Lowest Dose Of Test That Will Still Provide Gains?

[AussieThunder]

Xtreme57,

I think hair loss will be more likely to occur with long cycles rather than cycles high on test. You won't notice much difference between 250mg and 500mg test per week in terms of side effects, but a big difference in terms of gains. I agree that test prop would be your best bet if you don't mind injecting eod since it won't hang around in the body for nearly as long as cyp and enth which means that if you notice sides, you can get off it and its effects won't last long. Keep your cycles under 8 weeks and shoot 100mg eod or 50mg ed. Don't forget to take 0.5mg arimidex along with your cycle and possibly a small amount of HCG twice a week at 250iu each shot to keep your nuts alive.

 

[Billy_Bathgate]

honestly, 5'8" 160-175 range

working on diet and training and running 0mg a test a week is the BEST option

dont tell me it can happen, cause I used to weigh less than use AND im an 1" shorter!

Seriously though, you can tell me you just dont gain once you hit 175lb. I gurantee if you ate MORE and trained BETTER you would gain. Not putting you down, cause I have 0 clue of your routines, just tellling you the truth.

That said, I doubt you will say ok I wont do it Bathgate, so Ill say Id go with 350 a week and work on eating alot more.

 

[GymLift]

Xtreme57: No way have you reached your genetic potential.

How is your strength? Has it been going up over the years?

Do you squat?

 

[Xtreme57]

Xtreme57,

Keep your cycles under 8 weeks and shoot 100mg eod or 50mg ed. Don't forget to take 0.5mg arimidex along with your cycle and possibly a small amount of HCG twice a week at 250iu each shot to keep your nuts alive.

I may sound like an idiot here, but i'm still learning all the lingo - eod? ed? HCG? Sorry, i have to admit my newbie-ness here and ask for some elaboration if you don't mind b/c i'm really not sure what those terms stand for...

 

[Swoleburn]

eod = Every other Day
ed = Every Day
HCG = Human Chorionic Gonadotropin
is for post cycle treatment

 

[Xtreme57]

honestly, 5'8" 160-175 range
Seriously though, you can tell me you just dont gain once you hit 175lb. I gurantee if you ate MORE and trained BETTER you would gain.

Not trying to sound like a dick or anything, but other than changing the weight, couldn't this statement apply to just about any and everyone? i mean other than powerlifters/bodybuilders, why do most people use gear? Couldn't everyone just eat more and train better? Yup, there's ALWAYS room for imporvement. I understand that.

 

[Xtreme57]

eod = Every other Day
ed = Every Day
HCG = Human Chorionic Gonadotropin
is for post cycle treatment

Thanks Swole!

 

[GymLift]

eod = Every other Day
ed = Every Day
HCG = Human Chorionic Gonadotropin
is for post cycle treatment

Did you forget to type in PCT?

Just to be clear to others, hCG isn't for PCT.

 

[Xtreme57]

Xtreme57: No way have you reached your genetic potential.

How is your strength? Has it been going up over the years?

Do you squat?

Strength has been going up yes, just slowly. I do squat. My 4rm is about 365lbs (never tried 1 rep max, for fear of injury). Nothing to brag about, but that's what it is.

 

[Xtreme57]

Ya its my first cycle.
test-e (galenika's) 250mg/e5d wk 1-10 (or 12 depending on how I feel at wk 10)
letro .60mg/ed wk 1-10 (started about 2wks before cycle, will taper off)
nolva 10 mg/ed wk 1-10 (stopped using during wk 3 because of headaches)
finasteride 1mg/ed (started taking it about 2 months before cycle and will continue indefinitely)

I will taper the letro off and start taking nolva during the 2wks in between the cycle and pct. This is to avoid estrogen rebound from the letro.

pct wks 13-16
clomid 150mg/ed for 9/d, 100mg/ed for next 10/d, 50 mg/ed till end
nolva 20mg/ed throughout
trib 3g/ed throughout

This sounds like a very doable cycle. I'm thinking very similarly along these lines. I know it's a very subjective question, but what kind of gains could i look forward to b/t 250 or 500mg/week?

Also, is there any benefit to doing 250 every 5 days vs 50 a day or 100 every other day?

 

[Xtreme57]

Ok, here's a hypothetical quesiton - any advice on adding something like anavar or EQ to help add quality muscle instead of mostly water weight? I know it's not generally recommended for a first cycle, but would there be any benefit at all?

 

[GymLift]

It isn't recommended at all. If you do a cycle, stick with just testosterone. Absolutely no reason to add in something else.

 

[Xtreme57]

should i be at all concerned about my blood levels injecting just one 250mg a shot once a week? i've read that sides tend to show up more if your levels are unstable.... so would one 250 shot be best or split it up even further?

 

[Stone]

Split it up. Again I'm going to push the 500mg/dose. As for hairloss, you could go with 1-2mg finasteride per day, but even better would be to go with topical DHT blockers around the hairline. I forget the exact compounds as I'm blessed with no problems in this area. They provide better results all around from what I have heard. No sides from the finasteride (libido loss, depression, etc...), and the dht is blocked where it counts. Run a search on hair loss prevention, or maybe someone with a bit more experience in this area will chime in.

 

[Thoms]

How can your test levels be so low on a dose of 250mg test per week?

I do not know why they are still so low, or how they became so low to begin with. Every doctor i saw has a different explanation, from recreational drugs (never used them), previous Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) abuse because of symptoms of muscular build, bad hart, liver and bad cholesterol (never did), to alcohol abuse (true in the past but didn't drink for 6 months prior to bloodwork)

How old are you?

28, training natural for 10 years, losing muscle the last 4 regardless of now 1 year of AAS.

 

[GymLift]

How can your test levels be so low on a dose of 250mg test per week? How old are you? Guys in their 60s can generally get their test levels into the upper range of normal for a young man on just 150mg test enth/cyp per week.

(This question was directed to Thoms, who answered in the post above this one, but I thought I would answer as well)

There are Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) users that need only 80mg of testosterone cypionate a week to go to the top of the normal range and there are skinny guys that need 300mg/week in order to get to the same levels. I have no idea why.

Typically, 100mg/week puts many guys into the top 1/3 of the normal range until about the 6th day. hCG can be used on days 6 and 7 to keep the levels stable until the next injection.

 

[Xtreme57]

how much Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) would be recommended for either a 250 or 500mg/week test enath cycle?

 

[xcfmember]

how much Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) would be recommended for either a 250 or 500mg/week test enath cycle?

Shouldn't need it on that low of a dose esp if your only running for ten wks.