My second cycle 750 test E 500 Deca

[Tpowered]

27 years old
5' 10"
215lbs
15-18% BF (Mid Bulk)
6 years of consistent training.

2nd cycle. first was test prop, 100mg EOD for 8 wks.

currently not living in my home country, im "abroad" for "work" if that makes sense. so diet varies from day to day but im consuming between 3300 and 3700 cals. don't know exactly because I don't have means to calculate macros and weigh food over here. but from experience on my last preps im in that calorie range.

cycle is as follows...

Wk 1-5 Tbol 60Mg ED
Wk 1-16 Test E 750mg/Wk
Wk 1-14 Deca 500/Wk
Wk 10-16 Winny 50/50/100/100/100/100 (Bump to 100 for last 4 weeks IF I feel like I need it or want I

Adex at.5 ED Wk 1-16

PCT is Clomid at 100Mg ED and Nolva starting at 20Mg ED (will increase if need be) for 4 weeks, starting 3 weeks after last pin

Also have Letro on standby incase gyno decides to show up and play.
I have Caber for my DA and if any prolactin problems come up.
I also have 10,000 IU HCG that I will either use the last 8 weeks at 275x3 a week so 5,000 IU a per 4 weeks.


oh and I have Liv 52 and NACView attachment 563399View attachment 563400

 

[tbonexl]

There is some strange things posted here... Why are you stopping your ai the same time your stopping test? Do you think your test levels just drop that fast that you don't need to run ai anymore? If that's true, why are you waiting 3 weeks to start pct? How do you know that 20mgs of nolva is ok to start pct? Never ever heard of people adjusting their dose up while on pct "if need be"... What exactly is letro going to do besides kill your estrogen? If you get gyno symptoms, you treat them with a serm not an ai. You do not want to crash your estrogen!

I think you outta read the ology faq's thread. You got too much going on for your second cycle. From what you posted, you aren't very sure about what your doing either...

 

[Tpowered]

There is some strange things posted here... Why are you stopping your ai the same time your stopping test? Do you think your test levels just drop that fast that you don't need to run ai anymore? If that's true, why are you waiting 3 weeks to start pct? How do you know that 20mgs of nolva is ok to start pct? Never ever heard of people adjusting their dose up while on pct "if need be"... What exactly is letro going to do besides kill your estrogen? If you get gyno symptoms, you treat them with a serm not an ai. You do not want to crash your estrogen!

I think you outta read the ology faq's thread. You got too much going on for your second cycle. From what you posted, you aren't very sure about what your doing either...

I appreciate your concerns..

you make a good point with continuing the AI through until start of PCT, I the would ask you, that in the 3 weeks leading up to the PCT would you adjust dosages as your test drops over the weeks or just stay the same until starting PCT.

starting 3 weeks after pin with 750ml of test is because of test levels still being to high at 2 weeks..

20mgs is what I used before. obviously you would adjust dosages on anything you take depending on how your body is reacting to it. even doctors would adjust a dosage of a script depending on how you react to it. so I don't get why you think that's strange... but thanks again for your concern.

a quick google search of (Letro treatment for gyno) and you will have more than enough information to answer that question. letro reduced the size of my friends lump by about 50%

having to much going for my cycle is purely your opinion. but thanks I appreciate your response. I do what works for me. this thread is to purely lay out what im doing.

I will take into account your AI recommendation and run it until the start of PCT.

-T

 

[Onk]

I appreciate your concerns..

you make a good point with continuing the AI through until start of PCT, I the would ask you, that in the 3 weeks leading up to the PCT would you adjust dosages as your test drops over the weeks or just stay the same until starting PCT.

starting 3 weeks after pin with 750ml of test is because of test levels still being to high at 2 weeks..

20mgs is what I used before. obviously you would adjust dosages on anything you take depending on how your body is reacting to it. even doctors would adjust a dosage of a script depending on how you react to it. so I don't get why you think that's strange... but thanks again for your concern.

a quick google search of (Letro treatment for gyno) and you will have more than enough information to answer that question. letro reduced the size of my friends lump by about 50%

having to much going for my cycle is purely your opinion. but thanks I appreciate your response. I do what works for me. this thread is to purely lay out what im doing.

I will take into account your AI recommendation and run it until the start of PCT.

-T

1/ Tbone knows about usign an AI up until PCT and to wait 3 weeks to let an enth ester clear out, he was critiquing you for not doing so
2/ I've never seen anyone use nolva in PCT at less than 40mg ED, 20 is only used for people stopping gyno
3/ letro is used to stop estrogen conversion as a treatment for gyno as it stops FURTHER gyno. it doesn't treat it. nolva or ralox is used for that.

4/ "I do what works for me. this thread is to purely lay out what im doing."

....sounds like you've closed your mind and won't listen to advice. That's indeed strange, as you are dealing with chemicals that we have research changing the way we use them every year.

 

[Tpowered]

1/ Tbone knows about usign an AI up until PCT and to wait 3 weeks to let an enth ester clear out, he was critiquing you for not doing so
2/ I've never seen anyone use nolva in PCT at less than 40mg ED, 20 is only used for people stopping gyno
3/ letro is used to stop estrogen conversion as a treatment for gyno as it stops FURTHER gyno. it doesn't treat it. nolva or ralox is used for that.

4/ "I do what works for me. this thread is to purely lay out what im doing."

....sounds like you've closed your mind and won't listen to advice. That's indeed strange, as you are dealing with chemicals that we have research changing the way we use them every year.

I did say I was going to run the AI up until the start of PCT. and thanked him for the information.

see you say 40 for PCT and 20 for gyno. I have heard these number before also. but the main dosages I have read are 10-40mg for pct and 20-80mg for gyno.. so I am not trying to be an ass, but I have read many different dosages in these ranges. so my question to you would then be, why no less than 40mg when I have read as low as 10mg.. here is an example of one of those reads....
(Side effects and dosage

Some users swear by nolvadex, others prefer clomid during pct. Some users complain about reduced libido, others say it increases libido. I believe the negativity with tamoxifen is due to improper dosing protocols ***8211; mainly over-dosing with high dosages.

You should start with 10-20mg every other day at the most, and see how the dosage works for you. Make sure to run it as a part of a complete post cycle therapy.

There is evidence that Nolvadex up-regulates progestin receptors. This means if you run tamoxifen along with a progestin, such as any type of nandrolone or trenbolone, you run a higher chance of developing progestin related side effects. This has some ongoing debate in both the medical and bodybuilding community. Therefore, to be on the safe side, don***8217;t use it with progestins.

To recap:

Dosages for PCT: 10-40mgs ED or EOD

Dosages for gynecomastia treatment: 20-80mgs ED

*ED = every day *EOD = every other day)


this is from **********. not this board I get that. but every board and every med website says all kinds of different doses, but a common thing is as long as it works for you and you can recover correctly. once again... not trying be an ass. im genuinely asking why you say 40 over not 20.


as for letro, that is exactly why I have it... if gyno shows up. letro to stop it. that's what everyone I know has used for it. I know it does not go away completely. I have also read articles stating that letro has been shown to reduce the lump of gyno, along with nolva. I am not trying to be ignorant. I have done lots of reading and lots of homework. so when I read contradicting things to what your saying, obviously im going to question it.. who wouldn't? if I told you the sky was yellow and all your life you knew it to be blue you would want some kind of answer ya know?

me saying I do what works for me is me not trying to be ignorant, im simply saying I am doing what I have read and learned to do. and also what I has worked for my last cycle. I am not opposed to change or advice. but if your going to tell me that everything I have read is wrong im going to need an explanation as to why everything I have read is wrong. ya know? im not just gonna drop everything because a guy I don't know on the internet told me to with no explanation lol.

 

[Tpowered]

Nothing?

 

[tbonexl]

Seems like your source is outdated. Using nolva with 19 nor's is a myth. Letro to combat gyno is way outdated too. Letro will most likely crash your estrogen which you wouldnt even be able to get out of bed if that happens. Serms like nolva and ralox are incorporated to combat gyno instead. Pct is important. The standard pct is 40/40/20/20 nolva, 50/50/50/50 clomid. Been like that for some time now. You do what you feel works for you but that isn't recommended...

 

[Tpowered]

Thanks for the info. I will do some more research on what you said. not that I don't want to take your word for it... but I like to read things first hand as well.

I have more than enough supplies to make those changes... but can you give brief reason as to why the PCT protocol is the way you said it is?

 

[Tpowered]

Thanks for the info. I will do some more research on what you said. not that I don't want to take your word for it... but I like to read things first hand as well.

I have more than enough supplies to make those changes... but can you give brief reason as to why the PCT protocol is the way you said it is?