Doc wants to try hcg monotherapy

Gainjin260

I am banned!
35
6'2
230
In the process of cutting- losing about a kilo a week on keto
No previous cycle experience

Started TRT 5 weeks ago; took 6th pin Sunday. Sustanon 200mg/week (I know my T levels are probably too high on this dose. Hopefully pulling bloods this Saturday if schedule works out). I take Sus because I can get pharmaceutical whereas Cypionate I can't.

Diagnosed hypogonaldal 3 years ago at 279. At that time FSH was double what it should have been. Seems obvious primary.

Went on Clomid 25/d for 2.5 years to increase test and try to make sperm (had none then, have none now. I did when I was in my 20's). Clomid got me up to 450-500 range- great, right? Everybody would kill to have those levels, right? Well, the symptoms of low T got progressively worse to the point where I had Zero libido, no energy despite working out and eating pretty healthy, couldn't handle any amount of frustration etc.

I live in Japan. Japanese guys have way lower T than Caucasians, so all my levels- even at 270 were "fine" by most Japanese docs. I started TRT under the watch of a doctor in the States. He thinks my idea of injections + hcg @ 250 2x weeks is good (my dad is an oncologist, this guy is his Endo).

I found an enlightened Japanese endo who's willing to treat me. He even gave me pins today at our first meeting (highly***12289;highly controlled here) Both he and my urologyst in the States want me to try hcg monotherapy, at what I think are really high dowse. Stateside recommended 1500 2xwk and Japanese 3000 2xwk.

I know hcg monotherapy can work, but I feel great right now. Before TRT I was about to lose my shit at the drop of a hat. Now I am calm, happy and even can pay attention (ADD since 7 years old) much better/am actually patient.

Are there benefits to hcg monotherapy over TRT with hcg? I'm already infertile but have an awesome adopted daughter and I don't feel like I have to procreate.

I've read here that hcg won't work in primaries like me- what's the deal with Clomid raising my T? Would hcg then be likely to do the same?

If anyone can talk me into trying hcg monotherapy I'm all ears. Otherwise I'm not looking forward to stopping exogenous T because I feel like the real me again. My wife said I'm back to being the person she fell in love with. Plus since I've been meticulous about diet the weight is coming off and the strength going up. I love how I feel. It's completely changed my life. Should I give hcg a try? It'd only be 4 weeks off test followed by 3 weeks of Hcg, then we'd reevaluate.

If I do do that I've told the doc that I wouldn't come off T for another 6 weeks. That way I could treat this TRT as a tiny cycle. Question: at the end of 12 weeks should I try a pct/ restart before the hcg therapy?

Thanks for reading.

-Gaijin
 
If clomid worked for you that means your testicles still have some function left. You are not 100% Primary.

What is their rationale for trying hCG mono? Are they trying to do an HPTA restart attempt? I can't see any other reasons other than this.
 
Japanese doctor said because it is much simpler with only hcg rather than both T and hcg. He didn't mention restart per se but did say he wanted to see if my testis would become responsive and make T. Is that a restart?

He's not against TRT but wants me to drop the T now to see what hcg alone will do. I guess there's an off chance the boys may bounce back and even produce sperm? If so, maybe it's worth a try?

What's your view on running Clomid and Nolva before starting the hcg?

Thanks big bro.
 
I'm just a little confused how you are primary and you were producing sperm in your 20's.

Not all primary guys were born that way. Injuries to the neck/back/head/testes, varicoceles, long-term opiate use, and some dormant genetic disorders can mess with both sperm and testosterone production.

OP: You were on clomid for over two years, and you state you weren't happy with the results. HCG is going to duplicate those results. (real vs fake LH signal)

Testosterone plus HCG is the best way to go about this, bar none.
 
I agree with Halfwit. Unless you are hell bent on trying an HPTA restart to see if you can discontinue TRT, you should stay on Test and hCG.

As for the restart, it would not make sense to run Clomid/nolva prior to hCG. It is usually hCG thanks run first in a restart and then the SERMs.
 
Based on the "Anabolic Doc's" thread and advice in the main forum on guys on TRT trying to conceive, I'm going to discontinue Test and try hCG at 3000iu 2/wk in hopes of regaining fertility. I'll stick with that protocol for 6 months. If there are still no sperm I'll give up on hopes of having a biological kid. No worries.

I am, however, going to ride out T injections for a full 12 weeks because I'm seeing good results. I pinned my 7th time this past Sunday and will get bloods pulled on Saturday to see where my levels are on a TRT dose. For the last 5 weeks I'm thinking of upping to the dose to 500/wk.

Any issues in doing this?

After the last pin I'll wait 4 weeks and get bloods drawn then start on hCG 3000iu 2/wk. sound ok?

I just took my first dose of 250iu hCG yesterday (had trouble getting pins due to where I live). When should I expect libido increase? Right now mine is pretty low and I'm not sure why.
 
Not all primary guys were born that way. Injuries to the neck/back/head/testes, varicoceles, long-term opiate use, and some dormant genetic disorders can mess with both sperm and testosterone production.

OP: You were on clomid for over two years, and you state you weren't happy with the results. HCG is going to duplicate those results. (real vs fake LH signal)

Testosterone plus HCG is the best way to go about this, bar none.


Update.

I agree with HW, test + hcg is ideal, however after running exogenous test for 4 months I've come off onto hcg mono therapy to try to regain fertility. It's been over 2 months since last test injection and I've been on hcg 2000iu 3x/wk.

Test levels- reference range (1.31 ng/ml-8.71)
Current w/hcg- 5.56
On 225mg/wk test- 9.59
On Clomid- 3.6

Mentally I feel great. Nothing like the hell I felt while on Clomid. Physically I feel very good, but not like I feel on test.

There are way too many variables to draw the conclusions about the effectiveness of hcg as a stand alone treatment to low t. I feel great compared to dealing with low t on Clomid alone, but my body has been completely recomped and that alone probably goes a long way in terms of well being.

Hoping to either produce sperm of determine that it'll never happen before the new year so that I can get back to exogenous test.
 
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