Irentat
Rebuilding...continually
This is an article I wrote up after gathering research on the subject over time. Looking for input.
Deca and Its Impact on Joints
Nandrolone Decanoate (Deca) has been anecdotally known to reduce joint pain. Many state that this is likely caused from water retention in the joint but in reality no one really knows the mechanisms involved in Deca reducing joint pain, or its impacts on healing for that matter. I will attempt to answer Deca's joint pain relief abilities a bit better than most out there and base it on documented research and my own personal experience.
I will not go into a description of Deca or how to cycle it but what I will cover is a bit of joint basics. The joint must be looked at as a complex unit but mainly, we can focus on tendons, ligaments, bones and cartilage. Most lay-person discussions out there focus on what they feel Deca does to their tendons. This is actually incorrect when it comes to joint pain for 2 reasons. First, tendons as well as ligaments make up a joint but ligaments mainly maintain control of correct joint tracking. Second, most pain radiates from a specific area called the periosteum, or lining of the bone. The Periosteum is what tendons and ligaments attach to and it contains significant nerve endings, making it sensitive to manipulation. Tendons and ligaments themselves do not have nerves so they, in fact, are not specifically the cause of pain. Cartilage can also play a role in pain generation but these mechanisms involved are complex and essentially unknown to the medical world so it will not be dealt with here.
Having this background, let's talk about some ways Deca benefits our joints. Simplistically, Deca has been shown extensively to increase bone density [no reference given] and collagen production [1] with collagen making up a major portion of tendons and ligaments. I say simplistically because other AAS', such as Stanozolol, will also increase collagen production but seems to have a different impact on our joints. Although bone density and collagen production is important, they are not the only factor that seems to help with joint pain.
Going further with our collagen thinking, a research article on artificial tendons shows Deca significantly increased both the stress and strain when the tendon was given the AAS and then loaded over time [2]. Loading meant giving the tendon a workout for a few days. What this increased stress and strain shows is that the artificial tendon could be pulled farther to failure and took more energy to do so but only after this daily workout was initiated for a week. Physically what could be seen in these loaded tendons is a distinct increase in actin fibers and the tendon itself was much thinner in diameter. The change seen in this study must obviously translate to the bone's Periosteum itself for pain reduction but the mechanisms involved were not studied. What is good to know is when using Deca, there are documented physical changes in the tendons, ligaments and bone hence most likely a change at their connection points.
Now let's talk about how Deca might make these changes. Deca's complexity on how it interacts with the body is amazing and this can specifically be seen in gene expression. In one study a muscle was administered Deca right after eliminating nerve connections and then compared to a muscle given Deca after 28 days from cutting the nerve. Between the two muscles, there was only a 16% gene expression correlation [3] with 122 and 123 genes were altered respectively with only 20 being the same gene. This means that Deca acts very differently on the body as the body stimulus changes. Referencing joints, we can only surmise from this that a very unique set of genes are altered within tendons, ligaments and bone when acted upon. This thinking would correlate well with the prior discussion on artificial tendon loading. In that study, the artificial tendon increased the protein actin only when loaded, hence a change in stimulus relates to a change in gene expression that shows itself physically. Unfortunately until genetic studies are done on ligaments and tendons, we will never know the specific genes being expressed.
How does this associated to real life? Many of us can talk on the joint pain relief Deca gives us while on cycling, including me. What I can elaborate on further is the physical changes seen in my own tendons. An MRI done on my ankle 8 weeks after initiating a Deca cycle with intense weight lifting showed thinning of my tendons in multiple locations. This came up as an anomaly to the MRI reader but obviously this was something I was expecting and even hoping for to confirm independent research.
So it seems the best way to get the most out of Deca for joint pain relief is by stressing the joints while cycling it. For us looking at this specific use, let's not forget that stress on the joint is not only in the form of weight lifting but can be impact related as well. With a caveat to overdoing it, the bottom line for Deca and joint pain relief: work out your joints harder while on your cycle and you will see more benefit from it.
1. Christian Hassager, et. al. Collagen synthesis in postmenopausal women during therapy with anabolic steroid or female sex hormones. Metabolism, vol. 39, Issue 11.
2. Ioannis K. Triantafillopoulos, et. al. Nandrolone Decanoate and Load Increase
Remodeling and Strength in Human Supraspinatus Bioartificial Tendons. The American Journal of Sports Medicine, Vol. 32, No. 4.
3. Weiping Qin, et. al. Differential alterations in gene expression profiles contribute to time-dependent effects of Nandrolone to prevent denervation atrophy. 2010 Qin et al; licensee BioMed Central Ltd.
Deca and Its Impact on Joints
Nandrolone Decanoate (Deca) has been anecdotally known to reduce joint pain. Many state that this is likely caused from water retention in the joint but in reality no one really knows the mechanisms involved in Deca reducing joint pain, or its impacts on healing for that matter. I will attempt to answer Deca's joint pain relief abilities a bit better than most out there and base it on documented research and my own personal experience.
I will not go into a description of Deca or how to cycle it but what I will cover is a bit of joint basics. The joint must be looked at as a complex unit but mainly, we can focus on tendons, ligaments, bones and cartilage. Most lay-person discussions out there focus on what they feel Deca does to their tendons. This is actually incorrect when it comes to joint pain for 2 reasons. First, tendons as well as ligaments make up a joint but ligaments mainly maintain control of correct joint tracking. Second, most pain radiates from a specific area called the periosteum, or lining of the bone. The Periosteum is what tendons and ligaments attach to and it contains significant nerve endings, making it sensitive to manipulation. Tendons and ligaments themselves do not have nerves so they, in fact, are not specifically the cause of pain. Cartilage can also play a role in pain generation but these mechanisms involved are complex and essentially unknown to the medical world so it will not be dealt with here.
Having this background, let's talk about some ways Deca benefits our joints. Simplistically, Deca has been shown extensively to increase bone density [no reference given] and collagen production [1] with collagen making up a major portion of tendons and ligaments. I say simplistically because other AAS', such as Stanozolol, will also increase collagen production but seems to have a different impact on our joints. Although bone density and collagen production is important, they are not the only factor that seems to help with joint pain.
Going further with our collagen thinking, a research article on artificial tendons shows Deca significantly increased both the stress and strain when the tendon was given the AAS and then loaded over time [2]. Loading meant giving the tendon a workout for a few days. What this increased stress and strain shows is that the artificial tendon could be pulled farther to failure and took more energy to do so but only after this daily workout was initiated for a week. Physically what could be seen in these loaded tendons is a distinct increase in actin fibers and the tendon itself was much thinner in diameter. The change seen in this study must obviously translate to the bone's Periosteum itself for pain reduction but the mechanisms involved were not studied. What is good to know is when using Deca, there are documented physical changes in the tendons, ligaments and bone hence most likely a change at their connection points.
Now let's talk about how Deca might make these changes. Deca's complexity on how it interacts with the body is amazing and this can specifically be seen in gene expression. In one study a muscle was administered Deca right after eliminating nerve connections and then compared to a muscle given Deca after 28 days from cutting the nerve. Between the two muscles, there was only a 16% gene expression correlation [3] with 122 and 123 genes were altered respectively with only 20 being the same gene. This means that Deca acts very differently on the body as the body stimulus changes. Referencing joints, we can only surmise from this that a very unique set of genes are altered within tendons, ligaments and bone when acted upon. This thinking would correlate well with the prior discussion on artificial tendon loading. In that study, the artificial tendon increased the protein actin only when loaded, hence a change in stimulus relates to a change in gene expression that shows itself physically. Unfortunately until genetic studies are done on ligaments and tendons, we will never know the specific genes being expressed.
How does this associated to real life? Many of us can talk on the joint pain relief Deca gives us while on cycling, including me. What I can elaborate on further is the physical changes seen in my own tendons. An MRI done on my ankle 8 weeks after initiating a Deca cycle with intense weight lifting showed thinning of my tendons in multiple locations. This came up as an anomaly to the MRI reader but obviously this was something I was expecting and even hoping for to confirm independent research.
So it seems the best way to get the most out of Deca for joint pain relief is by stressing the joints while cycling it. For us looking at this specific use, let's not forget that stress on the joint is not only in the form of weight lifting but can be impact related as well. With a caveat to overdoing it, the bottom line for Deca and joint pain relief: work out your joints harder while on your cycle and you will see more benefit from it.
1. Christian Hassager, et. al. Collagen synthesis in postmenopausal women during therapy with anabolic steroid or female sex hormones. Metabolism, vol. 39, Issue 11.
2. Ioannis K. Triantafillopoulos, et. al. Nandrolone Decanoate and Load Increase
Remodeling and Strength in Human Supraspinatus Bioartificial Tendons. The American Journal of Sports Medicine, Vol. 32, No. 4.
3. Weiping Qin, et. al. Differential alterations in gene expression profiles contribute to time-dependent effects of Nandrolone to prevent denervation atrophy. 2010 Qin et al; licensee BioMed Central Ltd.
Last edited:
