

True, but NOT AT ALL what i am talking about...

My point is that almost everyone on this board would call a balanced MRP shake (40/40/20 - protein/carbs/fats) a suppliment. It is not a suppliment it is a great replacement for whole foods. Creatine, multi-vitamins, glutamine are all suppliments.

For those of you counting your nutrients on a micro level, most shakes have 100's of vitamins/minerals. So if your looking for quality calories, the body does not see a difference between MRPs and whole foods. I'm not suggesting you start replacing all of your whole food meals, because I think a balance of both is best...

PS I'd love to see a credible study on this topic...

 

[adidamps2]

the body will see a differnce in insulin spikes and amino acid profiles along with digestive enzymes and othe micro nutriants. most MRP use shitty whey concentate (for protien), Maltodextrin and or frutcose (for carbs) and maybe if your lucky flax for fats, otherwise its what ever fats are present in the whey are used. IMO MRP are not the greatest thing, but work in a pinch if the real deal is not optimal at the time.

 

[B.Reel]

the body will see a differnce in insulin spikes and amino acid profiles along with digestive enzymes and othe micro nutriants. most MRP use shitty whey concentate (for protien), Maltodextrin and or frutcose (for carbs) and maybe if your lucky flax for fats, otherwise its what ever fats are present in the whey are used. IMO MRP are not the greatest thing, but work in a pinch if the real deal is not optimal at the time.

That sounds great if you are comparing a clean whole meal to a B.S. inferrior MRP shake. I was implying the constant that all of the proteins/carbs/fats were equal, just one in solid and one in liquid form, for example..

WHOLE MEAL
8 oz lean steak with veggies and baked potato (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories

MRP SHAKE
3 scoops quality whey, cup of oats, flax oil (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories

Form your own opinoins, but the two are the same.

 

[OC Cartel]

That sounds great if you are comparing a clean whole meal to a B.S. inferrior MRP shake. I was implying the constant that all of the proteins/carbs/fats were equal, just one in solid and one in liquid form, for example..

WHOLE MEAL
8 oz lean steak with veggies and baked potato (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories
MRP SHAKE
3 scoops quality whey, cup of oats, flax oil (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories

Form your own opinoins, but the two are the same.

emphasis needs to be made that these shakes you're talking about contain not JUST protein, but also good fats/carbs/vitamins....

 

[GymLift]

That sounds great if you are comparing a clean whole meal to a B.S. inferrior MRP shake. I was implying the constant that all of the proteins/carbs/fats were equal, just one in solid and one in liquid form, for example..

WHOLE MEAL
8 oz lean steak with veggies and baked potato (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories

MRP SHAKE
3 scoops quality whey, cup of oats, flax oil (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories

Form your own opinoins, but the two are the same.

They are not the same. This isn't an opinion, this is a fact. adidamps2 already went over this:

the body will see a differnce in insulin spikes and amino acid profiles along with digestive enzymes and othe micro nutriants. most MRP use shitty whey concentate (for protien), Maltodextrin and or frutcose (for carbs) and maybe if your lucky flax for fats, otherwise its what ever fats are present in the whey are used. IMO MRP are not the greatest thing, but work in a pinch if the real deal is not optimal at the time.

If you don't understand that different carbs cause different insulin spikes or that different proteins have different amino acid profiles, then let me know. Both of these things mean that the makeup of the food is different in the body.

For example, whey protein is digested MUCH more quickly than real meat. Sometimes this is an advantage, like post workout but other times it isn't optimal, such as before bed.

If you want a liquid diet that is equal to that whole food diet, then put those whole foods in the blender. Then what you have is equivalent.

btw: Most of us will eat a sweet potatoe with that steak dinner, not a baked potatoe. Why? Because the GI of the sweet potatoe is lower.

 

[OC Cartel]

what if........in these shakes you use different protein and carb blends.
fast/long acting ect.?

They are not the same. This isn't an opinion, this is a fact. adidamps2 already went over this:

If you don't understand that different carbs cause different insulin spikes or that different proteins have different amino acid profiles, then let me know. Both of these things mean that the makeup of the food is different in the body.

For example, whey protein is digested MUCH more quickly than real meat. Sometimes this is an advantage, like post workout but other times it isn't optimal, such as before bed.

If you want a liquid diet that is equal to that whole food diet, then put those whole foods in the blender. Then what you have is equivalent.

btw: Most of us will eat a sweet potatoe with that steak dinner, not a baked potatoe. Why? Because the GI of the sweet potatoe is lower.

 

[Suareezay]

this is splitting hairs.

the higher the protein content in your diet, the less protein quality matters.
fats, carbs, and other proteins slow down the digestion rate of whey.
fats, protein, and lower GI carbs lower the GI of high GI carbs.

it really doesnt make that big of a difference either way. Just eat food and use powders when you cant eat.

 

[Showdowner52]

No way i could do an all liquid diet i just cant get full off of it i mean unless maybe mixed with oats,ricecakes,peanut butter or some other crap....

 

[adidamps2]

That sounds great if you are comparing a clean whole meal to a B.S. inferrior MRP shake. I was implying the constant that all of the proteins/carbs/fats were equal, just one in solid and one in liquid form, for example..

WHOLE MEAL
8 oz lean steak with veggies and baked potato (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories

MRP SHAKE
3 scoops quality whey, cup of oats, flax oil (say...P=60/C=60/F=20) 800 calories

Form your own opinoins, but the two are the same.

now your changing what a MRP is..what you have there is a "home made" mrp. a home made MRP is amost always a "real food" shake and is superior to a bought MRP. when i think MRP i think of the premade BS put out by sup companies. if you start throwing in oats, eggs, flax oil and other shit it's no longer liquid. you now have a semi-lumpy liquidy shake. it's still whole food insence at this point. a liquid shake is just that, it's a powder form of protien, carbs, and fat mixed with water.

 

[B.Reel]

They are not the same. This isn't an opinion, this is a fact. adidamps2 already went over this:

If you don't understand that different carbs cause different insulin spikes or that different proteins have different amino acid profiles, then let me know. Both of these things mean that the makeup of the food is different in the body.

For example, whey protein is digested MUCH more quickly than real meat. Sometimes this is an advantage, like post workout but other times it isn't optimal, such as before bed.

If you want a liquid diet that is equal to that whole food diet, then put those whole foods in the blender. Then what you have is equivalent.

btw: Most of us will eat a sweet potatoe with that steak dinner, not a baked potatoe. Why? Because the GI of the sweet potatoe is lower.

I understand that on a MICRO level there is a difference. But looking at the big picture on a MACRO level you are saying that there is a significant difference between (A) lean steak n' sweet taters and (B) a quality MRP shake both containg the same amount of protein, low GI carbs, essential fats and overall calories.

I say for Ronnie Coleman maybe, for most people trying to add muscle, not really.

BTW dont assume I'm talking about a grade D dog food MRP, I'm talkin flax, oats, bannanas, quality whey blends...

 

[B.Reel]

now your changing what a MRP is..what you have there is a "home made" mrp. a home made MRP is amost always a "real food" shake and is superior to a bought MRP. when i think MRP i think of the premade BS put out by sup companies. if you start throwing in oats, eggs, flax oil and other shit it's no longer liquid. you now have a semi-lumpy liquidy shake. it's still whole food insence at this point. a liquid shake is just that, it's a powder form of protien, carbs, and fat mixed with water.

I used the term quality MRP and meant a shake with all the goods in it. Thanks for the clear up

 

[BigRonWannabee]

BTW dont assume I'm talking about a grade D dog food MRP, I'm talkin flax, oats, bannanas, quality whey blends...

Those are whole foods made into a liquid shake...

 

[B.Reel]

Conclusion, if you are going to replace a meal with an MRP include some whole foods in it (fruits, oats, flax..). That way it will be EQUAL to the whole food meal you are replacing. Thanx broz

 

[truck]

supplements mostly are great for immediate use. whole food good for the big picture, digest longer and end up having more use in the body especially in the digestive track. I feel like crap after a while of not eating some fiber or something thats going to get my guts working correctly, on days I have to use shakes and sups more I feel less enegized than i do when I get a good blend of both whole food and sups. My guts tell me or not whether I'm eating right or not, when i feel bad I have to eat more real food then I start feeling better again. I'm no scientist but that's what works for me.