6-WEEK CYCLE OF ANAVAR - critique please

[glubgawd]

Like I said, I have no intention of writing up something. It's not an issue of what I 'think' I know, I DO know. I consistently see your posts pushing disinformation and a new user might not know your track record, so I'm simply letting him know. There are a lot of supporters of Anavar out there. I know myself and at least three of my friends who are sponsored and compete on national circuits list Anavar in their top and favorite compounds.

you and your 3+ friends aren't giving your diets enough credit then.

User is right. It's cool if you disagree. Just understand that it's either cuz you don't know what you're talking about or cuz you're going off of some other bullshit you read on a different forum. Doesn't matter to me either way to be honest.

 

[Sizewize]

I have used anadrol at 50mg - 75mg Ed for 4 weeks gained weight & still kept lean its all about the food diet u eat!!
I just finished Test-Tren- anadrol strength went up crazy with the Tren & anadrol and I lost bodyfat & weight went up even after post cycle therapy (pct) my weight has gone up 3lb and bodyfat gone up not even 0.5% bf so I am proof it can be done

 

[DADAWG]

i have read so many of these Anavar (var) only or winnie only threads and STILL fail to see the purpose of shutting down your natural test for very very moderat gains , some of which will be lost during and immediately after pct.

there have been some studies that clouted vars fat cutting benefits BUT these studies were scientific and said PLAINLY that Anavar (var) targeted a specific kind of fat and not just fat in general.var is NOT a magic fat burner.

var only is a womans cycle . Anavar (var) as part of a stack in a mans cycle is a differnt story.

 

[guambomb]

i have read so many of these Anavar (var) only or winnie only threads and STILL fail to see the purpose of shutting down your natural test for very very moderat gains , some of which will be lost during and immediately after pct.

there have been some studies that clouted vars fat cutting benefits BUT these studies were scientific and said PLAINLY that Anavar (var) targeted a specific kind of fat and not just fat in general.var is NOT a magic fat burner.

var only is a womans cycle . Anavar (var) as part of a stack in a mans cycle is a differnt story.

I want to know why you have the assumption wherein I believe I'm taking magic pills that burn away fat?
I am using Anavar (var) because i don't have the same goals most of the guys in this forum have. I'm just looking for a little kicker to my workouts without damaging my HPTA too much.

 

[ohjeez]

I want to know why you have the assumption wherein I believe I'm taking magic pills that burn away fat?
I am using Anavar (var) because i don't have the same goals most of the guys in this forum have. I'm just looking for a little kicker to my workouts without damaging my HPTA too much.

what you think you can do with Anavar (var), you can do with a good diet and a fat burner. and you wouldn't be damaging you hpta, and you'd be saving quite a bit of money too.

 

[Himik]

var still messes with your hpta.

 

[DADAWG]

I want to know why you have the assumption wherein I believe I'm taking magic pills that burn away fat?
I am using Anavar (var) because i don't have the same goals most of the guys in this forum have. I'm just looking for a little kicker to my workouts without damaging my HPTA too much.

be defensive if you want , it wont change the facts. its a piss poor cycle and you will get piss poor results whether you admit it or not.

 

[guambomb]

what you think you can do with Anavar (var), you can do with a good diet and a fat burner. and you wouldn't be damaging you hpta, and you'd be saving quite a bit of money too.

right, and for that matter, you can achieve incredible results without the use of any anabolics. these are called supplements for a reason, they supplement what you are already doing (not replace the need for what you are already doing).

var still messes with your hpta.

that has already been noted, hence the PCT of clomid. my reason for choosing this over test, was because it doesnt mess with the HPTA as strongly as does test.

be defensive if you want , it wont change the facts. its a piss poor cycle and you will get piss poor results whether you admit it or not.

its not defensiveness perse, its aggravation that nobody wants to have a real discussion on the matter. its mostly the ol' boys club of the 'ology forum that come around and give one-liner responses that amount to nothing in terms of information.

 

[UserAt204]

DAWG and Glub are exactly correct to much money for minimal returns. Many other things can be used for a lot less. Proper diet and training, unless your a women.

 

[ohjeez]

right, and for that matter, you can achieve incredible results without the use of any anabolics. these are called supplements for a reason, they supplement what you are already doing (not replace the need for what you are already doing)

why are you doing Anavar (var) then??? this makes nooo sense.

 

[guambomb]

DAWG and Glub are exactly correct to much money for minimal returns. Many other things can be used for a lot less. Proper diet and training, unless your a women.

I'm spending the money to keep my liver.

why are you doing Anavar (var) then???

not sure i get your point? why does anyone use any type of supplement?

 

[UserAt204]

Guam, it's your money and it will work. Just my opinion is that it's not with the cost. Not hating on you for using it. I don't believe that it's easier on the liver than test. I personally don't think either are that bad on the liver in reasonable doses/length of time.

The biggest problem is using it without test. How do you measure how suppressive each are. If you are shut down then you are shut down. Again just my opinion and I'm not trying to talk you out of it just think you will be felling like shut before long without the addition of test from my experience. If it works out for you then great.

 

[DADAWG]

its not defensiveness perse, its aggravation that nobody wants to have a real discussion on the matter. its mostly the ol' boys club of the 'ology forum that come around and give one-liner responses that amount to nothing in terms of information.


-----------------------------------------


information was given.

var is WEAK and more suited for women if taken by itself.

 

[UserAt204]

Again DAWG is correct.

 

[guambomb]

...I don't believe that it's easier on the liver than test.
...How do you measure how suppressive each are. If you are shut down then you are shut down.

I appreciate the responses.
To clarify, I had meant to state that I would select anavar over winstrol because they have lesser HTPA effects than does exogenous testosterone--not because I felt that testosterone wreaked havoc on the liver. I am avoiding testosterone (for now, I guess we'll see in a couple weeks) due to the severe shutdown it produces against the HPTA.
As to how you can judge one type of shutdown versus another: I cannot say much as I have never experienced a HPTA shutdown on either drug, but I am aware that the hypothalamus and the pituitary gland respond to elevated circulating levels of testosterone by down-regulating their secretions of GnRH and LH/FSH, respectively.
Being that oxandrolone is a DHT derivative, it cannot readily "revert" into testosterone to produce high serum levels which cause the shutdown of the HPTA.
I am not sure how oxandrolone suppresses the HPTA, but I'm very curious as to the exact mechanism and would be very appreciative if anyone could point me in the right direction to gather such information. And for the record, I am running with the idea that it DOES suppress the HPTA (though I am contending just not as quickly as testosterone would).

 

[guambomb]

So I found some data. Happy I found it, but not happy with the information contained. Still not clear as to the mechanism but am curious if there are any methods to prevent it from occurring in the first place (aside from abstaining from use of anavar).
I also think it is worthwhile to note that the duration of the anavar in this study was 3 months, and the subjects were all suffering from a previous condition of a constitutional delay of puberty and growth. As such, it might be difficult to extrapolate this data onto 30+ year old healthy men with no deficits in their HPTA, and at much shorter time cycles of the drug.

Clin Endocrinol (Oxf). 1997 Feb;46(2):209-16. Related Articles, Links


Effect of low dose oxandrolone and testosterone treatment on the pituitary-testicular and GH axes in boys with constitutional delay of growth and puberty.

Crowne EC, Wallace WH, Moore C, Mitchell R, Robertson WH, Holly JM, Shalet SM.

Department of Endocrinology, Christie Hospital Trust, Manchester, UK.

OBJECTIVE: To investigate the effect of low dose oxandrolone and testosterone on the pituitary-testicular and GH-IGF-I axes. DESIGN: Prospective double-blind placebo-controlled trial. PATIENTS: Sixteen boys with constitutional delay of growth and puberty (CDGP) with testicular volumes 4-6 ml were randomized to 3 months treatment: Group 1 (n = 5), daily placebo: Group 2 (n = 5), 2.5 mg oxandrolone daily or Group 3 (n = 6), 50 mg testosterone monthly intramuscular injections with assessment (growth, pubertal development and overnight hormone profiles) at 0, 3, 6 and 12 months. MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES: LH and GH profiles (15-minute samples) were analysed by peak detection (Pulsar), Fourier transformation and autocorrelation. Testosterone levels were measured hourly and insulin, SHBG, IGF-I, and IGFBP-3 levels at 0800 h. Statistical analysis was by multivariate analysis of variance for repeated measures. RESULTS: LH and testosterone parameters increased significantly with time in all 16 (LH AUC, P < 0.001; peak amplitude, P = 0.02; number of peaks, P = 0.02; testosterone AUC, P = 0.02; morning testosterone, P = 0.002). In Group 2, however, LH and testosterone parameters decreased at 3 months followed by a rebound increase at 6 and 12 months. SHBG levels were markedly reduced at 3 months (P = 0.006) and a wider range of dominant GH frequencies was present although GH AUC was not increased until 6 months, with an increase in GH pulse frequency but not amplitude. IGF-I levels were increased at both 3 and 12 months. In Group 3, pituitary-testicular suppression was not apparent, but GH levels increased with an increase in GH amplitude at 3 and 12 months. CONCLUSION: Oxandrolone transiently suppressed the pituitary-testicular axis and altered GH pulsatility. Testosterone increased GH via amplitude modulation.

 

[UserAt204]

Good work on finding some research. It's best to find as much as you can. I had a couple articles on this so I will try to find them.

 

[guambomb]

Good work on finding some research. It's best to find as much as you can. I had a couple articles on this so I will try to find them.

*AGREED*
one more:

Short-Term Oxandrolone Administration Stimulates Net Muscle Protein Synthesis in Young Men

 

[guambomb]

I figure this can be useful to anyone else looking at the scientific studies behind anavar:

Treatment with oxandrolone and the durability of effects in older men

ABSTRACT
We investigated the effects of the anabolic androgen, oxandrolone, on lean body mass (LBM), muscle size, fat, and maximum voluntary muscle strength, and we determined the durability of effects after treatment was stopped. Thirty-two healthy 60- to 87-yr-old men were randomized to receive 20 mg oxandrolone/day (n = 20) or placebo (n = 12) for 12 wk. Body composition [dual-energy X-ray absorptiometry (DEXA), magnetic resonance imaging, and 2H2O dilution] and muscle strength [1 repetition maximum (1 RM)] were evaluated at baseline and after 12 wk of treatment; body composition (DEXA) and 1-RM strength were then assessed 12 wk after treatment was discontinued (week 24). At week 12, oxandrolone increased LBM by 3.0 ± 1.5 kg (P < 0.001), total body water by 2.9 ± 3.7 kg (P = 0.002), and proximal thigh muscle area by 12.4 ± 8.4 cm2 (P < 0.001); these increases were greater (P < 0.003) than in the placebo group. Oxandrolone increased 1-RM strength for leg press by 6.7 ± 6.4% (P < 0.001), leg flexion by 7.0 ± 7.8% (P < 0.001), chest press by 9.3 ± 6.7% (P < 0.001), and latissimus pull-down exercises by 5.1 ± 9.1% (P = 0.02); these increases were greater than placebo. Oxandrolone reduced total (-1.9 ± 1.0 kg) and trunk fat (-1.3 ± 0.6 kg; P < 0.001), and these decreases were greater (P < 0.001) than placebo. Twelve weeks after oxandrolone was discontinued (week 24), the increments in LBM and muscle strength were no longer different from baseline (P > 0.15). However, the decreases in total and trunk fat were sustained (-1.5 ± 1.8, P = 0.001 and -1.0 ± 1.1 kg, P < 0.001, respectively). Thus oxandrolone induced short-term improvements in LBM, muscle area, and strength, while reducing whole body and trunk adiposity. Anabolic improvements were lost 12 wk after discontinuing oxandrolone, whereas improvements in fat mass were largely sustained.

 

[DADAWG]

I figure this can be useful to anyone else looking at the scientific studies behind anavar:

Treatment with oxandrolone and the durability of effects in older men

ABSTRACT
We investigated the effects of the anabolic androgen, oxandrolone, on lean body mass (LBM), muscle size, fat, and maximum voluntary muscle strength, and we determined the durability of effects after treatment was stopped. Thirty-two healthy 60- to 87-yr-old men were randomized to receive 20 mg oxandrolone/day (n = 20) or placebo (n = 12) for 12 wk. Body composition [dual-energy X-ray absorptiometry (DEXA), magnetic resonance imaging, and 2H2O dilution] and muscle strength [1 repetition maximum (1 RM)] were evaluated at baseline and after 12 wk of treatment; body composition (DEXA) and 1-RM strength were then assessed 12 wk after treatment was discontinued (week 24). At week 12, oxandrolone increased LBM by 3.0 ± 1.5 kg (P < 0.001), total body water by 2.9 ± 3.7 kg (P = 0.002), and proximal thigh muscle area by 12.4 ± 8.4 cm2 (P < 0.001); these increases were greater (P < 0.003) than in the placebo group. Oxandrolone increased 1-RM strength for leg press by 6.7 ± 6.4% (P < 0.001), leg flexion by 7.0 ± 7.8% (P < 0.001), chest press by 9.3 ± 6.7% (P < 0.001), and latissimus pull-down exercises by 5.1 ± 9.1% (P = 0.02); these increases were greater than placebo. Oxandrolone reduced total (-1.9 ± 1.0 kg) and trunk fat (-1.3 ± 0.6 kg; P < 0.001), and these decreases were greater (P < 0.001) than placebo. Twelve weeks after oxandrolone was discontinued (week 24), the increments in LBM and muscle strength were no longer different from baseline (P > 0.15). However, the decreases in total and trunk fat were sustained (-1.5 ± 1.8, P = 0.001 and -1.0 ± 1.1 kg, P < 0.001, respectively). Thus oxandrolone induced short-term improvements in LBM, muscle area, and strength, while reducing whole body and trunk adiposity. Anabolic improvements were lost 12 wk after discontinuing oxandrolone, whereas improvements in fat mass were largely sustained.

a study from old men with little to no natural test is iffy information at best.

everyone loves scientific studies but the truth is 99% of all studies are done on old men , women , aids patients , etc. and the results have very little bearing on how the sports community uses these compounds.