took me 6 months to recover from test cycle because of painkillers

[fat_boy]

i just wanted to make this thread because i think someone may be able to benefit from this in the future cuz when you trained geared up shit can happen. this is also kind of a rant because i'm frustrated as hell.

some quick background

i was on a test/deca cycle in august and managed to really hurt myself, making a pre-existing lower back problem a lot worse. i should also probably mention that i was not aware i had a pre-existing back condition so it was kind of a freak thing. stupid docs told me i had nothing but a muscle strain for over 9 months and wouldn't give me an mri..... turns out i had a spondylolisthesis, fractured vertabrae and a bulging disc. and because i refused to take any meds for it for so long the pain became chronic. the doctors that i am with now explained to me that if you've had chronic pain for longer than a year it would be very hard to ever live pain free completely because your body remembers it. it was also a very poor decision on my part to start a cycle knowing something was wrong with me. the physical therapy i had fucked me up even more because they thought they were treating a muscle strain and had me doing stuff like back extensions which is murder for my back. they told me once i strengthened my abs and lower back more i'd be able to get everything under control....... hence i thought some deca with test wouldn't necessarily a bad idea. i know... stupid, stupid. i should've knew better. you live, you learn i guess
i had to stop lifting altogether for a while, over 6 months, i couldn't even do any push ups...... any type of force i exerted in any way shape or form absolutely killed my lower back.

first off let me ask, does anyone here have experience with doing a pct while on narcotic painkillers? in my experience, it really fuckin sucks !!!!!!!

but anyway, i hopped off the test/deca after being on it for close to 3 months or so and with all the narcotics made it very tough for me to recover... i started getting major gyno flare ups from that as well, luckily i was able to control them... somewhat at least. i still got gyno now but it's very very small, not big enough to get me upset about it.
at 5'7, i went from 194 lbs @ about <15% body fat to 172 @ like 17%+ bodyfat.

i was not able to get my test levels back up until i switched from harder painkillers like oxy, morphine, vic etc to tramadol. once i got on tramadol everything came back within a month or so. so remember, if you get into a situation like this and docs wanna give you vics or percs, ask your doctor for tramadol at least until your pct is done. now that i can somewhat lift again i'm still able to make decent progress with tramadol, got some of my strength back and cut down to 12% body fat, as opposed to the other painkillers which would've made it impossible for me to lift even a moderate amount of weight.

sorry for the rant and all i just had to get all of this out. i'm still mad as shit i ended up in this predicament. next step for me is gonna be getting of the pain pills, which really fuckin sucks too. does any body got any advice for me on that?

 

[Strong Man]

So are yu hooked on the pain pills? If not just stop taking them. So what are you doing for your back now?

 

[trophytaker]

suboxone,is what i used,and it works very well.

 

[hardtarget]

Thank you for the story. Pain killers can be a very dangerous drug.

 

[fat_boy]

So are yu hooked on the pain pills? If not just stop taking them. So what are you doing for your back now?

yep. it sucks. it's not the first time in my life either to be honest, that's what makes it even worse.

regarding my back, i will always have pain, but now that i actually know what's going on and studied it for many many months i'm getting back to the point that i'm still able to squat heavy and sumo deadlift with moderate weight. i had 2 procedures done on my back as well that helped a great deal. craziest thing i found out was the thing that helps me the most personally is working my hamstrings, not stretching though that could make it worse, just stiff legged deadlifts with moderate weight. it may aggrevate it a little that day but the whole next week i will feel significantly better. i also have to do real low intensity cardio, like heart rate @ no more than 120 - 125 or so, that helps me with the sciatica i experience in phases. lots of kettle bell work and hip flexor stretches seem to help a lot too.

@trophytaker, thanks for the tip. i was on suboxone a couple years ago for 3 years. in the end it just ended up stalling me for 3 years, i guess that medicine wasn't meant for me. i know it works for a lot of people. my goal was to taper it but that approach for quitting doesn't work for me, i have to go cold turkey and sweat that shit out for a couple days.


if anyone has any advice/tips for me, do share please

 

[bigkit34]

i just recently got off oxycodone last october and it was hell. torn rotator cuff few years back which is a long time out of the gym anyway but after i coulda started training again i was so hung up on the pills i didn't wanna do anything else. suboxone didn't work for me and i ended up going to rehab and stay clean through NA. if cold turkey doesn't work for ya then maybe that route can work for you too. good luck when you do decide to taper off and know your not alone on here. plenty of gymrats like us go through this at one point or another due to injuries

 

[Methodology]

smoke weed man, I hate marijuana highs, but they literally kill pain without being highly addictive or dangerous on cycle, I popped a disc out of my lower back a few years ago while working out, then was crunched over like an 80 year old man in agonizing pain, I got some joints off my buddy, and smoked the pain away, its not the most legal alternative, but I swear you will not be in as much pain, I would say at least 4h almost pain free.

 

[Mad- scientist]

Any form of opiates will lower testosterone and make healing a lot harder. And its extremelly dangerous to stop cold turkey because it can cause seizures. So how ever you chose to quit them it would be smart to talk it out with a doctor and make sure you have people around you who know how to handle any problems that could arise. Weed can help with withrawl symptoms but it is just another crutch in all honesty. Really all you can do is figure out how you are going to quit the pills and after about 2 weeks of not having any in your system the pain associated with detox will be gone. The first 5 days are the worse. Honestly though I would look into ways of how to manage the pain besides opiates. really no matter how painful it is taking opiates for it will just cause you way more problems in the long run. You will just build a tolerance and your chances of abusing the pills will go way up. The best advice to quit opiates is talk to a doctor figure out a game plan and just do it. There is no easy way to do it. My advice though would be stay away from anything depressing on t.v. or any sad music combining coming off of steroids and coming off of pills together makes you way more prone to depression. And detoxing from opiates is always different just since one time it wasnt that bad. Doesnt mean this time will be as easy. Just rent alot of funny movies and some cool video games and get really good food you enjoy to eat because it will be hard to eat. And try to have somebody who you love and realy care about available to call at any time or even have stay with you. The mental part of coming of opiates is way worse than the physical. And its good to have somebody who can let you know when you are loosing your grip on reality and getting to depressed about things. Hope fully some of that helps good luck man

 

[Mad- scientist]

Oh and I almost forgot buy a High quality expensive B vitamin complex , Multivitamins, coq10, fish oil, and take protein shakes through out the day when you can not eat. And drink alot of water to flush the toxins out of your system.

 

[Dr.Phoenix]

I have never heard that Pain killers can mess with Natty recovery , that is some interesting info ...
I will look for it

 

[AndreiD]

Very informative article and thanks for sharing your experience with us!

@Dr.Phoenix: From my understanding, not all painkillers can mess your testicle recovery, but only the super strong ones based on amphetamines or as Mad-scientist said "Any form of opiates will lower testosterone and make healing a lot harder". Despite the fact that tramadol is still considered a strong painkiller, it's nowhere near the stuff of the amphetamine derivatives.

I personally took Arcoxia in both 60mg and 120mg dosages after i got into some idiotic arm wrestling that led me to some serious pain in the forearm area on both hands.

 

[Dr.Phoenix]

^^ thx , i will look in to the subject

 

[fat_boy]

Any form of opiates will lower testosterone and make healing a lot harder. And its extremelly dangerous to stop cold turkey because it can cause seizures. So how ever you chose to quit them it would be smart to talk it out with a doctor and make sure you have people around you who know how to handle any problems that could arise. Weed can help with withrawl symptoms but it is just another crutch in all honesty. Really all you can do is figure out how you are going to quit the pills and after about 2 weeks of not having any in your system the pain associated with detox will be gone. The first 5 days are the worse. Honestly though I would look into ways of how to manage the pain besides opiates. really no matter how painful it is taking opiates for it will just cause you way more problems in the long run. You will just build a tolerance and your chances of abusing the pills will go way up. The best advice to quit opiates is talk to a doctor figure out a game plan and just do it. There is no easy way to do it. My advice though would be stay away from anything depressing on t.v. or any sad music combining coming off of steroids and coming off of pills together makes you way more prone to depression. And detoxing from opiates is always different just since one time it wasnt that bad. Doesnt mean this time will be as easy. Just rent alot of funny movies and some cool video games and get really good food you enjoy to eat because it will be hard to eat. And try to have somebody who you love and realy care about available to call at any time or even have stay with you. The mental part of coming of opiates is way worse than the physical. And its good to have somebody who can let you know when you are loosing your grip on reality and getting to depressed about things. Hope fully some of that helps good luck man

thanks for your input bro. like i've mentioned before i have detoxed off opiates before in my life, actually many times in an 8 year period that followed a very serious accident. but i was 100% clean from them for over 3 years. that's what makes this even worse on me mentally. honestly i'm not worried about the first 5 days, i worry about the following months after, that time is the hardest for me... it drags out. hopefully it won't be as long as it was last time. i'm also hoping the tramadol withdrawal will be milder or at least faster than say oxy withdrawal.

Very informative article and thanks for sharing your experience with us!

@Dr.Phoenix: From my understanding, not all painkillers can mess your testicle recovery, but only the super strong ones based on amphetamines or as Mad-scientist said "Any form of opiates will lower testosterone and make healing a lot harder". Despite the fact that tramadol is still considered a strong painkiller, it's nowhere near the stuff of the amphetamine derivatives.

I personally took Arcoxia in both 60mg and 120mg dosages after i got into some idiotic arm wrestling that led me to some serious pain in the forearm area on both hands.

do you mean opiate derivatives? i haven't heard of any amphetamine based painkillers.

 

[SolomonGrundy]

brother tramadols a devil drug, its worst than opioids to kick , get off it soon, before you get the brain zaps and leg spasms its hell for more than a week

 

[fat_boy]

yea i read about that. friggin sucks..... for the time being it was a better alternative than morphine or oxycodone though

 

[SolomonGrundy]

yea i read about that. friggin sucks..... for the time being it was a better alternative than morphine or oxycodone though

i can quit opiates way easier than tramadol, how much do you take right now? 50mg three times a day or more ?

after a few months you will feel fever and muscle pains every 6 hours if you don't take it, if you increase the dose you will have worse and worse withdraw, its a monster of a schedule 5 , i tapered off slowly and I still had three nights of leg cramps and fever, felt horrible for a week, and since its a SSRI its also going to give you potential suicidal thoughts. i hate that drug

 

[fat_boy]

i can quit opiates way easier than tramadol, how much do you take right now? 50mg three times a day or more ?

after a few months you will feel fever and muscle pains every 6 hours if you don't take it, if you increase the dose you will have worse and worse withdraw, its a monster of a schedule 5 , i tapered off slowly and I still had three nights of leg cramps and fever, felt horrible for a week, and since its a SSRI its also going to give you potential suicidal thoughts. i hate that drug

wow that sounds terrible. the fact that it's also like getting off an ssri is uncharted territory for me.

as of right now i take no less than 8 - 10 50mg pills a day in one go. half of the time i take a painkiller called nucynta @ about 800 - 1000mg a day. the nucynta is pretty strong with some wicked side effects but also seemed to not interfere with my hormone levels.

 

[Stone]

Tramadol will be much easier to detox from then morphine, oxy, ect. It is an opiate, however more specifically a nor opiate which works on the nu receptor while morphine acts on the mu receptor. Suboxone won't help as its a combo of another nor opiate buprenorphine, which is as strong or stronger then tramadol, and naltrexone which blocks the mu receptor from morphine, oxy, ect's actions. You'd basically just be staying on tramadol.
You know how to do this man. Hole up, sweat it out. Have meds for sides you know you will encounter ready and do not give yourself access to pills or a source. Keeping eating with good nutritional supplements will speed it up slightly, but mostly just make you feel better. And lastly I stress it will not be as physically taxing as the stronger meds. Like you said, staying off is where the game gets dicey.
Hit me up if you need any other suggestions. You got this

 

[fat_boy]

Tramadol will be much easier to detox from then morphine, oxy, ect. It is an opiate, however more specifically a nor opiate which works on the nu receptor while morphine acts on the mu receptor. Suboxone won't help as its a combo of another nor opiate buprenorphine, which is as strong or stronger then tramadol, and naltrexone which blocks the mu receptor from morphine, oxy, ect's actions. You'd basically just be staying on tramadol.
You know how to do this man. Hole up, sweat it out. Have meds for sides you know you will encounter ready and do not give yourself access to pills or a source. Keeping eating with good nutritional supplements will speed it up slightly, but mostly just make you feel better. And lastly I stress it will not be as physically taxing as the stronger meds. Like you said, staying off is where the game gets dicey.
Hit me up if you need any other suggestions. You got this

i appreciate it brother. i already got my clonidine and immodium ready. some gabapentin too but only if i really need it

it's kinda crazy how some people get the worst withdrawals ever off of tramadol and other people say it's just very minor

 

[gymlife159]

fat boy i feel what you are going thru. about a year ago i had a slight crushed foot injury from a high low reach truck.i was on a lot of stuff oxycontin, oxycodone,Fentanyl and then i to was on Tramadol for a short period of time and had a ruff time getting off. i was put on xanax and neurotin (gabapentin they say its for fever and so i would not get a seizure) for the anxiety of coming off the drug.. xanax does help but that is another drug that you do not want to take.. its all the devil in my eyes u have to use these other drugs to combat and get off another drug.. its a mess but now i am currently on Vistaril and im done taking that at the end of this month... basically its an up and down battle you have to have your head on rite and in good mind frame and just do what u got to do im in pain everyday but i will not go back on pain meds worst thing ever but the drs had me on it and i did need it at the time but coming off of everything is a biatch xanax did help with coming off of stuff but i must stress thats it is another bad drug added to the mix.. but i feel what you are going thru. you can get thru it.. best of luck to you.