What Is an "optimized" TRT level in Canada??

[STAUNCHED427]

BTW my opinion on optimised was under the assumption that by "optimised" you meant, somewhat pushing the natural limit a little bit within sensible reason though. Otherwise, yes 800-1200 would be optimal levels that all doctors should be aiming for, a few hundred points over would be getting into the "optimised" I was referring to.

Being a curious person and one who tends to worry, I'm asking if anyone in this forum with low T problems are unable to get better, even with big T numbers like 1200 or 1600. Cause if some feel nothing at 700, do some also feel nothing at 1200 or 1600. Just looking for something to worry about. lol

You probably would and should feel better at say 1200ng/dl compared to 700ng/dl... I'm talking energy-wise, well-being, libido etc. all the typical benefits.

 

[halfape211]

Staunched you're right as usual.
I guess optimized probably can be thought of in a couple different ways. I think my doc thinks of it as a number that puts you in the best healthy position you can be in, without the negative health issues. I would guess that he might think 1200 is as high as a person needs to go to be healthy. BTW, I'm only asking because I'm not progressing nearly good as I think I should be for my 860 TT number. Therefore, as I look into the future, I hope that I can a high enough TT to get better. I hope I will not be left at a level that is considered the limit by the Doctor, but I'm still only by 70 or 80% better. As APOLLON was kind enough to mention, some feel nothing at 700. I was merely wondering if there are some who are still not 90 or 100% improved even with high numbers such as 1200 or 1600?

 

[Alpin]

Half....
I think you are thinking about this too much.
Relax, sit back and try to enjoy life.
I know from personal experience that obsessing over labs and hormone levels constantly is def not good for you

 

[Alpin]

Just keep an eye on your Estradiol. Order frequenct labs on it if need be. Controlling that will yield you better results with your TRT. From what I gather u are on too much Ai as your E2 reflects that

 

[halfape211]

Half....
I think you are thinking about this too much.
Relax, sit back and try to enjoy life.
I know from personal experience that obsessing over labs and hormone levels constantly is def not good for you

Yes, I've always been obsessive, But I figure if I don't get obsessive no one else will do it for me! lol (just a little humour)

 

[halfape211]

Just keep an eye on your Estradiol. Order frequenct labs on it if need be. Controlling that will yield you better results with your TRT. From what I gather u are on too much Ai as your E2 reflects that

Agreed. I'll retest for E2 in 60 days. By that time my E2 might go back up from reducing the Ai as you suggested. Luckily, I can get as many tests as I want from my doctors.

 

[Alpin]

I can only speak for myself by saying I would not want to be at 1600 for T over the long term.
I'd personally go no more than 1000-1050 MAX!
Remember your body gets use to these levels over time and u might need to increase the dose as you age and time goes on.

 

[halfape211]

Everyone is different. I doubt I will see improvement at 1000-1050. I'd gladly go over 2000 if I got my brain working again. So far I have no ill effects at 860.

Never knew I might need increase dose over time.

A couple of you guys ought to write a book on this stuff. I'd buy a copy

 

[Alpin]

Half something is terribly wrong. I cant help but express my feeling. Sounds like you are constantly complaining of poor cognitive function even with high normal T levels.
How are you so sure 2000 ng/dl will fix this concern you have?
This sounds like sleep apnea or some problem digesting fats.

 

[Mprtz]

... Remember your body gets use to these levels over time and u might need to increase the dose as you age and time goes on.

Any references for this?

 

[Alpin]

Any references for this?

I said "might". I never said definitively.

 

[STAUNCHED427]

Half something is terribly wrong. I cant help but express my feeling. Sounds like you are constantly complaining of poor cognitive function even with high normal T levels.
How are you so sure 2000 ng/dl will fix this concern you have?
This sounds like sleep apnea or some problem digesting fats.

Yes I don't think any real benefits will come once you get into supraphysiological range except for further enhanced libido and aggression and obviously anabolic benefits (which your body will adapt too with an increase in catabolic hormones anyway).

Also, it is not so much the Total Test, rather Free Test... Most labs ranges will vary a bit, but from memory my labs reference range is 12-38nmol/L. I guess the only real way to answer your question is to see how you feel at a little higher level. Otherwise we are chasing our tails trying to tell you how it will work for you. Also, Testosterone may not be your problem, granted it could have been part of the entire problem but there could be something else at bay... Try a sleep study like Apollon suggested.

 

[halfape211]

Yes I don't think any real benefits will come once you get into supraphysiological range except for further enhanced libido and aggression and obviously anabolic benefits (which your body will adapt too with an increase in catabolic hormones anyway).

Also, it is not so much the Total Test, rather Free Test... Most labs ranges will vary a bit, but from memory my labs reference range is 12-38nmol/L. I guess the only real way to answer your question is to see how you feel at a little higher level. Otherwise we are chasing our tails trying to tell you how it will work for you. Also, Testosterone may not be your problem, granted it could have been part of the entire problem but there could be something else at bay... Try a sleep study like Apollon suggested.

I'm only kidding about the 2000 level as no doc is going to go there. But at 860, I still have the same symptoms that I had when I was untreated at 244, like recalling words, names, spelling words, cognitive problems. Now, it has gotten better than it was at 244, but I still have the troubles I just mentioned. When I'm having a conversation with my doctor I have to stop occassionally and concentrate to find the word I need. Sometimes I know what it sounds like, but I can't remember it. I have to ask for help finding the word. In a 30 to 45 minute conversation this will happen once or twice. I never had this problem a few years ago.

I was in really bad shape when I was at 244 and I figure I'm about halfway to being better. Hopefully I will feel better at a higher level. My thanks to you guys for all the help. I'll consider the sleep study.

 

[STAUNCHED427]

I'm only kidding about the 2000 level as no doc is going to go there. But at 860, I still have the same symptoms that I had when I was untreated at 244, like recalling words, names, spelling words, cognitive problems. Now, it has gotten better than it was at 244, but I still have the troubles I just mentioned. When I'm having a conversation with my doctor I have to stop occassionally and concentrate to find the word I need. Sometimes I know what it sounds like, but I can't remember it. I have to ask for help finding the word. In a 30 to 45 minute conversation this will happen once or twice. I never had this problem a few years ago.

I was in really bad shape when I was at 244 and I figure I'm about halfway to being better. Hopefully I will feel better at a higher level. My thanks to you guys for all the help. I'll consider the sleep study.

Give it time, a little higher test would probably help but I don't think it would resolve it completely as I very, very much doubt it is lack of testosterone being the cause of those cognitive issues. Do you read a lot? I suggest reading to sharpen up your vocabulary skills. Me and everyone else will occasionally have trouble finding the right word... Doesn't mean your fucked up. You might be overthinking things a little too much. Also, forgive me if this has been answered, are you on any other medications?

 

[Alpin]

I'm only kidding about the 2000 level as no doc is going to go there. But at 860, I still have the same symptoms that I had when I was untreated at 244, like recalling words, names, spelling words, cognitive problems. Now, it has gotten better than it was at 244, but I still have the troubles I just mentioned. When I'm having a conversation with my doctor I have to stop occassionally and concentrate to find the word I need. Sometimes I know what it sounds like, but I can't remember it. I have to ask for help finding the word. In a 30 to 45 minute conversation this will happen once or twice. I never had this problem a few years ago.

I was in really bad shape when I was at 244 and I figure I'm about halfway to being better. Hopefully I will feel better at a higher level. My thanks to you guys for all the help. I'll consider the sleep study.

I hope you do seriously consider the sleep study as TRT is proven to make it worse. What was your LH/FSH when at 244 ?
How old r u as well?
Any AAS in the past?

 

[Alpin]

Yes I don't think any real benefits will come once you get into supraphysiological range except for further enhanced libido and aggression and obviously anabolic benefits (which your body will adapt too with an increase in catabolic hormones anyway).

Also, it is not so much the Total Test, rather Free Test... Most labs ranges will vary a bit, but from memory my labs reference range is 12-38nmol/L. I guess the only real way to answer your question is to see how you feel at a little higher level. Otherwise we are chasing our tails trying to tell you how it will work for you. Also, Testosterone may not be your problem, granted it could have been part of the entire problem but there could be something else at bay... Try a sleep study like Apollon suggested.

12-38 NMOL/L TT ref. Range ?
Now that is a lab!
Prey they dont alter their ranges...lol
We had an excellent lab here with range of 8-38 nmol/l and over the years it was ammended to 7.6-31.4 nmol/l.
As u see it becomes difficult to get medical attention here for low T...u have to be real low...even then you're given clomid if anything at all.