Bulk into Cut Cycle Thoughts

D

D3CA

New member
Would experienced users recommend this?

Looking to do a 10 - 12 bulk beginning of January and I'm starting to piece my cycle together. Was looking to do a cut not too long after (off cycle) but after some research I gather I could be cannibalising a lot of hard earned muscle if I take this approach so close to a cycle.

So is bulk (say 10 weeks) straight into a cut (another 10 weeks) advisable i.e. get it all done in one cycle?

I'm 27, 5"8, 77kg about 12% bf at the moment. Been training 5 years, this is my second cycle, first was Test E only for a bulk, second was Test E for a cut w/Masteron towards end of cycle.

How would this look for a 20 week bulk/cut:

Bulk
Test E 1-10 600mg p/week
D-Ball - 40mg wk 1-10

Cut
Test E 1-10 -300mg p/week
 
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I know I'm new here, but the consensus on the board seems to be "maintain stable blood levels throughout your cycle". So keeping your test at 600mg for bulk and cut seems the way to go.
 
Take a two week break in between the cut and the bulk. Re-regulate your hormones(Ghrelin, leptin, thyroid, etc)

Not required but can optimize your cut.
 
Black Beard said:
Take a two week break in between the cut and the bulk. Re-regulate your hormones(Ghrelin, leptin, thyroid, etc)

Not required but can optimize your cut.
Click to expand...

Kool. Just wanted to check it was a sound idea. I can diet really strict so 10 weeks will be plenty on cut!
 
I would not recomment it.

There's a reason why people are doing bulking or cutting cycles, if it was so easy to bulk/cut in one shot everybody would do it, who wants to add fat on cycle?

As it has been explained by a senior member to another poster today, your body is perpetually looking for homeostasis and will see the brutal extra weight of the bulk as somehting he would like to get rid of, it is generally recommended to let the body get used to this extra mass of muscle before hitting it again with a cycle, wether it is bulking or cutting.

Your body is already going through a roller coaster in term of hormone levels, training and food intake, no need to make his life harder by bringing him in a U-turn.

Quite a few people have tried this (so did I...) and can testify that it is hard to manage. After all, if you were to gain muscle+fat (bulk) then lose fat trying to retain muscle, you would more than likely end up at the same weight but with a different LBM / fat ratio, which is basicallt a body recomp and there are cycles aimed at this goal.

My advice would be to make a bulk cycle, shorter, going full-on bulking, then doing your best to keep your gains through PCT and after that only, once you're stabilized your gains, go for a cutting cycle. 20 weeks cycle is pretty long IMO...

Just my 2cts
 
Leiurus said:
I would not recomment it.

There's a reason why people are doing bulking or cutting cycles, if it was so easy to bulk/cut in one shot everybody would do it, who wants to add fat on cycle?

As it has been explained by a senior member to another poster today, your body is perpetually looking for homeostasis and will see the brutal extra weight of the bulk as somehting he would like to get rid of, it is generally recommended to let the body get used to this extra mass of muscle before hitting it again with a cycle, wether it is bulking or cutting.

Your body is already going through a roller coaster in term of hormone levels, training and food intake, no need to make his life harder by bringing him in a U-turn.

Quite a few people have tried this (so did I...) and can testify that it is hard to manage. After all, if you were to gain muscle+fat (bulk) then lose fat trying to retain muscle, you would more than likely end up at the same weight but with a different LBM / fat ratio, which is basicallt a body recomp and there are cycles aimed at this goal.

My advice would be to make a bulk cycle, shorter, going full-on bulking, then doing your best to keep your gains through PCT and after that only, once you're stabilized your gains, go for a cutting cycle. 20 weeks cycle is pretty long IMO...

Just my 2cts
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This makes sense.

What kind of time are we looking at gains to be stabilized? Basic time on/time off approach?
 
D3CA said:
This makes sense.

What kind of time are we looking at gains to be stabilized? Basic time on/time off approach?
Click to expand...

Muscle doesn't need to be stabilized, once you have it you own it...provided your diet and training are on point and where you are in terms of your potential. The time on/time off approach is to let your endocrine system recover and repair itself, it's not about keeping muscle.
 
^ I do not agree with this. Your body needstime to "understand" its newly acquired muscle. I'm a strong believer in the whole "mature muscle" idea. You want to maintain for AT LEAST a month minimum before trying to cut. You will keep more of your gains.
 
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clman8585 said:
^ I do not agree with this. Your body needstime to "understand" its newly acquired muscle. I'm a strong believer in the whole "mature muscle" idea. You want to maintain for at least a month before trying to cut. You will keep more of your gains.
Click to expand...

Muscle is muscle and whether it's built in cycle or off, once you have it you have it. It's physiology 101 in that respect. Keeping your gains has very little to do with maturing the muscle. I started cutting DURING PCT and my muscle loss was minimal/non-existent. There's no need to maintain it for any amount of time before deciding you want to cut, the differences are not quantifiable.
 
Sorry I do not gree. This is from lots of trial and error experience. Maybe gram of tren can weigh in? Lol
 
Definitely do not stop AAS for two weeks. Eat at maintenance for two weeks to optimize leptin, thyroid, and ghrelin hormones. These are you satiety and metabolic hormones.This is not required but can optimize your cut. it will also make it a smoother transition from a hyper caloric diet to a hypo caloric one. Diet breaks are very important. Your body will down-regulate these hormones on a cut and up-regulate them on a bulk. After cutting for a certain period of time, your body becomes more efficient at holding on to that fat by the mechanism of leptin down regulation and ghrelin up regulation. At the end of the day, this is just small stuff that can improve and optimize your cut. The most important thing is consistency with your caloric surplus/deficit for a successful body re composition in bodybuilding.



I'll clear this up a bit more, in this post i'm talking about two separate things. A diet break in transition from bulking to cutting, and a diet break during a long cut. The diet break during a long cut is more important in my opinion. The diet break in transition from bulk to cut is just an optimization. Nothing but the basics are necessary in bodybuilding. Everything else is just a bonus.
 
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DreDay187 said:
Muscle is muscle and whether it's built in cycle or off, once you have it you have it. It's physiology 101 in that respect. Keeping your gains has very little to do with maturing the muscle. I started cutting DURING PCT and my muscle loss was minimal/non-existent. There's no need to maintain it for any amount of time before deciding you want to cut, the differences are not quantifiable.
Click to expand...

So in your opinion a bulk into cut is not counter productive?
 
D3CA said:
So in your opinion a bulk into cut is not counter productive?
Click to expand...

No it's not but I would choose one goal and stick with it for each cycle whether it's bulk, cut, or recomp. If your purpose is to build muscle then bulk on cycle then cut the fat after the cycle. If your goal is to get ripped, cut on the cycle then bulk again while off. I'm not a fan of combining multiple goals in a single cycle. Not that it can't be done but bc it's less efficient IMO.
 
In my own experience, i don't notice too much of a difference. Scientifically, a two week break will make cutting easier. Psychologically because you aren't going from huge amounts of food, to a lot less. Physiologically because your body will re-balance the hormones that i mentioned above. Honestly, don't sweat the small stuff. Do what you feel like doing. If you are psyched to start cutting and you have the motivation and impetus then go for it. If you want every possible optimization you can consider this method. Everyone does their own thing(that hopefully works for them) so it's up to you decide what path you wish to take and what methods you want to employ. it's all about trial and error. The science just helps us sometimes. So we can understand and further optimize our routines.

Half this stuff doesn't matter most of the time. Just be consistent and stick the basic principles of hypertrophy/fat loss.
 
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what is all this bulk/cut nonsense? you're on steroids. eat a lot of clean foods and just build muscle while leaning up. that's what we are able to do with anabolics, shed fat and build muscle. do it.
 
You can recomp on AAS by eating at maintenance and watching your macros. It feels slower than bulk/cut to some people. It just takes longer because your doing both. You can recomp without steroids, it just takes very very long. Steroids just enhance the two most essential things to a bodybuilder, protein synthesis and lipid oxidation. It raises metabolism and increase protein retention.
 
gram of tren said:
what is all this bulk/cut nonsense? you're on steroids. eat a lot of clean foods and just build muscle while leaning up. that's what we are able to do with anabolics, shed fat and build muscle. do it.
Click to expand...

For those who don't need to maintain body weight or want to make changes faster, bulking and cutting is a much better approach.
 
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