Overtrained For Almost 10 Years Straight....

[LongBeach_Patriot]

Hey guys, this is my first post here:

I have over-trained for about 8-9 years consistently (no joke). I am now 30, and since I was about 21 I would train hard almost every day. For a couple years I was training hard 6x/week and one light day. Then I added in one rest day. I would take off 2 or 3 days here and there and a rest week maybe once per year. I did cardio almost every training day for about 45 minutes, which I now realize was way to much; and a lot of it was moderate to high intensity cardio. In the past 2 months my body has completely broken down. I have many nagging muscle injuries and pain. My knees are in great pain as well, one of my major concerns. Knees are slightly better since I cut down/out cardio for the past few weeks but still a lot of pain. I recently obtained medical insurance for he first time in about 10 years so I am only now able to get bloodwork/mri's, ect. My blood work came back very good with the only issue being my T was low (this is weird because my energy level, physique, aggression is that of something with High T). It came in at 279. I feel this may be from overtraining. I am going this week to my GP to see the recent test results and if T is still low he is going to prescribe me a Test-supplement such as androgel.

Besides good genetics, my diet is nearly perfect; I take every important vitamin, natural anti-inflammatories, and use supplements to help recovery, muscle preservation and protein synthesis. I am 5'8" about 160-165 lbs, very lean, and have a well built physique (I dont want to come off cocky, but I would consider myself in better shape than 80-90% of the population)

Recently I injured my right Sartorius leg muscle. I took off a week, then resumed exercise but it wouldn't heal. I started PT a few weeks ago and it has helped only a little. I am very disconcerted in general but especially with this injury because I will warm it up, stretch it, and then later the muscle will be very sore and tender. It's like if you don't stretch it, it re-pulls, and if you do-stretch it, it re-pulls. I am very worried about this injury as it has debilitated my way of life and what I love to do; Train.

Last week I threw down my cards and decided to take 2 full weeks off to try and reset my CNS and heal my injuries. Today starts week 2. To be honest my injuries are still prevalent and I feel like doing the most harmless action triggers a pain response from some of muscle injuries. Simply stretching my shoulders the other day triggered a small re-strain on my right pec. Then this morning, doing nothing out of the ordinary my right tricep strained slightly(and this was one of the injuries I thought had healed up by now).

I would really appreciate your advice as to how to go about recovering my body from years of punishment and lack of time to recover. I assume that my body adjusted to not recovering for so long that this is actually a shock to it and it takes a little time for the body to equal itself out again. I've been going to acupuncture, I go to PT, use a foam roller, roller stick; Anything that can help me.

When I come back I am changing my whole regiment: weight training 5x/week, and cardio 3-4x/week. Less volume of weights as well. I have/had very long workout sessions.

I feel that my scenario is very specific and not so common especially how long and hard I have over-trained. Its amazing I haven't broken down already. I think that at 30 my body cant recover as fast and allow me to keep training without injury. I'm not old by any means but we all surely recover faster at 21 than we do at 30.

I may have not supplied enough pertinent info for you to properly advise me so please let me know if you need more info.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR HELP.

Michael

 

[dave1966]

I was there once, young and dumb and always thought more was better. I wised up before any serious injuries though and cut my total workload and focused more on intensity and started growing again with good quality gains. Give your body plenty of time to recover and listen to it, it will let you know when it's time.

I hit the weights on average 5x a week with a 4 day split and hit cardio 3x a week at around 30 minutes of intervals.

And 30 isn't anything, I'm 47 and found my body has a tremendous recovery ability. I just don't spend hours in the gym, I go in hit the weights and get out in an hour. With my splits thats easily accomplished, 2 days on and 1 day off has been working great for me. The best I've felt in years, no joint aches and I can actually get good quality sleep.

 

[Ocdude]

I'm not much older than you, LB.... but I can totally relate to the changes that happen from 21 to 30! I think you'll be surprised what a month or so off will do. The occasional de-load or complete off time is a great thing, and your body needs it. I'd highly encourage you to let your leg heal before you get back into hitting it heavy again. In the meantime, following a couple weeks off, you can work arms, chest, upper back, shoulders, etc.

Don't let it keep you down, just work around it!

 

[iwillsucceed]

i always "overtrain"

 

[XELFLEC]

i always "overtrain"

It's your set motherfucker Go.


But yea at 32 and almost 2 years deep into training hard, I'd say its the only way to go to grow.

 

[dave1966]

It's your set motherfucker Go.


But yea at 32 and almost 2 years deep into training hard, I'd say its the only way to go to grow.

It's a real fine line, you have to constantly push it.

 

[LongBeach_Patriot]

Going on week 3 now and the nagging pains are still prevalent. I got back some blood work and my T is pretty low, around 200. Was wondering if maybe that can contribute to slow healing.

 

[skinnypete]

It's your set motherfucker Go.


But yea at 32 and almost 2 years deep into training hard, I'd say its the only way to go to grow.

LOL Your up bitch.

 

[LongBeach_Patriot]

I went to a new PT today. He was VERY good. performs chiropractor and ART as well. Really knows his stuff. After going through the motions he came to the conclusion that the strain is not the Sartorius muscle but rather the Rectus Femorus at the hip insertion point. Thats right near the sartorius insertion point. Also, he saw a slight mis-alignment of my right hip, and some lower lumbar tightness. I had strained my psoas muscle last year and since then its always been tight, along with my iliac muscle. It appears that the issue is my back and hip. So we are going to PT em and correct/fix the problems. In the mean time I was advised only to use weight machine where my lower body is immobilized, no free weights. He wants no weight load at weird angles such as when taking and placing back weights (I actually do, hehe). Also light walk on treadmill and body weight squats. Looks like this transition back to the gym is going to be slowwwwwwwwww and arduous.

It sucks but I'll do what I gotta do. Muscle memory shall prevail, I hope.

 

[DreDay187]

It's a real fine line, you have to constantly push it.

In novices and intermediates the line really isn't that fine but you're absouktely correct when it comes to advanced and elite lifters. By definition a novice is able to recover from an adaptative disruption of homeostasis within 24-48hrs making it damn near impossible to over train.

 

[LongBeach_Patriot]

I am surely no novice

 

[DreDay187]

I am surely no novice

What makes you say that? Not saying you definitely are but I doubt we're using the same definitions to define novice, intermediate, advanced, and elite in the context of this conversation.

 

[prank]

53 years old and still over training

 

[LongBeach_Patriot]

What makes you say that? Not saying you definitely are but I doubt we're using the same definitions to define novice, intermediate, advanced, and elite in the context of this conversation.

So then please define your interpretation of a novice, int, and advanced bodybuilder>

 

[DreDay187]

So then please define your interpretation of a novice, int, and advanced bodybuilder>

Over training to me is

Over t raining is the cumulat ive resul t of
relentless high-volume or high- intensi ty t raining, or both,
wi thout adequate recovery, that resul ts in the exhaust ion of the
body's ability to recover and adapt . Th e pr ima ry diagnost ic
indicator is a reduct ion in per formance capaci ty that doesn' t
improve wi th an amount of rest that would normal ly result in
recovery. Al though the accepted (ACSM) defini t ion of
overtraining holds that recovery f rom i t requires no less than
two weeks, over t raining is relative to the level of the trainee,
and there are no hard and fast rules governing its onset or its
abatement . Even a heinous abuse of a novice wi th an
overwhelming workload, one that induces a loss of , performance ability, would resolve fairly quickly. Al though the
t ime frame would be compressed, the symptoms observed by
the coach would be those of over t raining. Al though
overtraining in the novice can occur, i t may not be easily
diagnosed because the magni tude of the loss of performance
might be difficult to perceive, due both to a lack of training
history for compar ison and the low level of per formance
overall (fig. 2-7). Onc e again, as wi th overreaching, the
over t rained intermediate fits the commonly accepted
ACSM/USOC defini t ion: an over t rained intermediate will not
be able to recover in less than two weeks. In the advanced
trainee, however , recovery is never planned to be complete for
a minimum of four weeks anyway, and for the elite trainee, i t
may be considerably longer than that . Th e existing definition is
inadequate for these trainees. It is also easier to diagnose
over t raining in advanced and elite trainees, since the
per formance reduct ion is qui te not iceable against the
background of an extensive t raining hi s tory and, presumably,
an established rate and pat tern of progress.
A working defini t ion of over t raining that applies to all
levels of t raining advancement requires a bet ter way to quantify
recovery t ime in each stage. Overtraining occurs when
performance does not recover wi thin one reduced-load
training cycle. The durat ion of that cycle wi l l vary according
to the athlete's level of advancement . For example, if a novice
training every 48 hour s has a wo r k o u t that is markedly off due
to excessive load in the previous workout , this will be apparent
during warm-up. His range of mot ion will be decreased due to
the soreness, and his bar speed will be not iceably slower and
more labored as the weight increases through the sets.

A novice is one who can recover from a training stress/stimulus that is effective at producing a desired adaptation in a period of ~24-48hrs. By definition, it makes it very difficult to overtrain bc a fatigue can be dissipated in one reduced training cycle of ~48hrs.

Intermediates require around 1wk (weekly programming with volume days, intensity days, light/active recovery days) to adapt to the stress.

Advanced athletes can take months and elite train in year long cycles at times.

My intent isnt to put you down at all, I was merely responding to the other poster's comment so please don't take it in a negative way brother. From the looks of your OP, you do suffer from classic symptoms of overtraining though. The general rule of thumb to get over it is you need deloads. If you quit liftin all together, the systemic fatigue you've accumulated by lifting and progressing will in fact dissipate but by not lifting you'll also end up de-training or losing strength and possibly mass. You need to reduce your weights by 20% or more (aka lower intensity), reduce sets and/or reps (lower volume). By doing this you can still keep your motor pathways fresh and active and still actively recover by giving reduced workloads which lower fatigue levels.

You've got to change your mentality of "working hard" in the gym, its not all abou time and frequency but about making the best use of limited time. I'd cut down to 3 maybe 4 training days a week, keep up some light cardio for cardiovascular health, focus on the big compound lifts and some accessories/assistance lifts BUT with the reduced intensity and volume. It may take a few months to completely bring your fitness up and fatigue down. You've also got to concentrate on letting injuries heal so they won't affect your progress in the future. I can go into more detail but would need more info from you about how to apply it but again, my statement previously wasn't to attack you.

*sorry about the format of the quote...copied it from a programming text and the format fucked up for some reason

 

[LongBeach_Patriot]

I would consider myself intermediate to advanced. I wasnt trying to be defensive if I came off that way sorry. I am not in week 3 of recovery/no gym training. Honestly the nagging injuries are still prevelant for the most part. Really not much improvement anywhere except my shoulders. Knees are still hurting, but thats also the next issue that Ill be addressing once the quad is healed up. IMO my low T has been making this healing process very slow. I just started Androgel so hopefully that will help. Its just very disconcerting that I havent touched a weight in almost 3 weeks and I still have nagging pains. 3 or 4 spots on my body where I strained a muscle and they re-appear from time to time. None of them ever tore seriously, just minor strains which I assume never healed fully or properly (tricep, calf, pec). Whats weird is that ALL of these nagging injuries and real injuries are on my right side. I just started up again with a good PT and he recommended light weights, only upper body machines only and walking on treadmill. He wants to correct my hip and back issue and I also need to rehab and heal my strained rectus femoris before any serious training. I weighed myself today and im only about 2 pounds less than I usually am while training normally. I've kept my calories up and clean. I noticed that I have lost some definition but thats normal and will return. The mass is still the same pretty much.

I may go back to training early next week, or go back next weekend and give myself a few more days. It would be nice if these pains went away but i dont see that happening. To be honest whenever I hurt, its usually more on rest days and on training days I feel better from the blood flow.

I gotta get healthy and back in biz, im buggin.

thanks for all the info though man its appreciated.

 

[DreDay187]

I would consider myself intermediate to advanced. I wasnt trying to be defensive if I came off that way sorry. I am not in week 3 of recovery/no gym training. Honestly the nagging injuries are still prevelant for the most part. Really not much improvement anywhere except my shoulders. Knees are still hurting, but thats also the next issue that Ill be addressing once the quad is healed up. IMO my low T has been making this healing process very slow. I just started Androgel so hopefully that will help. Its just very disconcerting that I havent touched a weight in almost 3 weeks and I still have nagging pains. 3 or 4 spots on my body where I strained a muscle and they re-appear from time to time. None of them ever tore seriously, just minor strains which I assume never healed fully or properly (tricep, calf, pec). Whats weird is that ALL of these nagging injuries and real injuries are on my right side. I just started up again with a good PT and he recommended light weights, only upper body machines only and walking on treadmill. He wants to correct my hip and back issue and I also need to rehab and heal my strained rectus femoris before any serious training. I weighed myself today and im only about 2 pounds less than I usually am while training normally. I've kept my calories up and clean. I noticed that I have lost some definition but thats normal and will return. The mass is still the same pretty much.

I may go back to training early next week, or go back next weekend and give myself a few more days. It would be nice if these pains went away but i dont see that happening. To be honest whenever I hurt, its usually more on rest days and on training days I feel better from the blood flow.

I gotta get healthy and back in biz, im buggin.

thanks for all the info though man its appreciated.

Many criticize me for this opinion but in my view most PT's are a waste of time and money. I'm a reader of the starting strength forums, Mark Rippetoe if you've heard the name, and am in complete agreement with most if not his views regarding injuries, programming, training, etc. the man knows the science, has worked and co-authored books with many many top level names in the lifting community, he has a great track record of success and he opines that PTs concentrate on certain aspects of "recovery" and whatnot that don't do much for healing. I'd possibly join his forums and look into his Q&A forum and see his thoughts on the matter.

Other potential options would be Dr. Kelly Starrett, foam rolling trouble areas, trigger point therapy, lacrosse balls in a sock and worked over trouble areas, dynamic and static stretching, and still lifting weights but again lower intensity and volume. Do 2-4 fu body workouts of compound lifts, don't let yourself get too detrained while recovering from injuries and the light weights shouldn't hinder your recovery IF you don't push yourself hard and focus on outstanding form. I would also guess the injuries to the right side only may be due to mobility and flexibility issues on that side. Asymmetrical flexibility is pretty common.

You def got to get healthy my man, its no fun being injured and out of the gym . Wish you the best of luck In a speedy, full, and great recovery brother. Keep us updated as to your progress and what seems to be helpin the most