25yrs Prescribed Nebido, need input please!

[sharkky]

Hello guys,

I've been following this site for years now. Still totally natural. I've been lifting for 7 years. Stats now 78kg. pretty lean, abs showing. around 12% BF.However every year I was feeling more and more low T symptoms. So now I'm 25 and i decided to get a blood test done/ routine test/hormone panel.
It did cost me since my insurance doesn't cover any hormonal tests. But due to the symptoms doctor advised that I do them.

Got transferred to a urologist/endocrinologist. My levels were low specially for a 25 male. My levels are like a 50-60 years old male....

Tests Results:

Testosterone Total: 4.48 nmol/L Normal range is 8.33 - 30.20 nmol/L
Free Testosterone: 4.5 pg/mL Normal Range is 7.0 - 22.7 pg/mL
TSH: 2.23 uIU/mL Normal range is 0.35-4.94
Estradiol: <5.00 pg/mL Normal Range is 7.63 - 42.6

He gave me 3 options:

1) Nebido + HCG 'pregnyll'
2) Clomid + HCG + Testomax
3) Testomax

He explained each. Finally chose Nebido. Since the rest are a joke honestly.

I have 2days to decide since he already gave me the prescription which lasts 3 days since Nebido is a controlled drug. Or else I would need to see him again

So the protocol is

1) Nebido 250mgx4 which is 1000mg once every 3 month(12 weeks) Slow Intramuscular over 2minutes
After 6 weeks of my first shot there is a 1000mg booster shot.

#he mentioned that he may adjust it to 10 weeks between each injection depending on how I feel and blood work. Specially for lifters. Some get it every 9 weeks based on his lifting clients.#

2) HCG 5000 IU/ML 1. 500 units 3xweek in a month. So one week of a month i have 3 shots of 500 units hcg.

After reading Alot on trt on this forum and others. Many are using test cyp 2xweek at 100 to 200mgs. To keep steady levels. However requires more frequent pinning compared to Nebido.
And hcg eod of 250 to 500 units.
Also keeping on the side an AI(aromatize inhibitor) such as aromasine or arimidex. To keep E2 levels controlled if needed.

He told me you wont need it since my E2 is already very low. But if it increased he would give Clomid.

In terms of pricing:

-Nebido is $*******no price discussion allowed***** every three month. (prescription needed)
-HCG is *****$No prices******doesn't require prescription)

Guys I don't want to screw up myself from this urologist. I got a second opinion also but wasn't satisfied at all since he told me to live with it because I'm young and he fears infertility. I would risk that but not live my life depressed and low confidence, libido, energy all day. It sucks.

I'm thinking of starting it in two days if I don't get any other options or suggestions from experienced guys.

My friend who is a competitor (master's now +50 of age)
Told me I can get testosterone Cyp 250mgx10 ampules for *****No prices allowed*****depending on quantity ordered and this is the best quality. There is cheaper ones but I won't risk it.

Please guys feel free to advise me on which route to take/ what to change or add.
Many thanks!

 

[casanovaaa]

Low testosterone levels can surely be a pain to deal with. its best for you to contact a pro and click on my signature banner and contact the trt doc there as he will surely get you to where you need to be to be happy and with normal test levels.

 

[sharkky]

Low testosterone levels can surely be a pain to deal with. its best for you to contact a pro and click on my signature banner and contact the trt doc there as he will surely get you to where you need to be to be happy and with normal test levels.

I am not located in the US but in the ME. thank you

 

[scorob777]

Why nebido, why not just test cyp? Cheap as chips.

If you want to preserve fertility you should get a better HCG dosing schedule, something like 500 IU 2x per week.

Your profile says you are in Lebanon, I assume these are prescription there?

 

[Slhardee]

Please take a minute and think this out. TRT is for life!! Your numbers will tank even further once you are on TRT. Why not try the restart first? Your only 25 years old. ???

 

[sharkky]

Why nebido, why not just test cyp? Cheap as chips.

If you want to preserve fertility you should get a better HCG dosing schedule, something like 500 IU 2x per week.

Your profile says you are in Lebanon, I assume these are prescription there?

Weighing the differences such as frequent injections, prescription vs blk market etc and i've been reading alot on nebido and people seem to find it better than other methods. true it may be a little more expensive but I'm willing to try it first and see how i respond to it in terms of symptoms and bw levels.

Regarding the hcg I totally agree that the hcg protocol he is suggesting is ridic... and I would have that changed to 250iu 3xweek or 500iu 2 to 3xweek. still reading more about it...
Well in 2012 i was there but since i've moved to dubai.
nebido needs prescription and i already got it which lasts for 3 days from day of issuing. hcg doesnt need prescription.
However he didnt suggest any AI to have. I told him what about if estrogen goes up. he told me he will give me clomid??

 

[sharkky]

Please take a minute and think this out. TRT is for life!! Your numbers will tank even further once you are on TRT. Why not try the restart first? Your only 25 years old. ???

I may consider a restart but I mentioned that to him he said that already your values are not producing and since I've never took any substance before it will not effect me since my testis are already lazy...
However Im seeing many different restart protocols on here. would like to know a suitable one for a person who is naturally low. Yes i am 25yrs old and its depressing. thanks

 

[Slhardee]

Let***8217;s be clear here, I am NOT a Doctor, but I will question your doctors competence by saying your testis are already ***8220;lazy***8221;. That is a totally moronic statement (especially from a doctor). Any competent Doc who knows HRT will first try a restart (especially for someone as young as yourself).

A proper restart with HCG, Clomiphine, and Tamoxifen is definately worth a try. In addition, you should have multiple and correlating blood tests to confirm you are hypogonadal, before starting any therapy.

 

[scorob777]

Search up the power PCT. Do a heavy round of HCG first, like minimum 14 days at 1,000 IU per day - or longer. This would wake up your "lazy" balls. Once that works, then start the clomid and nolva.

Worth a try.

If you go with nebido I personally would be really skeptical about the claimed half life. The ester itself is somewhere in the 21 day halflife range. The maker claims what they do because they use castor oil, which supposedly slows down the depot absorption. The way around that bullshit would be to inject it more often. If you can do it yourself and no have to go into the docs office, then you could inject on any frequency you felt like.

 

[sharkky]

Search up the power PCT. Do a heavy round of HCG first, like minimum 14 days at 1,000 IU per day - or longer. This would wake up your "lazy" balls. Once that works, then start the clomid and nolva.

Worth a try.

If you go with nebido I personally would be really skeptical about the claimed half life. The ester itself is somewhere in the 21 day halflife range. The maker claims what they do because they use castor oil, which supposedly slows down the depot absorption. The way around that bullshit would be to inject it more often. If you can do it yourself and no have to go into the docs office, then you could inject on any frequency you felt like.

It is something i would consider, however I decided to dig into the reason behind my low T. many are telling me to find the reason behind it before starting trt. I already got the nebido and hcg.. I'm going to do a blood test in the coming week or two tops. meanwhile i'm looking for another urologist / trt specialist but until now the one i'm dealing with is what is being recommended in my area...pitty.

As for nebido there are a lot who switched from test c or E to nebido and will never go back. However the frequency of injections depends on the individual symptoms and bw. as per users some go low as 9weeks which is what my urologist said and guys on forums and some are fine every 12 weeks which is the standard protocol for nebido. 1000mg every 3month.
Will take around 6+ months to dial correctly.
Also i the future i wouldn't mind trying test C and compare it with nebido. but for now I would like to know how can i dig more into my bw results and the reason of low t.
thanks

 

[scorob777]

Wow, 1,000 mg every 3 months? Are you sure about that? Assuming 12 weeks works out to 83 mg/wk, which you won't be too happy with.

Post up your blood test results. People will try to see if you look primary or secondary, what your actual levels are, then can go from there with any advice.

 

[sharkky]

Wow, 1,000 mg every 3 months? Are you sure about that? Assuming 12 weeks works out to 83 mg/wk, which you won't be too happy with.

Post up your blood test results. People will try to see if you look primary or secondary, what your actual levels are, then can go from there with any advice.

yes sure. thats actually how is nebido given.

Tests Results:

Testosterone Total: 4.48 nmol/L Normal range is 8.33 - 30.20 nmol/L
Free Testosterone: 4.5 pg/mL Normal Range is 7.0 - 22.7 pg/mL
TSH: 2.23 uIU/mL Normal range is 0.35-4.94
Estradiol: <5.00 pg/mL Normal Range is 7.63 - 42.6
LH: 2.62 mIU/mL Normal Range is 1.7-8.6 mIU/mL
FSH: 1.85 mIU/mL Normal Range is 1.5 - 12.4 mIU/mL
Prolactin: 6.38 ng/ml Normal Range is 4.04 - 15.2 ng/ml
Vitamin D: 29.17 ng/ml Insufficient 10-30 Sufficient: 30-100 Toxic: >100

these are what i did. also a normal blood panel which is all normal. thanks

 

[scorob777]

Nebido is testosterone undecanoate, MW 456.7 vs. MW of testosterone itself 288.4 - which means you get 63.15% test in the molecule. 63.15% * 1,000 mg/12 weeks = 52.6 mg test per week

Compare that to test cyp, which is 69.9% test in the molecule. Typical TRT doses range from 100 mg/wk to 200 mg/wk - equivalent to 69.9 mg/wk to 139.8 mg/wk.

So your effective nebido dose is lower than a "low" TRT test cyp dose. What I'm trying to say is that seems pretty low, and I'll bet costs quite a bit. With your low bloodwork results you might feel great on that dose, but most people would probably want about double to put them into a range where they feel good.

 

[sharkky]

Nebido is testosterone undecanoate, MW 456.7 vs. MW of testosterone itself 288.4 - which means you get 63.15% test in the molecule. 63.15% * 1,000 mg/12 weeks = 52.6 mg test per week

Compare that to test cyp, which is 69.9% test in the molecule. Typical TRT doses range from 100 mg/wk to 200 mg/wk - equivalent to 69.9 mg/wk to 139.8 mg/wk.

So your effective nebido dose is lower than a "low" TRT test cyp dose. What I'm trying to say is that seems pretty low, and I'll bet costs quite a bit. With your low bloodwork results you might feel great on that dose, but most people would probably want about double to put them into a range where they feel good.

the doc was flexible with me to make it as low as 9 weeks. he said depending on your symptoms and bw. because he has some patients that are on the 9week protocol since they are active lifters. which is my case.