Testosterone replacement versus supplementation

[Gossamer]

You realize the testicles are the T in HPTA, right?

Just apply coomon sense. If your testicles stop making testosterone they are going to atrophy. That's just the way the body works.

Megaton,

Is it always the case that testicles atrophy/shrink when on trt, without hcg?

Because mine haven't gotten noticeably smaller in the 2 plus years I've been on trt. But maybe my testicles stopped working well before I went on trt. My t level was 170, pre trt.

Is there a reason why mine haven't shrunk?

 

[Megatron28]

Megaton,

Is it always the case that testicles atrophy/shrink when on trt, without hcg?

Because mine haven't gotten noticeably smaller in the 2 plus years I've been on trt. But maybe my testicles stopped working well before I went on trt. My t level was 170, pre trt.

Is there a reason why mine haven't shrunk?

It is a gradual process. I think they shrink for everyone. Obviously less so for someone who has been hypogonadal for a long time as they already have shrunk or never developed fully to begin with.

 

[Yarm]

Understand in no uncertian terms using test shuts down natural test production.

The question is, to what extent is the HPTA shutdown?

If one was to use 70mg of testosterone, in an ester that had a half life of 14 days, and released aprox. 5mg per day, would that shutdown the HPTA to the same extent as say 700mg?

Obviously the 700mg would result in a complete shutdown, but would that also be the case for 70mg? Or 35mg?

Or how little exogenous t must be released into the system, before the HPTA starts to cut down its own production, and to what extent? Is it turned off like a switch, or dialed down?

All theoretical I know, and I don't pretend to know the answer.

Another way of asking the same question is this.

If the HPTA was to produce 10mg per day, and you introduced 5mg per day, would the result be:
A. 5mg (0 + 5)
B. 7.5mg (2.5 + 5)
C. 10mg (5 + 5)
D. 12.5mg (7.5 + 5)
E. 15mg (10 + 5)

(And at the same time the body was previously accepting of 15mg, so no overwhelming bodybuilding dose here).

I don't think it's A. And maybe not E. But somewhere between the two.

Does a small amount of exogenous T supplement, supplant ones natural T? Or a bit of both. I.e. D.

Obviously with bodybuilding injection levels, the HPTA is flattened, But what happens at these much smaller levels? Do the same rules apply?

 

[Megatron28]

The question is, to what extent is the HPTA shutdown?

If one was to use 70mg of testosterone, in an ester that had a half life of 14 days, and released aprox. 5mg per day, would that shutdown the HPTA to the same extent as say 700mg?

Obviously the 700mg would result in a complete shutdown, but would that also be the case for 70mg? Or 35mg?

Or how little exogenous t must be released into the system, before the HPTA starts to cut down its own production, and to what extent? Is it turned off like a switch, or dialed down?

All theoretical I know, and I don't pretend to know the answer.

Another way of asking the same question is this.

If the HPTA was to produce 10mg per day, and you introduced 5mg per day, would the result be:
A. 5mg (0 + 5)
B. 7.5mg (2.5 + 5)
C. 10mg (5 + 5)
D. 12.5mg (7.5 + 5)
E. 15mg (10 + 5)

(And at the same time the body was previously accepting of 15mg, so no overwhelming bodybuilding dose here).

I don't think it's A. And maybe not E. But somewhere between the two.

Does a small amount of exogenous T supplement, supplant ones natural T? Or a bit of both. I.e. D.

Obviously with bodybuilding injection levels, the HPTA is flattened, But what happens at these much smaller levels? Do the same rules apply?

Look again at the study I posted for you in Post #11. Even very small amounts were shutting down LH. Even 25mg/wk, which is less than you are suggesting in your postulate, resulted in shutdown as shown by LH.

You are thinking shutdown is on a spectrum when in reality it seems to be more binary. Off or on. Not degrees of off or on.

But go ahead and try applying your theory. Perhaps you will have different results.

 

[Yarm]

Yep, I did look at it. In particular the LH figures. Going off that data the smallest dose is the most suppressive. So counter intuitive results.