Need Lean Muscle Mass Advice

King93

Muscle Junkie
Hi guys

I've been reading threads on this site for over a year now, regarding various AAS's that I've either heard about or wanted to find out more information about. So far, I've learnt a considerable amount of information about many different steroids and when I haven't understood a particular term or phrase that many of you guys have used, I've gone and "Google'd" the word in order to broaden my knowledge about steroids and bodybuilding.

I am 18 years old, and will be 19 in 2 months time, and have been training for 5 years now, with 4 of those training seriously. I have only started training with a proper diet for about 2 years now, whilst training to put on as much mass as possible. I have mixed up my training program numerous times throughout my training career, from doing 4 sets of 12 reps per exercise for about 4 exercises per muscle group, and trained 2 muscle groups per day. Then I was 14 years old, 1.69m tall and weighed 62kgs(137lbs). Since then until now, I have changed my training program from starting with a personal trainer when I first started gyming and trained Chest and Tri's (Day 1), Legs (Day 2), Back and Bi's (Day 3), Shoulders and Traps and Core (Day 4) and then resting for the next 4 days. To cut a long story short, I changed that program many times, changing muscle groups to changing exercises, to changing rep range (to bulking, to strength, to cutting etc), to going lighter to focus on and improve my form, to even trying to mix up my workout doing 3 exercises of strength and 3 of muscle fibre breakdown.

I play Rugby and am passionate about the game, and play Hooker(#2) which proves difficult sometimes with my size compared to many of my competition. Since the end of last year's season which ended in August 2010 I was 1.77m tall weighing 78kgs (172lbs) which was tiny for someone who plays my position, with a typical weight of around 95kgs (209lbs). After the season I prepared myself for this year's season, which would be my last year to play in high school and possibly for the rest of my life. I majorly increased my complex carb intake and ensured I was feeding my body every 3 hours, whilst also eating lots of protein at each meal. I bought two bags of ON Serious Mass along with another tub of whey with a good creatine based pre-workout. I hit the gym hard, and by March the this year (2011), I had gained 14kgs (31lbs) in 7 months. This was an incredible achievement for me, although I had gained quite a bit of fat on my stomach but I had been smashing legs which had bulked up a bit which could have been the reason for such a good gain in mass. However, throughout the season I literally had no time to train with early morning fitness and then explosive work/core sessions/speed training happening throughout the week straight after school up until practice which was a further 2.5 hours long. Then I had homework, and I got to a stage whereby bed time was the highlight of my day. Because of my training being totally non-evident I went from 92kg/203lbs in March (about 13% b/f) to 83kg/183lbs by the beginning of July.

My season went really well though, and I even ended up making a provincial side. However, I seemed to be letting my game down with my size which saw my competition make it further than I did, and at the beginning of this year he obviously juiced as he went from 88kg/194lbs to 105kg/231.5lbs in 3 months, being an 18 year old as well, and his legs got monstrous! And whoever knows Rugby will tell you that an 83kg/183lb Hooker is tiny especially at u18 level. Since then, muscle memory kicked in quickly and I managed to get to 87.5kg/192lb in a month as I made myself a new lean mass diet, restricting my carb intake but increasing my protein intake drastically. I still wasn't happy with my progress and decided to try Anavar as I had seen in the past that it was a mild oral steroid and decided rather to spend my money on 100x10mg tabs that an expensive supplement that would yield less results. I gained 2.5kgs/5.5lbs in 33days doing 30mg a day whilst taking one tab every 8 hours. A month later I tried an oral Turanabol(50 tabs)-Anavar(50 tabs) course taking 40mg a day for 25days and gained another 2.5kg/5.5lbs. Off both courses I got a bit vascular and slightly leaner whilst getting a harder looking build, but only slightly, andam currently sitting at about 9% b/f. To be honest, I don't regret it because I find it really hard to pick up mass no matter how much I eat for whatever period of time (I think my motabolism is pretty high). I didn't encounter any bad sides, but the weight I got to is still very far away from my goal for early next year which is to be 100kg/220lbs to a maximum lifetime weight of 105kg/231.5lbs which would be perfect for Rugby and my position.

The past 2 oral courses weren't really a way to gain mass for Rugby, but rather just for a confidence booster to get back into the swing of things. However, I'm seriously considering an injectable course for next year seeing I want to continue playing but need to pick up a lot of mass for my position. Now I realise I'm going to get a ton of hate against me because of my age as I've seen on this site and by reading other threads on other sites... But I really plead you guys who know a lot more about this stuff than I do, even though I would regard myself as relatively knowledgeable in this department purely because I literally have spent about 100 hours doing internet research of various other people's accounts and dealings with various AAS's. I'm begging you guys to be civil with your replies and to please help me before I decide to take the plunge...

I've been thinking of trying a 10 week cycle of Equipoise and Test (Enanthate, Cypionate or a "Supertest") followed by 3 weeks of Clomid starting on week 13. I will keep Arimidex on hand as an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) incase of any signs of gyno etc. I truly believe this will be a once off course that will help me as I'm not the wealthiest of guys and can't afford the best supplements, the best protein-enriched foods and/or even a personal trainer which I think some of you may suggest. I believe a once off proper course like his will seriously help me as the sad fact in today's age is that many people my age who are also trying to compete succeed in doing so with the help of steroids which makes it impossible for guys like me to get anywhere as I'm just so much smaller. Any advice, tips, concerns are all welcome and I look forward to receiving some good advice!
 
Hey I'm sure you know your young for it but that's your choice. Your natural test is through the roof already just have your parents buy foods for a solid diet and you will blow up. If you do decide to do the cycle just stick to test for the first time cause if something goes wrong you won't know what compound giving you side affects.
 
Hey Ambitionzcs

Yeah I realise that I am really young for it, but its not something that I've simply decided on in a few weeks like many guys my age. I first made up my mind roughly a year ago, but decided to wait it out and find out as much information as I could in order to broaden my knowledge about as many types of steroids that I could so that I could find out exactly what to take to obtain maximum results in the safest manner, so that I don't do my body more harm than good.

I would get my parents to buy me lots of food such as lots of complex carbs and good sources of protein, but its becoming too expensive for them to be constantly buying me these types of food insuch large quantities, which they have been doing for a few years now. Regardless, I still follow a strict diet which is balanced in order to ensure that I as the correct stuff. Like I said, I'm not the wealthiest guy around, but I've been working and saving for a few months now and have saved up sufficient cash to spend on a once-off course like this. I do realise that doing this could possibly mess up my HPTA function for life along with many other things, but I think I will have enough stuff to help me counter-act the sides effects and prevent long term damage.

Ok I will definately consider your advice, thanks for helping me out, but before I actually do decide to go out and do this I have a few more questions that I'm hoping you guys can help me out with.

Firstly, Ambitionzcs, what history do you have with AAS's? Have you personally taken them before, and if so at what age with what course? Please excuse me if I seem rude, as that's not my intention at all, but I just want to make sure that I'm getting advice from somebody who genuinely knows what he's talking about. Secondly, if I do decide to take Test only, do I need to frontload that with an oral steroid? Also what Test do you recommend I take and for how long? I understand that the longer the ester, the further spaced out the injection days will have to be which I would prefer over something such as Test Prop which is EOD if I'm not mistaken? If I keep Arimidex on hand incase of gyno, and buy Clomid as a PCT, will that be enough to ensure I don't screw myself up? I also wanted to know what are my expected gains from a Test only cycle, if I ensure I get atleast one day of rest a week and follow a strict diet and a proper training routine?

So far I'm thinking of doing this:
Week 1-10 : 350mg/ml of Test (not sure which one)
Week 1-4 : possibly Anavar/Winstrol(oral)/Dbol(oral) at 30mg-40mg a day
Week 13-16 : Clomid (not sure what dosage?)
*Arimidex on hand as an AI

I'm sorry for all the questions, but I don't wanna mess myself up for the rest of my life and I want to ensure that I maximise my results as much as possible so that I don't have to rely on using juice again until I'm much older. Please understand that I'm doing this in order to compete with guys who are much bigger and stronger than me, who seem to have an advantage over me because of their size and strength from previous injectable steroid use. I really appreciate your help, and ask anyone to please voice their opinion as I need all the advice I can get from as many people as possible who are willing to help me out! Thanks once again.
 
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Hey Ambitionzcs

Yeah I realise that I am really young for it, but its not something that I've simply decided on in a few weeks like many guys my age. I first made up my mind roughly a year ago, but decided to wait it out and find out as much information as I could in order to broaden my knowledge about as many types of steroids that I could so that I could find out exactly what to take to obtain maximum results in the safest manner, so that I don't do my body more harm than good.

I would get my parents to buy me lots of food such as lots of complex carbs and good sources of protein, but its becoming too expensive for them to be constantly buying me these types of food insuch large quantities, which they have been doing for a few years now. Regardless, I still follow a strict diet which is balanced in order to ensure that I as the correct stuff. Like I said, I'm not the wealthiest guy around, but I've been working and saving for a few months now and have saved up sufficient cash to spend on a once-off course like this. I do realise that doing this could possibly mess up my HPTA function for life along with many other things, but I think I will have enough stuff to help me counter-act the sides effects and prevent long term damage.

Ok I will definately consider your advice, thanks for helping me out, but before I actually do decide to go out and do this I have a few more questions that I'm hoping you guys can help me out with.

Firstly, Ambitionzcs, what history do you have with AAS's? Have you personally taken them before, and if so at what age with what course? Please excuse me if I seem rude, as that's not my intention at all, but I just want to make sure that I'm getting advice from somebody who genuinely knows what he's talking about. Secondly, if I do decide to take Test only, do I need to frontload that with an oral steroid? Also what Test do you recommend I take and for how long? I understand that the longer the ester, the further spaced out the injection days will have to be which I would prefer over something such as Test Prop which is EOD if I'm not mistaken? If I keep Arimidex on hand incase of gyno, and buy Clomid as a PCT, will that be enough to ensure I don't screw myself up? I also wanted to know what are my expected gains from a Test only cycle, if I ensure I get atleast one day of rest a week and follow a strict diet and a proper training routine?

So far I'm thinking of doing this:
Week 1-10 : 350mg/ml of Test (not sure which one)
Week 1-4 : possibly Anavar/Winstrol(oral)/Dbol(oral) at 30mg-40mg a day
Week 13-16 : Clomid (not sure what dosage?)
*Arimidex on hand as an AI

I'm sorry for all the questions, but I don't wanna mess myself up for the rest of my life and I want to ensure that I maximise my results as much as possible so that I don't have to rely on using juice again until I'm much older. Please understand that I'm doing this in order to compete with guys who are much bigger and stronger than me, who seem to have an advantage over me because of their size and strength from previous injectable steroid use. I really appreciate your help, and ask anyone to please voice their opinion as I need all the advice I can get from as many people as possible who are willing to help me out! Thanks once again.
just cuz you feel like you waited a year and done your research but it isn't ok. Regardless if you think your ready or not and you waited a year. Dude your 18. Heres good advice n say fuck it. You don't need gear and I almost guarantee no one is gonna help you because your too young and stupid. You already have crazy hormones pumping through your body and when you put crazy synthetic hormones in you is bad shit. Go read. You'll find out a lot of kids that do steroids end up getting terrible depression from all the elevated hormones. Youll shut your natty test levvels and probably after a few cycles your gonna feel like a 35 year old off cycle when you should be crazy with test through you. You also probably will be on testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) and will have to take test shots just to function for the rest of your life. So ask those guys how that works out.
 
@ Bigherm2121

Yeah I see where you're coming from man, thanks for your advice, it's much appreciated. I've always had that on my mind and have always looked at this as a last resort. It really does suck being smaller than my competition though, especially when I know the majority of them are jacked. Would it be realistically possible for me to pick up 10kgs (22lbs) without getting like fat in like 6 months? I can assure you that I train my ass off, and eat well, but everything I try doesn't seem to be working as I feel like I keep going through plateau after plateau.

I don't know, maybe my training schedule is wrong or something, cos I can't seem to break the 92kg (203lb) mark... I even change my program every 3-6 weeks, and I still don't seem to be getting bigger.This is what my program looks like:

DAY 1(Back and Bi's): Bent Over Rows (4 sets of 8 reps at 100kg/220lbs)
Lat Pull Downs (4 sets of 8-12 reps at 90kg/198lbs)
Single Arm DB Rows (3 sets of 8 reps at 45kg/99lbs)
T-Bar Rows (5 sets of 12 reps at 60kg/132lbs)
Reverse Flyes (4 sets of 12 reps with 14kg DB's)
Standing Barbell Curls (5 sets of 8-10reps at 50kg/110lbs)
Preacher Curls (5 sets of 10reps at 40kg/88lbs)
Hammer Curls (4 sets of 8 reps at 24kg/53lbs)
EZ Bar & Hammer Superset (4 sets of 16reps)

DAY 2 (Chest and Tri's): Bench Press (4 sets of 12-6 reps-100kg/110kg/110kg/120kg)
Incline DB Press (4 sets of 8 reps at 45-50kg/99-110lbs)
Flat DB Flyes (4 sets at 12 reps at 30kg/66lbs)
Cable Crossovers (4 sets at 12-8 reps)
Dips (4 sets of 12 reps)
Tricep Extensions (6 sets of 8 reps at 90kg/198lbs)
Reverse Tricep Extensions (6 sets of 12reps at 40kg/88lbs)
Kickbacks (4 sets of 12reps at 14kg/30lbs)

DAY 3 (Legs) *Alternate Routine*
Leg Press (10 sets of 12 reps at 270kg/595lbs)
Squats (6 sets of 15-8reps 100kg/120kg/120kg/140kg/140kg/150kg)
Barbell Lunges (4 sets of 8reps/leg at 80kg/176lbs)
Reverse Hack Squat (6 sets of 10reps at 80kg/176lbs)
Leg Extensions (4 sets of 15 reps at 70kg/155lbs)
**then next session**
Leg Press (10 sets of 12 reps at 270kg/595lbs)
Squats (6 sets of 15-8reps 100kg/120kg/120kg/140kg/140kg/150kg)
Deadlift (4 sets of 10-6reps at 100kg/120kg/120kg/130kg)
Lying Leg Curls (8 sets of 12 reps at 45kg/99lbs)
DB Lunges (6sets of 10reps with 30kg/66lb DB's)

I then repeat that workout and have atleast one rest day per week whilst mixing up my workout every few weeks so that I shock my body into growing. I also try stay away from training shoulders a lot, as I busted my right shoulder this season and I'm trying to let it get back to normal before I start training them again. However, I keep going through plateau after plateau and I can't seem to work out what to do. I'm desperate to get bigger, my legs in particular, but don't seem to be able to put on any more mass no matter how hard I train, or how many complex carbs I eat or how much protein I try get my hands on either. I would like to gain like 10kgs/22lbs on my legs which I feel are my weekest part of my build. I'm currently weighing 92kg (203lbs) and stand at 1.79m tall. Please help me to figure out what I need to change, I'm desperate to getting bigger so that I have a chance with playing my sport. Thanks for all your help, its much appreciated!
 
Where's shoulders. I don't like two body parts. I do this
Day chest
Day back
day Shoulders
DayLegs
Day Bis tris
 
Shoulder's busted from a tackle this season, but will try ease my way into it...
I went through a stage where I was training like that, but stopped after 3 months as is wasn't making much difference to my strength, size or body mass, all of which I was and am still currently trying to increase. But I will try doing that, will see how it goes, thanks.

Just a few questions. Because I am so young and my nat test levels are high, shouldn't I be training with my usual 3 day double-body-part sessions twice a week? If I start isolating each muscle group like that, should I just increase the number of sets & exercises but ensure I stay under an hour's training to stay away from going catabolic? Will I yield greater results by isolating as much as you do with your training days, or do you only train like that because you're limited to time in the gym each day?
 
Well because I want to gain as much LEAN muscle mass, I try eat less carbs than usual when trying to bulk up. I also try eat every 3 hours, whilst making sure I get in atleast 40-50grams of protein with the meal that I eat.

Breakfast: 6 slices of Cape Seedloaf, 2 Chicken Fillets (without skin), 1 banana, 750ml Water
Mid-Meal: 1 Tin of canned tuna, 100grams of raw almonds
Lunch: 4 slices of Cape Seedloaf, 1 chicken fillet, Whey Protein with lowfat milk (1 scoop ony-20grams of Protein)
Mid-Meal: Whey Protein (1 scoop only-20grams of Protein), 1 chicken fillet
*Gym (no pre-workout used eg: NO Booster etc)*- followed by 2 scoops of Whey Protein with milk (40grams of Protein + 10grams Protein from milk)
Supper: 350-400grams of red meat, 2 sweet potatoes, salad/steamed vegetables
Before Bed: Whey Protein with milk (1 scoop only)

I can't afford to buy large quantities of better forms of Protein such as salmon etc, but I'm willing to try things out for a month and see how expensive it gets. Any suggestions would be much appreciated!
 
I have done 2 cycle now im now on my second cycle of test e, tren h, and winstrol which I am running for 14 weeks.
week 1-14 - test at 400mg a week spread out into eod injections to match the tren
week 1-12 - tren at 450mg a week eod
week 8-14 - Winstrol at 100mg eod
week 1-14 - adex .5 ed
week 14-20 - aromasin 25mg ed
week 16-20 - pct nolvadex and clomid 40/40/20/20 - 100/50/50/50

I am currently on week 10 and the winstrol is now kicking in. I am loving this cycle btw.
my first cycle was test e only for 12 weeks and i gained around 20 pounds and maintained around 15 pounds of solid mass.

Id say you could gain a very large amount of mass if you bulked or ate really clean since its your first time on test e with adex through the cycle. If you wanted to do a shorter cycle then go with the test p as it will kick in faster then the enathate. I personally like test e alot with adex to stop the bloat. kicks in around week 5 for me.
 
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Well because I want to gain as much LEAN muscle mass, I try eat less carbs than usual when trying to bulk up. I also try eat every 3 hours, whilst making sure I get in atleast 40-50grams of protein with the meal that I eat.

Breakfast: 6 slices of Cape Seedloaf, 2 Chicken Fillets (without skin), 1 banana, 750ml Water
Mid-Meal: 1 Tin of canned tuna, 100grams of raw almonds
Lunch: 4 slices of Cape Seedloaf, 1 chicken fillet, Whey Protein with lowfat milk (1 scoop ony-20grams of Protein)
Mid-Meal: Whey Protein (1 scoop only-20grams of Protein), 1 chicken fillet
*Gym (no pre-workout used eg: NO Booster etc)*- followed by 2 scoops of Whey Protein with milk (40grams of Protein + 10grams Protein from milk)
Supper: 350-400grams of red meat, 2 sweet potatoes, salad/steamed vegetables
Before Bed: Whey Protein with milk (1 scoop only)

I can't afford to buy large quantities of better forms of Protein such as salmon etc, but I'm willing to try things out for a month and see how expensive it gets. Any suggestions would be much appreciated!

First, don't cycle. Second, IMO you are taking too many shakes. You are talking about money, but real food tends to be cheaper. And better. I only do a shake PWO. Change out those shakes with some type of fish, more chicken, and throw in some veggies like broccoli. PWO do something like shake, bagel, something like that. Diets 80 percent. gear will just fuck you up right now. Also, eating less carbs is not really the right thing to do, when bulking clean/dirty whatever. you need some oatmeal or brown rice, sweet potatoes, stuff like that.
 
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Also, eating less carbs is not really the right thing to do, when bulking clean/dirty whatever. you need some oatmeal or brown rice, sweet potatoes, stuff like that.
Yeah don't think I'm gonna cycle just yet, will rather wait til I'm atleast 21 before I decide to do anything like that. Would rather stick my head down and eat shite loads more of some quality food. Yeah ok I see, thanks Ambitionzcs. I've begun to mix and match my diet this morning, which di include 1 scoop of Whey (20grrams Protein) but will start to cut down on the Whey a lot more.... For breakfast I ate 2x 150gram steaks with a shake consisting of 1 scoop of Whey, 300ml of low fat milk, 200grams of raw oats, a banana and a teaspoon of honey. I also heard about brocholli having some anabolic effect, is that true? Will cntinue to eat more solid food and get in as many complex carbs as I can before 6 at night. Appreciate ur help man, thanks!
 
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