Tbol + Test-E 8wk Cycle. Come help (yell at) me

[lookatthisnoob]

Hey guys, I'm new, long time lurker, etc. etc. etc.

My goals for my first cycle:

• Gain ~10-15lbs lean mass, retaining >=75% after post cycle therapy (pct)
• Keep the cycle short and sweet
• Attempt to avoid a "roided-up look"
• Get some experience with teh AAS

Stats: (for reps)
5'10"
180 (Currently cutting)
225 Squat
285 DL
175 BP

I lifted throughout HS doing assorted sports, but never made serious gains. In the past year I've been doing research about real lifting and have become addicted to the iron again. I did general lifting with compounds all last summer, then bulked up 20lbs this fall and winter while doing an AxBxAxx BxAxBxx style strength routine (SS). I'm currently trying to keep my strength gains while I cut til I see some abs.

Cycle:
Test-e 500 1-8 (Considering frontloading with 750mg first pin)
Tbol 30 ed 5-8 (May start it earlier?)
Clomid 100/100/50/50 (Starting 2 weeks after last pin)
Nolva 40/40/20/20

AI on hand as symptoms occur.

Will this cycle give me some solid, dry mass? I also think my post cycle therapy (pct) seems a little old school, there's probably a more efficient means of restarting my HPTA.

General comments, questions, etc.

Thanks br0s

 

[halfwit]

I wouldn't go less than 12 weeks with enanthate since it takes 4-5 weeks to build up in your bloodstream. If you want to go 8 weeks, why not try test prop? Most guys (myself included) tend to run the oral kicker in the first 4 weeks before the test kicks in.

 

[snobE1226]

Run 12 weeks and dont front load

 

[lakers0812]

Age?

Also do test-e 500mg/week for 12 weeks. You can even start your cycle with dbol or tbol, although ive never used tbol. That will give you some good strength gains as you wait for the test to kick in which will be around week 5. 8 weeks on test-e is a waste. You should know that from reading the stickies (btw awesome place to start, which I know you did lol). I'd personally try to get up to 185 AFTER you finish cutting before you start. Should not be too hard as long as your diet is in check. Start your Aromatase inhibitor (AI) (aromasin or adex) when you start the cycle. This way you can control e2 sides and minor water retention. Remember even if you dont feel e2 sides it does not mean your test is not aromatizing. Good luck hope this helps. Your post cycle therapy (pct) looks good but i'd run an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) throughout post cycle therapy (pct).

Ps: get blood work before you start cycle that way you have a baseline number for what your body is working with. That way you know what you want to aim to be at following post cycle therapy (pct).

 

[lookatthisnoob]

My understanding it that Tbol isn't really a kickstarter, as it takes a few weeks to kick in.

I'm trying to avoid the buildup of test-e with the frontload; admittedly, I don't know if this is a good idea for my babby virgin endocrine system. From the research I've done (Especially Bill Roberts), it seems that 8-12 weeks is prime for a first cycle. I think 12 weeks wouldn't really help because I'm not looking to gain more than ~20lb or so.

 

[lookatthisnoob]

21

I think when I lean down I'll be around 165. 20lbs of lean mass would take a lot less time with a little help, but I know I could do it without. People seem to have less experience with Tbol than Anavar (var) and Dbol, but its pros and cons are more appealing to me.

Will people explain more in-depth why 8 weeks is bad for test-e. I know it takes ~4 weeks to reach full blood levels, but for my goals of ~20 lbs lean mass, isn't 8 weeks more appropriate? Besides which, the blood levels should stay high for 2 weeks after, correct? Meaning I'm in prime muscle-building mode for a good 6 weeks. I understand that 12 weeks is the "tried and true" method, but from seeing testimonials, logs, etc., the mass gain from that extra 4 weeks isn't appealing to me, at least right now in my lifting career.

 

[Avenger87]

21

I think when I lean down I'll be around 165. 20lbs of lean mass would take a lot less time with a little help, but I know I could do it without. People seem to have less experience with Tbol than Anavar (var) and Dbol, but its pros and cons are more appealing to me.

Will people explain more in-depth why 8 weeks is bad for test-e. I know it takes ~4 weeks to reach full blood levels, but for my goals of ~20 lbs lean mass, isn't 8 weeks more appropriate? Besides which, the blood levels should stay high for 2 weeks after, correct? Meaning I'm in prime muscle-building mode for a good 6 weeks. I understand that 12 weeks is the "tried and true" method, but from seeing testimonials, logs, etc., the mass gain from that extra 4 weeks isn't appealing to me, at least right now in my lifting career.

Just used Pinn Labs Tbol @ 50/75/75mg a day for 3 weeks. It took about 2 weeks to kick in - but the strength gains/pumps were awesome. I think 30mg might be on the low end.

Why are you cutting to 5'10'' 180 lbs?

You should be trying to lean gain to single digits bodyfat 180. 165 @ 5'10'' is going to be very small - not to mention completely achievable without ever touching AAS.

EDIT: You won't gain 20 lean lbs in 8 weeks - let alone 12 weeks. I'm 4 weeks in to TestE now and up 10-12 lbs, mostly water weight. At least 8-10 lbs. of this would disappear in about a week off cycle.