First Cycle Aborted From Estrogen / Gyno Issues - Need Advice on Second

[tritonica]

After tons of research I started my first cycle which was the standard Test E @ 500mg / week, A-dex 0.25mg EOD, HCG wks 6-10. My stats were 5'10", 170lbs, 15% BF, 34yrs.

One week after my first shot I started having gyno symptoms(itchy/sore nipples followed by sore tissue behind my nipples). I took extra A-dex and Nolva immediately which helped. I continued with my next pin and 2-3 days after I had severe flare ups. My nipples would get sore and hard. If I hadn't taken A-dex quickly enough the tissue behind my nipple would get extremely sore and tender. It was taking 0.75-1mg of A-dex / day to keep it under control.

I stopped the cycle because Test-E has a long half life and was concerned I was having issues this early. For three weeks following my last pin I had difficulty managing my estrogen. It still took up to 1mg to keep things in check.

It seems I aromitize heavily and/or am very sensitive to gyno. I would like to try and run a full cycle but am concerned. I'm looking for advice on how to run a cycle again knowing this (lower dosage, different AI, etc.). Thanks in advance.

 

[Megatron28]

Did you ever confirm with blood work? Where did you get your adex from? Is it possible that it was fake?

 

[skillhill]

Exactly my thinking, though being that sensitive it rare as well..

 

[Norsegod]

Try aromasin or letro. You should always check your blood to confirm though

 

[tritonica]

The adex was prescription so I know it was legit.

I have bloods before and my plan was to test again four weeks into my cycle. I should have gotten them tested but to confirm it was high but didnt. I can say I also noticed severe mood changes, almost depressed, and my face started breaking out.

I do have pre-existing gyno from puberty so its tough to tell if i developed more. I appreciate the help.

o

 

[tbonexl]

I don't understand how u got gyno symptoms off your first pin of test e. It takes a few weeks to build up in your system. I wouldn't think u would see any of that off your first or second pin. Highly unlikely..

 

[SilverBackGorilla]

I don't understand how u got gyno symptoms off your first pin of test e. It takes a few weeks to build up in your system. I wouldn't think u would see any of that off your first or second pin. Highly unlikely..

I know the OP, these were the symptoms and I encouraged him to make this post. Let's try and help rather than doubt what he's saying he's feeling. Thanks

 

[tbonexl]

I'm just saying that it doesn't make any sense surely u would agree with that. . If u know the guy, why wouldn't u have him read thru the stickys pertaining to gyno reversal?

 

[Megatron28]

What did your blood work show before your cycle -- your baseline?

I am just thinking "out loud" here. I don't even know if this is possible and I have no science behind it. Your first injection starts shutting down your natural T. That means less aromatization. And you were taking adex. You started taking a LOT of adex. The exogenous T takes time to build up in your body.

Given that you had preexisting gyno, is it possible what you were experiencing is a reaction to your breast tissue being "cut off" from estrogen? Perhaps it is like the pain some guys feel in their testicles as they are being shut down.

Again, no science or personal experience around this. Just conjecture. Too bad you didn't get blood work to confirm what was happening. That would have filled in some missing pieces.

 

[SilverBackGorilla]

I'm just saying that it doesn't make any sense surely u would agree with that. . If u know the guy, why wouldn't u have him read thru the stickys pertaining to gyno reversal?

I know it doesn't, that's why I wanted him to make the post. He's read the stickies but it doesn't seem to explain this case. The gyno he has is from puberty but I don't believe the reversal process is applicable.

 

[Megatron28]

I know it doesn't, that's why I wanted him to make the post. He's read the stickies but it doesn't seem to explain this case. The gyno he has is from puberty but I don't believe the reversal process is applicable.

You absolutely can reverse pubertal gynecomastia. Raloxifene is the preferred medication for this (SERM). If that doesn't work completely, surgery is an option.

 

[DreDay187]

I know it doesn't, that's why I wanted him to make the post. He's read the stickies but it doesn't seem to explain this case. The gyno he has is from puberty but I don't believe the reversal process is applicable.

Why wouldn't the reversal process be applicable? SERM treatment has been shown effective and well tolerated in reversing pubertal gyno.

 

[Megatron28]

Why wouldn't the reversal process be applicable? SERM treatment has been shown effective and well tolerated in reversing pubertal gyno.

Thanks for chiming in there Dre.

 

[DreDay187]

Thanks for chiming in there Dre.

You're being worked hard Mega lol.

 

[SilverBackGorilla]

You're being worked hard Mega lol.

LoL, you guys both work hard in this forum and I appreciate both of your help for my bro. Nothin worse than preparing for your first cycle and it not working out like you had planned.

 

[China_Wall]

This is gonna be brief and to the point...

Gyno CANNOT be cured by meds, can be reduced or put into a dormant state, bit it WILL return when enough androgens are present

The ONLY option to eliminate gyno is surgery

Using the term reverse when referring to treatment isn't really correct, but reduce is possible... remember running AI's is a way to prevent the gyno from increasing, but will NOT get rid of it

 

[snowpatrol123]

The adex was prescription so I know it was legit.

I have bloods before and my plan was to test again four weeks into my cycle. I should have gotten them tested but to confirm it was high but didnt. I can say I also noticed severe mood changes, almost depressed, and my face started breaking out.

I do have pre-existing gyno from puberty so its tough to tell if i developed more. I appreciate the help.

o

Get gyno removal surgery; make sure they take out the glands completely.

Problem solved

 

[DreDay187]

This is gonna be brief and to the point...

Gyno CANNOT be cured by meds, can be reduced or put into a dormant state, bit it WILL return when enough androgens are present

The ONLY option to eliminate gyno is surgery

Using the term reverse when referring to treatment isn't really correct, but reduce is possible... remember running AI's is a way to prevent the gyno from increasing, but will NOT get rid of it

The germ 'gyno reversal' is a term used in several studies on SERMs as a gyno treatment protocol. I didn't just throw the words together myself. Can't find the particular studies but here is an interesting one:

Tamoxifen, in an uncontrolled study, resulted in complete regression of gynecomastia in 70% of cases.

Parker LN, Gray DR, Lai MK, et al. Treatment of gynecomastia with
tamoxifen: a double-blind crossover study. Metabolism 1986;
35:705***8211;708.

Surgery typically doesn't eliminate gyno either. It's is absolutely possible to get gyno back after the surgery if androgen/estrogen levels are altered after the fact.

 

[DreDay187]

Get gyno removal surgery; make sure they take out the glands completely.

Problem solved

Doctors won't take the whole gland out typically.

 

[SilverBackGorilla]

Any advice on how he should move forward from here if he wants to try and rerun his cycle without gyno surgery?