New to TRT Therapy with a few questions

[Xander24]

Hey guys,

Came across this forum while researching TRT as I am just beginning my second week (3rd pin total).

I'm 35 years old
Weight 89kg
BF: 12%
Been lifting since I was 20, and I have done numerous steroid cycles. Mainly 300mg prop with masteron and HCG, all with standard PCT's.

Three years ago I wanted to do another cycle so I went in for pre cycle blood work. I had noticed I had a very low sex drive and was having trouble losing belly fat. Surely enough I had low testosterone. I couldn't find a good doctor but settled with one and had to beg him to test what I wanted. The results came in as follows:

September 2011

Total Test: 9.8 (11.5-32.0)
FSH: 2.3 (1.5-13)
LH: 2.2 (2.0-10.0)
SHBG: 26 (15-50)
DHEAS: 10.9 (2.5-13)

The doctor wouldn't test E2 and also didn't want to test FSH and LH because "they are female hormones". That was pretty much the end of the conversation and I let him get back to writing sick chits. Couldn't believe what I was hearing. I went to a few more doctors and got pretty much the same thing. One recommended me to an endocrinologist but I was uninsured at the time and simply did not have the money to go. From what I understand they are pretty anti HRT in Sydney Australia anyhow and are only interested in treating thyroid disorders. So I was able to talk him into prescribing me HCG as I wanted to attempt a restart. I ordered some Clomid, Aromasin, and Torem. I commenced with the HCG blast for 10 days 500iu/ day. 12.5mg Aromasin EOD. Then I waited 3 days and started 30mg of Clomid and 60mg of Torem ED for 6 weeks. I simply can't handle any more of 30mg of clomid. Even that dose is miserable with extreme anger and visual tracers. I'm as mad as a hornet on the stuff and a real dickhead. I waited 5 weeks after I stopped the clomid/Torem therapy and went and got tested again. Not much of a change:

Total Test: 10.5 (11.5-32.0)
FSH: 3.6 (1.5-13)
LH: 3.0 (2.0-10.0)
SHBG: 25 (15-50)
DHEAS: 10.7 (2.5-13)

The doctor still wasn't interested in HRT so i went to few more to no avail. At that point I was fed up so I decided to just do a cycle. That pretty much solved my problem and I had cruised and blasted from 2012 to January 2015. When i decided to come off, do a HCG Blast and then PCT of Torem and clomid and let myself crash as I had found a doctor who specialised is longevity and HRT. I do know that staying on so long was a dumb thing, but i had already tried a restart and i met my fiancé mid cycle and did not want to come off and not be able to have sex with her. I was a machine and wanted to keep things good while we were in the honeymoon phase.

So my last pin was January 3rd and I commenced the HCG blast on January 8th for 10 days with 12.5 Aromasin EOD. For 3 weeks I was the horniest I have been in years. Sex 3 times a day and great sensation. Morning wood, and evening wood. It was awesome. Then I started the clomid and Torem 3 days after. Crashed hard. I mean no sex drive. No wood ever. It has been like that since.

I went to the specialist, and he did the most thorough tests ever. A special urine sample collection 5 times throughout a 24 hour period along with comprehensive blood work. The urine test came out OK.

Progesterone metabolites were normal
Prolactine metabolites were normal
Cortisol metabolites were high
Estrogen metabolites were high
Testosterone metabolites were low

Bloodwork:
Total Test: 6.1 (11.5-32.0)
Free Test: 119 (170-500)
FSH: <1 (1-8)
LH: <1 (2-8)
SHBG: 31 (15-50)
Oestradiol: 159 (<150)
1GF1: 11 (30-50)
I am vitamin D, K2 and A deficient.

So I was diagnosed as testosterone deficient as well as HGH deficient. I did not share my history of cycling with him. I also showed signs of internal inflammation as well as a genetic abnormality to where I can't metabolise folate. So I have been prescribed a mother load of vitamins, minerals, optimised folate, probiotics, Ipamorline and CJC-1295 no DAC, and primoteston (Test E 250mg/week) with 500iu of HCG/week to give me the best chance to have children.

I've been taking the Ipamorline and CJC 1295 for a week now 200mcg 3 x a day and I have to say the stuff is awesome. The mental clarity and sleep are amazing. That stuff is getting my brain to pump about 4 iu of HGH a day and I love it. The vitamins and probiotics are working as well. My skin is clearing up, and I've become more regular in my bowl movements. I never did stop the gym throughout any of this, and have maintained my strength, and I am still hitting it 5 times a week. I am now also riding a bike to and from work 5 times a week totalling 20km a day. For oestrogen management he said he wanted to try a product called Meta-I-3c which "is designed to promote healthy estrogen metabolism and balance by featuring indole-3-carbinol (I3C), a naturally occurring compound found in cruciferous vegetables such as broccoli, Brussels sprouts, and cabbage. Through its ability to promote the breakdown of estrogen to its beneficial, protective metabolite—2-hydroxy estrone—indole-3-carbinol may be a safe and effective way to help achieve beneficial balance in estrogen metabolism." If this fails to get my E2 down we will move to an AI.

I'm also taking a few other things for brain health and function such as nootropics. All under this physicians supervision. I am eating nothing but super foods. This is a total life style change. But the reason I am doing it is because i want to provide my fiancé with the strongest me a good sex life and a happy and healthy relationship.

So while I am dialling in I just want some reassurance as I won't be seeing the doc for another 9 weeks. This is all very expensive and I can't afford to keep going back every week. It has been 1 week of this regimen. I have now taken 3 shots at 125mg of test E. I am still not horny and have maybe gotten hard twice in the last week. Now that is two more times than the last 2.5 months, so that's improvement, but is this normal? How long does it generally take for sex drive to return? My poor fiancé. I feel so bad for her. She is hot and deserves so much better than no sex.

Is 1 week too early to worry? I have never really taken test E and always used prop, which took no time at all to fire me up. Any advice is appreciated. I have read the TRT overview by Megaton and I know he says 3-6 weeks and sometimes longer, but I just thought I'd be popping morning wood by now. Can I front load for a week, or should i just chill? I just want my sex drive back and hope that week two and 3 will provide me with morning wood at least. Thanks in advance for any advice or reassurance.

 

[Chiefy]

1 week isn't nearly long enough to see significant results. It takes many guys a few months to get dialed in and for symptoms to resolve.

I don't think that this protocol is ideal for you anyway. Based on your pre treatment bloodwork, you seem to be prone to higher than normal estradiol. I'd expect that to continue, especially on a testosterone dose of 250mg/week.

I don't know anything about the supplement that your doctor has suggested for estradiol management but generally speaking, natural AI supplements (zinc, DIM) are only going to help when estradiol needs to be brought down by a small amount. They usually won't effectively take the place of a prescription AI when estradiol is super high.

If your estradiol is too high, you're definitely going to experience low libido and erectile dysfunction.

250mg of testosterone per week may not seem like a lot to somebody who has cycled in much larger doses, but it's a monster dose for TRT. Estradiol will be an issue for just about anyone on that dose. And it's pretty likely that your other hormones will reach supra physiological levels on such a high dose. The goal of TRT is to replace testosterone so the user reaches adequate blood levels, not mild cycle levels. Running high doses for long periods of time is going to lead to problems down the road.

Obviously, bloodwork is needed to determine your need for a given dose, but I'd be shocked if you required 250mg/week to achieve normal testosterone levels.

 

[Xander24]

Thanks. I was actually thinking the same thing. The problem I'm facing is that the primotestin is in one ampule dosed at 250mg, but it doesn't have markers to show the breakdown of the whole CC. It's easy to breakdown halfway, but it would be difficult to break it down in 5ths to accurately dose 50 or 60mg. Does anybody else face this problem, and if so how do you overcome it? I'm happy to lower my dose, but want to get it right every shot. Also I have aromasin on hand, should I also hit 12.5mg EOD?

 

[johnfromeurope]

U take the syringe and take .33 ml out, three times, whats the problem?

 

[Xander24]

It's a prepackaged syringe with no markers. The syringe is just clear, so it's guess work deciding exactly where the .33 is. I guess I can get a ruler and a sharpie and mark the clear syringe myself.

 

[Chiefy]

It's a prepackaged syringe with no markers. The syringe is just clear, so it's guess work deciding exactly where the .33 is. I guess I can get a ruler and a sharpie and mark the clear syringe myself.

Do you have a link or picture of the syringe? I've never seen a syringe that doesn't have measurements on it before. It would be pretty odd for a medical instrument designed to administer medication to lack any sort of marking.

 

[Albiedamned]

Draw the contents of the prepackaged syringe out with a properly marked syringe and dose accordingly. In a 1 ml syringe with standard markings, you can dose to .01 cc accurately. However since most ampules and prepackaged syringes are slightly overdosed, I'd use a 3cc syringe and you can dose to .1cc accuratly with no problem, or use this to backfill smaller syringes. Etc.

 

[Xander24]

Yes, crapy pic but it's all I can get off the net. It's made by Bayer:

rxmedicalwarehouse.com/image/cache/data/primoteston_depot-500x500.jpg

 

[Albiedamned]

Well there you go. Use this syringe/needle combo to fill your 1cc syringes with whatever dosage you need, attach a nice shiny new sterile 29g 5/8 inch needle and pin away.

 

[Xander24]

Ok, so I stick the syringe/ needle combo up the Bayer syringe and extract it rather than take the plunger out , squirt it in, then put the plunger back on. Got it, thanks.

Any tips on Aromasin dosage? I'm going into this with elevated estrogen levels so I want to get that down. Is 12.5 mg/day too much? Just want my libdo back. The last 2 nights of woken up with wood, so that is progress.

 

[Albiedamned]

Well actually I'd use the bayer syring to fill up the syringes you plan to use for injecting. It'll be easier to manage. Just pull them back to the level you need without a needle on, put the bayer needed into it, and gently fill it up. Cap it with a needle and move on to the next syringe.

 

[Xander24]

Nice, now that's a plan. Thanks mate, much appreciated.

 

[Albiedamned]

You're welcome and good luck. I won't presume to offer suggestion on the aromasin, as I don't play with dosages that require it for my body. I will suggest extra labs after you start to see what this dosage does for you and from that you can get a better idea if it's even needed. Also check out the stickies on estrogen management. They are helpful.

 

[Chiefy]

Yes, crapy pic but it's all I can get off the net. It's made by Bayer:

rxmedicalwarehouse.com/image/cache/data/primoteston_depot-500x500.jpg

Interesting. Hard to tell exactly what's going on in the picture but it looks like a prefilled syringe.

I'd just use it to backfill some insulin syringes to your desired dose.

Pull the plunger out of an insulin syringe and use the Bayer syringe to fill it to the desired volume. Then put the plunger back in, expell the air, and recap until you use it. Be sure to avoid allowing any contamination while doing this.

 

[NCallo]

Thanks. I was actually thinking the same thing. The problem I'm facing is that the primotestin is in one ampule dosed at 250mg, but it doesn't have markers to show the breakdown of the whole CC. It's easy to breakdown halfway, but it would be difficult to break it down in 5ths to accurately dose 50 or 60mg. Does anybody else face this problem, and if so how do you overcome it?

I'm using the same product, try this: Buy an empty sterilised sealed 10ml vial. Inject the contents of your pre-filled syringe/s into the vial. Then withdraw whatever dose you need from your new multi-dose vial.

 

[Albiedamned]

I'm using the same product, try this: Buy an empty sterilised sealed 10ml vial. Inject the contents of your pre-filled syringe/s into the vial. Then withdraw whatever dose you need from your new multi-dose vial.

Also a very good solution. As would be buying a sterile sealed vial from a research chemical store like that lion thingy up on top of this page.

 

[Xander24]

Also a very good solution. As would be buying a sterile sealed vial from a research chemical store like that lion thingy up on top of this page.

Awesome. All good ideas and glad to have options. Thanks guys, Second week down of TRT on Friday and I'm feeling better. Waking up with good wood every night now. I'm reducing my Aromasin dose down to 6.25 ED starting today to see how I go. Again, thanks for the input, guys. Good to know there is support here.