Im basically fu**ed guys, no idea what I should do about my trt

[Fred87]

So guys, secondary hypogonadal boy here since when I was young enough to remember now.
I've only started recently to school myself about TRT, I've always trust my doctor before(big error).
I tried to see different doctors recently but its always the same shit:
1) they wont give me a decent dose, pretty much 250 test en every 3 weeks (yeah 3 fckn weeks you read it right)
2) they seem to not give a flying shit about Estradiol and anything else which is not Test levels
3) Hcg? What the hell is that? They dont know and they cant give it
4) Ai? You must be kidding me, they cant give it

So yeah, im basically fckd, what the hell should I do?
Dont tell me to see another doctor because everyone over here in Italy is exactly like that.
sorry for the bad englando

 

[halfwit]

Unfortunately I don't know if you guys have the ability to obtain private blood testing, but that is what I found works for cases like this. My doctor doesn't understand enough either, so I handle everything on my own but the testosterone script.

You can purchase AI's, HCG, and other ancillary drugs on your own relatively easy, but I don't know of an easy way to fix the fact that your doctor thinks you're on a good protocol, which you're clearly not.

You could always talk to your pharmacist, and get their opinion on doctors in the area that prescribe HCG an AI's - and see if they can look at your case. I'm not terribly familiar with how these things work in Italy, so I don't have much else to really offer in the terms of advice.

 

[Fred87]

Unfortunately I don't know if you guys have the ability to obtain private blood testing, but that is what I found works for cases like this. My doctor doesn't understand enough either, so I handle everything on my own but the testosterone script.

You can purchase AI's, HCG, and other ancillary drugs on your own relatively easy, but I don't know of an easy way to fix the fact that your doctor thinks you're on a good protocol, which you're clearly not.

You could always talk to your pharmacist, and get their opinion on doctors in the area that prescribe HCG an AI's - and see if they can look at your case. I'm not terribly familiar with how these things work in Italy, so I don't have much else to really offer in the terms of advice.

There isnt any doctor who prescribes AIs and HCG, its kind of illegal and they dont know a thing about that stuff anyways.
Im managing myself in terms of test and AI, but I need to buy the AI from the black market and I dont know how safe it can be.
I dont know anything about HCG so Im not buying/using it.
Seems like the only option I have is to keep manage myself, but its risky and Im very concerned about my healt

 

[Westshore]

Is there any private testing in Italy?
What are your funds like? Can you look for a private doctor? We have them in the States--and the UK too. You basically pay for service and they don't go through the Government or Insurance?

 

[halfwit]

There isnt any doctor who prescribes AIs and HCG, its kind of illegal and they dont know a thing about that stuff anyways.
Im managing myself in terms of test and AI, but I need to buy the AI from the black market and I dont know how safe it can be.
I dont know anything about HCG so Im not buying/using it.
Seems like the only option I have is to keep manage myself, but its risky and Im very concerned about my healt

Then I wouldn't say you're fucked. I would continue to look around for a knowledgeable doctor though.

 

[Fred87]

Is there any private testing in Italy?
What are your funds like? Can you look for a private doctor? We have them in the States--and the UK too. You basically pay for service and they don't go through the Government or Insurance?

I can get "kind of private" testing, no problem about that.
I can also get a private doctor but they are the same as every other doctor, no Ai, no Hcg, no decent dosage.

 

[sanipialo]

1) If you are able to convince them to inject yourself. You can spit the the dosage in 2 and get one ever 10 days. 125mg every 10 days is better than 250mg every 3 weeks
2) Unless there are any indications that Estradiol is too high or too low, there is no need to monitor it. You can have do the blood test yourself once a year.
3) HCG is not needed
4) AI is not needed

Is that 250mg Sustanon? A lot of countries only give patients Sustanon or Nebido. If that is the case with you. Try to get on Nebido. The protocol is to get a injection booster, then one after 6 weeks and the once every 10 to 14 weeks based on the patient. Most doctors will do 10 to 12 weeks.

 

[Fred87]

1) If you are able to convince them to inject yourself. You can spit the the dosage in 2 and get one ever 10 days. 125mg every 10 days is better than 250mg every 3 weeks
2) Unless there are any indications that Estradiol is too high or too low, there is no need to monitor it. You can have do the blood test yourself once a year.
3) HCG is not needed
4) AI is not needed

Is that 250mg Sustanon? A lot of countries only give patients Sustanon or Nebido. If that is the case with you. Try to get on Nebido. The protocol is to get a injection booster, then one after 6 weeks and the once every 10 to 14 weeks based on the patient. Most doctors will do 10 to 12 weeks.

I can manage my injection myself, I can buy enough from the pharmacy.
The test is testoviron 250, the only injectable available over here (theres testovis aswell but is a very short ester if im not wrong).
Are you sure I dont need any HCG? I've seen many people on trt over here who take it

 

[Megatron28]

i prefer being on hCG, but I did not use it the first two years I was on TRT. It is not required. Just preferred by many. As said, if you really want it, you can find it. By the way, I am in the United States, and my doctors will not prescribe me hCG either.

So how much testosterone are you taking now per week and what is your injection frequency?

Why do you think you need an Aromatase Inhibitor? Have you ever checked your estradiol levels?

I would not say you are fucked either. You actually seem to be in a pretty good **********

 

[Chiefy]

I can manage my injection myself, I can buy enough from the pharmacy.
The test is testoviron 250, the only injectable available over here (theres testovis aswell but is a very short ester if im not wrong).
Are you sure I dont need any HCG? I've seen many people on trt over here who take it

According to the Nebido website, it is available in Italy. Might be worth looking into given your current situation.

HCG is definitely not necessary. Most of us prefer it, but people have been on TRT for years without hCG. It's really only been used in men with regularity for about a decade. Even still, I wouldn't say that it's a widely prescribed drug right now here in the U.S.

 

[Profion9k]

I am on Nebido 1000ml every 5-6-7th week depending on how i feel! My doctor and I are very cooperative togetter and I always take the blood tests that he puts out! He opened blood testing so that I could actually do it every 2nd 2nd 2nd week = 6weeks. To see how my testosteron levels act. Within those blood everything is within such as CBC, thyroids, Estrogens, tests, lipids ect. He is a very good Endo-doc wich takes care of symptoms rather then numbers.... I am very happy that i have him.

You have to be smart about your TRT, your life and your symptoms! If you are dropping below 15nmol towards VERY LOW T you could actually fire up for a case.... You see, they are not treating you if they handle your case like a 80year old man, every one is different and you might not feel okay towards the 10nmol... Get bloods show up and talk, say that this is not proper levels for your age.

If they start to argue, you can always explain them that they made a mistake giving you TRT in the first place, if they are not going to listen or treat you towards normal healthy levels for a guy your age.

 

[Fred87]

i prefer being on hCG, but I did not use it the first two years I was on TRT. It is not required. Just preferred by many. As said, if you really want it, you can find it. By the way, I am in the United States, and my doctors will not prescribe me hCG either.

So how much testosterone are you taking now per week and what is your injection frequency?

Why do you think you need an Aromatase Inhibitor? Have you ever checked your estradiol levels?

I would not say you are fucked either. You actually seem to be in a pretty good **********

I took 250 2 weeks ago and Im having a blood test on monday, I was normally taking 150 weekly but the doctor didnt know of course.
I got a new doc so I cant "cheat" the blood test and have to stick for the prescribed dose. Luckily hes gonna notice how fucked up this 250/3 weeks dosage is.
I dont know if I need an Ai, thats the problem, they dont check estradiol at all.
I only checked it on my own when I ran a small blast, but I dont know my levels on trt.
Regarding hcg I really dont know much.

 

[Alpin]

I am on Nebido 1000ml every 5-6-7th week depending on how i feel! My doctor and I are very cooperative togetter and I always take the blood tests that he puts out! He opened blood testing so that I could actually do it every 2nd 2nd 2nd week = 6weeks. To see how my testosteron levels act. Within those blood everything is within such as CBC, thyroids, Estrogens, tests, lipids ect. He is a very good Endo-doc wich takes care of symptoms rather then numbers.... I am very happy that i have him.

You have to be smart about your TRT, your life and your symptoms! If you are dropping below 15nmol towards VERY LOW T you could actually fire up for a case.... You see, they are not treating you if they handle your case like a 80year old man, every one is different and you might not feel okay towards the 10nmol... Get bloods show up and talk, say that this is not proper levels for your age.

If they start to argue, you can always explain them that they made a mistake giving you TRT in the first place, if they are not going to listen or treat you towards normal healthy levels for a guy your age.

15 nmol / l ?
Over here they call that a healthy T level.
I know exactly what type of spot Fred is in.
Just keep looking for other routes man...
and careful u dont take too much a.i. on that dose
..
how much a.i. are u taking since u don't even know if you need it...since your doc is not testing for estradiol? ?

 

[sanipialo]

I can manage my injection myself, I can buy enough from the pharmacy.
The test is testoviron 250, the only injectable available over here (theres testovis aswell but is a very short ester if im not wrong).
Are you sure I dont need any HCG? I've seen many people on trt over here who take it

I was not aware that Bayer still made Testoviron, as it is mostly sold via none official channels.


If you are able to inject yourself, you can use the protocol of 80mg every 5 days to give you stable blood levels. 250mg every 2 weeks as a high of 30mg a day and a low of 4mg a day. While 80mg every 5 days has a high of 16mg and a low of 8mg.

HCG is not needed. It is actually not part of the official guideline for TRT.

 

[Fred87]

15 nmol / l ?
Over here they call that a healthy T level.
I know exactly what type of spot Fred is in.
Just keep looking for other routes man...
and careful u dont take too much a.i. on that dose
..
how much a.i. are u taking since u don't even know if you need it...since your doc is not testing for estradiol? ?

Im not taking any Ai, I just took some Adex when I did my 8 weeks blast.
Im scared to keep buying and using it long term without prescription.
I asked to get my estradiol checked and they new doc is gonna check it, but I higly doubt he can prescribe any AI even if the level is not spot on

 

[Fred87]

I was not aware that Bayer still made Testoviron, as it is mostly sold via none official channels.


If you are able to inject yourself, you can use the protocol of 80mg every 5 days to give you stable blood levels. 250mg every 2 weeks as a high of 30mg a day and a low of 4mg a day. While 80mg every 5 days has a high of 16mg and a low of 8mg.

HCG is not needed. It is actually not part of the official guideline for TRT.

Apparently its only available in Italy and Dom. Replublic.
I took the 250 mg/2 weeks because I have blood work on monday and I wanna show my new doctor (which i havent seen yet) how fucked up my levels are following that protocol.
I hope he will understand and put me on something like 100/150 weekly, but then I might need an Ai will I?
Thats something I will have to manage myself, do you know any long term issues about using an Ai?

 

[Fred87]

I am on Nebido 1000ml every 5-6-7th week depending on how i feel! My doctor and I are very cooperative togetter and I always take the blood tests that he puts out! He opened blood testing so that I could actually do it every 2nd 2nd 2nd week = 6weeks. To see how my testosteron levels act. Within those blood everything is within such as CBC, thyroids, Estrogens, tests, lipids ect. He is a very good Endo-doc wich takes care of symptoms rather then numbers.... I am very happy that i have him.

You have to be smart about your TRT, your life and your symptoms! If you are dropping below 15nmol towards VERY LOW T you could actually fire up for a case.... You see, they are not treating you if they handle your case like a 80year old man, every one is different and you might not feel okay towards the 10nmol... Get bloods show up and talk, say that this is not proper levels for your age.

If they start to argue, you can always explain them that they made a mistake giving you TRT in the first place, if they are not going to listen or treat you towards normal healthy levels for a guy your age.

You are totally right, I will try this approach with the new doctor for sure, I hope he understands.
Id like to stick to Testoviron so I can manage my blasts, but I will ask stuff about Nebido either, I dont know much about it.
How is it working for you?

 

[sanipialo]

Apparently its only available in Italy and Dom. Replublic.
I took the 250 mg/2 weeks because I have blood work on monday and I wanna show my new doctor (which i havent seen yet) how fucked up my levels are following that protocol.
I hope he will understand and put me on something like 100/150 weekly, but then I might need an Ai will I?
Thats something I will have to manage myself, do you know any long term issues about using an Ai?

Unless you are very sensitive or currently have a very high % of fat, you really don't need to worry about AI. After 6 weeks of 140mg every 6 days my E2 was 29 pg/ml. Then the dosage was adjusted to 100mg every 5 days and it was 27 pg/ml. All without AI. Well within the ideal range of 15 to 40 pg/ml.

But just ask for a E2 blood test after 6 weeks. If the doctor does not want to do it. Pay it out of pocket or tell him/her you have sensitive nipples and are worried.

 

[Westshore]

Hey Fred,

The other thing that might work (to find a decent doctor) is to message any one of the dozens of men's health or private TRT clinics in the US and ask for a Italian reference. My niece is in the medical beauty industry and she goes to clinics and symposia several times a year. She mets and discuss stuff with cohorts from all over the world (she has connections in many countries). What you need is a connection to something like Defy Medical ? Testosterone, Hormones, Fat Loss, Estrogen, HRT, Low T but in Italy (I think that's were you are). I see a good amount of Italian BBer's. So someone some where is helping these guys run gear--with or without a script.

 

[Fred87]

Hey Fred,

The other thing that might work (to find a decent doctor) is to message any one of the dozens of men's health or private TRT clinics in the US and ask for a Italian reference. My niece is in the medical beauty industry and she goes to clinics and symposia several times a year. She mets and discuss stuff with cohorts from all over the world (she has connections in many countries). What you need is a connection to something like Defy Medical ? Testosterone, Hormones, Fat Loss, Estrogen, HRT, Low T but in Italy (I think that's were you are). I see a good amount of Italian BBer's. So someone some where is helping these guys run gear--with or without a script.

I doubt there is any of those clinics over here, I didnt find any but Ill keep searching