A bit out of place but need some help for my son

[4jeff]

I feel quite out of place in this forum however I need some help for my son and this is where all my searches lead. I will give a brief history - My son has been having issues for a few years (since puberty kicked in around 11yrs old) he is now 16. I have spent $$$$ on trying to figure out what is going on with him - he has trouble sleeping, anxiety, muscle pain and weakness, headaches, low self-esteem, weight gain. He is a big kid coming in at 265 @ 6'2" but very little muscle, however most of his weight is in his stomach area. We have been to numerous Dr.s and pretty much told diet and exercise - I am not in denial my son is overweight nor is he, what my issue is that his weight and his food consumption and past exercise does not add up to his actual weight, however Dr.s refuse to believe that and insisted that he just over eats and doesn't do any exercise. We do a low carb diet and he does not cheat, he had a personal trainer 3 x/week for 8 months and gained no muscle or lost any weight, being discouraged we switched to MMA hoping more cardio would help but again no weight lose and he was going 3x a week for 1-1/2 to 2hr sessions but had to stop due to his endurance dropping and fatigue and muscle pain and swelling. Being quite the insistant Mom we finally came up with (after 6 Dr.s and 5 months) that my son has low testosterone. He is a tanner stage 5 (for the most part done with puberty) however he has no facial hair nor underarm hair - all other areas are fine per his Dr., him and his brother His T levels came in at over a 3 month period - 240, 200 and the latest was 172 with free T being a 48 with the 200 and a 28 with the 172 (they didn't test the free t in the 240 test) The specialist agreed to put him on TRT since those are crazy low #'s for a 16yr old boy and most of his symptoms seem to fall under low t causes. Sorry its a bit long but I wanted you to have the full story before any judgement comes out. Our specialist is based in CA and yes I took my son from NJ to CA to get him help - this Dr. is an endocrinologist and top in his field - he is a little more relaxed then the Dr.s in NJ where he gave us a choice of gel or shots - at first I choose the gel knowing he is not a fan of needles but then thought with having a younger sister and being only 16 and a bit careless we would be safer with the shots. Can I please get some input of the differences between the gel and shots from real experience and things we might encounter with each. Also we may have to pay for this out of pocket if the insurance denies us and would like to know which is cheaper. The injections would be 100 mg/ml 10ml bottle - 50mg subcutaneous 2x's a week. How many shots would I get out of 1 bottle (trying to figure out the cost should insurance not cover it.)

Thanks for any and all feed back.

A concerned mom

 

[ImAuNatural]

I would have him do injections. Make sure you research how to do proper techniques and procedures before doing so and consult with your doctor as well. I cant say which will be cheaper but I can tell you that your son needs this very badly. Also I would say you should try to do IM (Intramuscular Injections) instead of SubQ but they both work SubQ just takes longer to absorb fully. Also make sure you get bloodwork regularly and keep an eye on your sons estrogen levels after he has begun his TRT. Search around on this website some more and do some more research and make sure your son understands all of this as well.

 

[Milton]

Get him off soft drinks, any processed foods, have him eat lots of fiber and drink lots of water and fresh homemade juices, dont buy that garbage in a can that says All Natural juices, they use artificial sweeteners which are designed to keep an overweight person, overweight. and for Gods sake dont let him drink ANYTHING that says DIET, whether it be diet sodas, ice tea or whatever. There are plenty of online studies that conclude that all those diet drinks are more hazardous than the normal drinks and actually make an obese person more obese. Also, make sure hes not sneaking in the kitchen at night for a late night snack, like I used to. My parents would go to bed and I would raid the fridge, I gained alot of weight that way and I am paying for it now. Put a lock on it if you must. Also you can try ASMR therapy, google it and you will see plenty of videos on youtube that all you have to do is put on some headphones sit back and relax. And in conclusion lots of love and understanding and most importantly be a friend to him. This way he will always come to you for any help in his situation instead of going to MTV or online to look for it. Keep us updated on his progress, lots of good people here who love to help out and give good sound advice. Godspeed!

 

[Megatron28]

We have a sticky thread in this forum that gives a nice overview on TRT. Here is a link:

http://www.steroidology.com/forum/testosterone-replacement-therapy/662394-basic-trt-overview.html

But in general, you instinct to go with injections is the right one. Gels are much more expensive, less effective and there is a huge risk of transfer.

If you need more help, please keep posting your questions here or feel free to send me a private message.

 

[Havasu]

Do the Dr. consider at his age that taking HCG to try to kick his natural test production into action may be appropriate before TRT? TRT is for life. He'll be injecting a minimum of once a week, if not twice a week for the rest of his life. That's a looooot of injections at his age. Also, if he's doing right HCG will be involved with TRT 2x a week most likely. So that's 3-4 injections a week. 1-2IM, and 2 Subcutaneous.

It may be wise to explore HCG therapy first, and see if his LH, FSH come up, and if it kicks his natural production into action. It's worth a shot before shutting him down for good. Something may have happened during his development and whatever needed to happen never happened to get him producing normally. HCG could fix that if that's what happened. At his age, I would explore that route, then if that doesn't work then get on TRT, with HCG, and an aromatase inhibitor if needed.

Lastly you're a great parent for going to the lengths you have to help your child. He would have no shot, and continued to feel like absolute shit for a looooong time until he was an adult, started researching himself, and found a doctor on his own that would treat him. You're getting the ball rolling now, with someone that you seem very confident in, and that's great.

 

[Alpin]

Do the Dr. consider at his age that taking HCG to try to kick his natural test production into action may be appropriate before TRT? TRT is for life. He'll be injecting a minimum of once a week, if not twice a week for the rest of his life. That's a looooot of injections at his age. Also, if he's doing right HCG will be involved with TRT 2x a week most likely. So that's 3-4 injections a week. 1-2IM, and 2 Subcutaneous.

It may be wise to explore HCG therapy first, and see if his LH, FSH come up, and if it kicks his natural production into action. It's worth a shot before shutting him down for good. Something may have happened during his development and whatever needed to happen never happened to get him producing normally. HCG could fix that if that's what happened. At his age, I would explore that route, then if that doesn't work then get on TRT, with HCG, and an aromatase inhibitor if needed.

Lastly you're a great parent for going to the lengths you have to help your child. He would have no shot, and continued to feel like absolute shit for a looooong time until he was an adult, started researching himself, and found a doctor on his own that would treat him. You're getting the ball rolling now, with someone that you seem very confident in, and that's great.

Lol

HCG doesn't raise LH/FSH. It is suppressive to the pituitary as well. You want CLOMID not HCG for raising LH/FSH.

 

[Havasu]

Lol

HCG doesn't raise LH/FSH. It is suppressive to the pituitary as well. You want CLOMID not HCG for raising LH/FSH.

You're right. I misspoke as I was getting my thought at fast. However, HCG for young hypo gonadal males to try and get their natural production going IS an actual therapy.

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/722764

If you have something more than a "LOL" to offer to the conversation I'm sure it would be welcomed.

 

[Alpin]

You're right. I misspoke as I was getting my thought at fast. However, HCG for young hypo gonadal males to try and get their natural production going IS an actual therapy.

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/722764

If you have something more than a "LOL" to offer to the conversation I'm sure it would be welcomed.

Forgive me I nevet read through your entire post.
I'm just bothered by a lot of youth that are uneducated about hormones and are a nuisance in these forums.
Such is not the case with you.
I can give my 2 cents in what i have encountered with TRT.
Other than that looks like you are in a specialists hands for treatment. I take it the majority of endos where you resided were useless??
Really few endos know what they are doing with male hormones. I'd say 80% (conservatively) rather the hypogonadal patient goes away and suffers in silence.
I don't have the time if day for endos. I'd rather self treat than deal with them.

 

[4jeff]

All of his levels are fine however he does have a small tumor on his pituitary. No one will even consider touching it because they said if all his other levels were normal that couldn't be the cause. Trust me I've explored all angles and researched for months this is were we are at and if I want my son to feel better I truly believe this is the only way believe me I don't want him to have to give life long injections and ill keep looking for answers. Any mood swing issues I should be concerned about?

 

[Alpin]

I won't use Gels. Too $$ expensive and ineffective.
I'd start out with 50 mg E3.5 D IM. You could do sub q but I dont have experience using sub q so I cant recommend it.

What doses of HCG is your son on?
What were his baseline LH/FSH & Prolcatin levels?

 

[Alpin]

All of his levels are fine however he does have a small tumor on his pituitary. No one will even consider touching it because they said if all his other levels were normal that couldn't be the cause. Trust me I've explored all angles and researched for months this is were we are at and if I want my son to feel better I truly believe this is the only way believe me I don't want him to have to give life long injections and ill keep looking for answers. Any mood swing issues I should be concerned about?

Not really. Just monitor Estradiol it can cause anxiety, ED, high bp, insomnia if its out of range.
Try to manage his Estradiol im the 20-30 pg/ml range.
My estradiol is at 36.5 pg/ml last i checked and i can tell the difference to when its great and dialed in and when its high.
At 50 mg twice weekly things should not get too out of whack. But you said your son is heavier so he will probably aromatize quite a bit.
Testosterone is a VERY important hormone as you know. Basically controls a mans entire physical well being and make up.

 

[Alpin]

Why wont the docs remove the pituitary tumor?

 

[4jeff]

He doesn't sneak because there is nothing in the house to sneak. I buy nothing the whole family is doing this a life style change. I have Never seen him so dedicated to trying to lose weight.

 

[Megatron28]

All of his levels are fine however he does have a small tumor on his pituitary. No one will even consider touching it because they said if all his other levels were normal that couldn't be the cause. Trust me I've explored all angles and researched for months this is were we are at and if I want my son to feel better I truly believe this is the only way believe me I don't want him to have to give life long injections and ill keep looking for answers. Any mood swing issues I should be concerned about?

Testosterone converts (aromatizes) into estradiol which is a form of estrogen. If that gets too high it can cause some unwanted moodiness.

Otherwise, you will probably notice that he will have more energy, be happier, calmer and have a healthier libido on TRT. The changes should be positive if estradiol is managed.

 

[Alpin]

All of his levels are fine however he does have a small tumor on his pituitary. No one will even consider touching it because they said if all his other levels were normal that couldn't be the cause. Trust me I've explored all angles and researched for months this is were we are at and if I want my son to feel better I truly believe this is the only way believe me I don't want him to have to give life long injections and ill keep looking for answers. Any mood swing issues I should be concerned about?

How are T levels 172-240 fine for a 16 year old ?

 

[Megatron28]

How are T levels 172-240 fine for a 16 year old ?

She doesn't need to be lectured on what she already knows. Let focus on helping her help her son. Not go on a tangent berating doctors.

 

[4jeff]

How are T levels 172-240 fine for a 16 year old ?

They aren't that is why im here. Sorry im not very good with these quote bubbles my response to all his levels are fine was because I was being asked about his FSH LH levels.

 

[Alpin]

They aren't that is why im here. Sorry im not very good with these quote bubbles my response to all his levels are fine was because I was being asked about his FSH LH levels.

I understand.

 

[4jeff]

Why wont the docs remove the pituitary tumor?

Don't even get me started lol they need biochemical evidence that the tumor is causing low testosterone and the low testosterone isnt enough by itself the FSH LH or prolactin would need to be out of whack before they would consider the tumor being the cause. It doesn't friggin matter that it doesn't belong there they dont care

 

[Alpin]

They aren't that is why im here. Sorry im not very good with these quote bubbles my response to all his levels are fine was because I was being asked about his FSH LH levels.

What does the new doc say about it?