Using Nolva to increase test levels?

[francosiciliano]

After reading some research that taking Nolva 20mg/day will increase test lvls on ave 143% why wouldn't it be safe and effective to just take nolva instead of taking AAS? The normal range for Testosterone, Serum 348-1197 ng/dL 01. So if you start out with let's say 500 which is on the low range of normal having an average increase of 143% would increase your test lvls to 1215 which is above the high end of normal. That seems very significant to me. I feel like I must be missing something here since ppl are always trying to find safer solutions to make gains even if you are making less gains the absence of the typical side effects seems attractive. Also nolva is cheap as hell.

 

[therion]

You wont see significant muscle grow if your test is increased 140%, also Nolva decrease IGF -1 hormone levels .And it possible that you will be shut down after discontinue the nolva . So it is a bad idea .

 

[Teutonic]

I ll bet that study was for low test types...if it were the cheap way to build muscle don t u think we d ALL BE running it ???

No offense but you got some seriously knowledgeable old bbder s on here...no question...well..uumm...is a bad one.

 

[Mrrippedzilla]

Nolva can certainly be used to boost your test levels BUT it will not in any way, shape or form, produce results even remotely comparable to an actual Test cycle.

A few examples of why its so inferior:

Neuroendocrine regulation of growth hormone and androgen axes by selective estrogen receptor modulators in healthy men. - PubMed - NCBI

- The increase in Test levels won't be as high as using actual Test (shocking I know).
- It reduces both IGF-1 & GH unlike Test.
- It increases SHBG and therefore limits free Test levels.

I should also point out that the 143% boost rarely occurs in guys with normal levels to begin with...50-70% is more like it.
Now if you were willing to spend the money and combine nolva/clomid with a few other compounds (GH/GH boosters, t3, etc) THEN you may see a more noticeable impact.

IMO, most people shouldn't bother to try and reinvent the wheel like this because they simply don't have the required knowledge to be able to do so with success

 

[Mrrippedzilla]

You wont see significant muscle grow if your test is increased 140%, also Nolva decrease IGF -1 hormone levels .And it possible that you will be shut down after discontinue the nolva . So it is a bad idea .

Nolva doesn't shut you down.

 

[francosiciliano]

I figured as much that taking nolva is less effective than AAS but that wasn't the purpose of my question. I agree everyone would be doing it if it was just as effective. My question was is it effective at all and why or why not. I like to engage in academic discussions purely for the sake of discussing a topic to gain a deep er understanding of how thinks work and why people do one thing vs another. Thx for the info

 

[tx045]

It would also be hepatoxic at the larger doses over the long periods of times you'd need

 

[francosiciliano]

Well I did a little test on myself.

Weeks 1-6

nolva 20ed
clomid 35ed
mk677 25mg ed

Weeks 7-8
nolva 20ed
clomid 35ed
mk677 25 eod and 12.5 on days I don't take 25mg
IGF1Lr3 80mcg eod on the same days I take 12.5mg of mk677

I feel great my strength has gone up very significantly and I have gained some weight as well. I did blood work 1month into this and my test levels went from 400 to 1100 and my igf1 is at 220 which is high end of normal range. My squat was 175 for 4-6reps with some difficulty and today (8weeks later) I did 225 for 4. Ive gained about 5Lbs. Pain in my joints that I have had for a long time are completely gone which is something I was not expecting at all. I would like to continue this for about 2-3 more weeks at which time I will run out of the IGF1LR3 that I have and take 2months off and check my bloods again to see what's going on. Thoughts and comments are welcome.

 

[SJC]

you did not do the test yourself.

You added other compounds. Clomid raises test levels better than Nolva. Clomid is what doctors put Low T people on to increase and restart test production.

Your experiment is worthless

 

[francosiciliano]

No shit Sherlock. Read my original post that started this thread. I already know what you wrote which is why I started this thread. The test that I did on myself was because everyone was saying it would yield zero results and obviously it was very effective even if I would have gotten more results from doing a cycle of AAS Im not on board with doing that since just buying it is illegal and I can't go down that road.

 

[SJC]

No shit Sherlock. Read my original post that started this thread. I already know what you wrote which is why I started this thread. The test that I did on myself was because everyone was saying it would yield zero results and obviously it was very effective even if I would have gotten more results from doing a cycle of AAS Im not on board with doing that since just buying it is illegal and I can't go down that road.

Your still too stupid to even talk to but I'll try to explain it to you...

You said running Nolva would give you results. You conduct an experiment to prove everyone wrong but run 3 then 4 different compounds. YOU"RE EXPERIMENT SUCKS!

All the results you have got, which aren't magical by any means are due to a cocktail of different items. Clomid alone will give you certain results. Where did your results come from? Clomid, Nolva, mk 677, or the IGF?

 

[Zymurgist]

The test that I did on myself was because everyone was saying it would yield zero results

Actually, no one said that. Do you have a script for nolva and clomid or is it OTC where you live?

 

[Milton]

No shit Sherlock. Read my original post that started this thread. I already know what you wrote which is why I started this thread. The test that I did on myself was because everyone was saying it would yield zero results and obviously it was very effective even if I would have gotten more results from doing a cycle of AAS Im not on board with doing that since just buying it is illegal and I can't go down that road.

Lets try to keep it nice here

 

[Mrrippedzilla]

you did not do the test yourself.
You added other compounds. Clomid raises test levels better than Nolva. Clomid is what doctors put Low T people on to increase and restart test production.
Your experiment is worthless

Both work better than either in isolation - that's why both are staples in PCT.

No shit Sherlock. Read my original post that started this thread. I already know what you wrote which is why I started this thread. The test that I did on myself was because everyone was saying it would yield zero results and obviously it was very effective even if I would have gotten more results from doing a cycle of AAS Im not on board with doing that since just buying it is illegal and I can't go down that road.

1) No one said it would produce NO results, so lets throw that little thought out the window.
2) You used both Nolva & Clomid, both known for increase Test levels & for working in synergy, and then attributed your results to Nolva alone - that is why SJC is criticizing you.

You actually did EXACTLY what I recommend in my first post - the addition of clomid, GH peps, IGF1, etc - and that is the real reason why you've gained some semi-decent results.
It would be nice if people gave credit where its due on occasion

 

[francosiciliano]

I originally read that research on nolva increasing test a lot and figured I throw it out there for a somewhat academic discussion. The original goal of my discussion was to see if there was a way to get results without actually using AAS. After reading your (mrrippedzilla) post I got my answer that it is possible but a little more complicated than it would seem if only using the nolva research as the only info to come to a conclusion. I figured Id test it out and Im pretty happy with the results. So I guess my next question would be why shouldn't I do this 2months on 2months off or some sort of semi regular cycle if I know it will have a positive effect on me until I get to my goals which is only about 10 more lbs?

Thanks for the advice by the way

 

[Ghost124]

Nolva doesn't shut you down.

Just out of curiosity, if Nolva can boost your test levels anywhere from 50-143% without shutting you down, wouldn't that be the ideal first cycle for a beginner?

 

[Mrrippedzilla]

Just out of curiosity, if Nolva can boost your test levels anywhere from 50-143% without shutting you down, wouldn't that be the ideal first cycle for a beginner?

Nope because of this:

Nolva can certainly be used to boost your test levels BUT it will not in any way, shape or form, produce results even remotely comparable to an actual Test cycle.

You also have to remember that Nolva alone is a waste of time, the discussion only becomes interesting when you combine it with a bunch of other stuff (like the protocol I highlighted in my first post) and, even then, its context dependent....

For example, I'm currently experimenting with a similar protocol to help guys who have dieted down naturally to way below setpoint reset some of the negative hormonal adaptations that occur without having to regain body fat.
If successful, this may provide a method for these guys to stay pretty damn shredded (5-7%bf) year round while a) not feeling like complete shit and b) not sacrificing growth progress.
Now in this context, it becomes an intriguing discussion....not as a basic cycle for growth (Test FTW)

 

[fitguy22]

Nope because of this:


You also have to remember that Nolva alone is a waste of time, the discussion only becomes interesting when you combine it with a bunch of other stuff (like the protocol I highlighted in my first post) and, even then, its context dependent....

For example, I'm currently experimenting with a similar protocol to help guys who have dieted down naturally to way below setpoint reset some of the negative hormonal adaptations that occur without having to regain body fat.
If successful, this may provide a method for these guys to stay pretty damn shredded (5-7%bf) year round while a) not feeling like complete shit and b) not sacrificing growth progress.
Now in this context, it becomes an intriguing discussion....not as a basic cycle for growth (Test FTW)

thats some good stuff mrrippedzilla! read all your posts and found them highly helpful. thank you!