Cruise on High doses Test/Other compounds

[omgmike1]

Has anyone cruised on 500mg of test E a week for a long period of time? How did it go?

How about other compounds?

The only complications I can see in this would be:
-HPTA recovery to nearly none
-HDL/LDL problems
-High Hemo
-High BP
-Faster Baldness IF PRONE


Is there anymore sides one would need to be aware of on this type of cruise? Say if everything was managed and in check by correct clean diet, small natural supps/Low sodium to reduce BP, donate blood once in a while to lower hemo...then would everything be Okay as long as the user was to accept No future HPTA recovery?

 

[halfwit]

You pretty much have it, assuming that estradiol is in check. I will say that occasionally donating blood probably won't cut it, and platelet apheresis would become a necessity - as well as possibly self phlebotomy. Hematocrit is a battle even us guys on TRT have to battle with, so cruising on a decent dose of androgens will present a challenge for sure.

I will say that I have spent a great deal of time at supraphysiological levels of test, and it has taken some serious learning on how to control the longer term effects. I am primary hypogonadal, so aside from health risks, this isn't as big of a decision for me as my ability to make testosterone went away long ago.

Just be responsible and give some serious thought to the consequences. I wouldn't be nearly as adventurous with AAS if I still had a working yam sack for sure.

My .02c

 

[DinoTexas]

Well said Halfwit

 

[omgmike1]

You pretty much have it, assuming that estradiol is in check. I will say that occasionally donating blood probably won't cut it, and platelet apheresis would become a necessity - as well as possibly self phlebotomy. Hematocrit is a battle even us guys on TRT have to battle with, so cruising on a decent dose of androgens will present a challenge for sure.

I will say that I have spent a great deal of time at supraphysiological levels of test, and it has taken some serious learning on how to control the longer term effects. I am primary hypogonadal, so aside from health risks, this isn't as big of a decision for me as my ability to make testosterone went away long ago.

Just be responsible and give some serious thought to the consequences. I wouldn't be nearly as adventurous with AAS if I still had a working yam sack for sure.

My .02c

I can't find the study for the grapefruit, but it has a effect on it and it is suppose to work very very good. Look it up if u can. I'm planning on gettting bloods done this week to find out whats going on. My face is often red, U think this is a sign of high Hemo? Especially when I work out.


PS: Here is my PLANS to combat the problems after doing research:

-High blood pressure:
*Systolic (Top): Pressure in Arterys when Hearbeats (Most important)
*Diastolic (Botm): Pressure in Arterys btw Heartbeats
*Garlic (600-1g ED), Potassium (500-1g ED), Coenzyme Q10 (45-60mg ED), Celery Extract (75-150mg x2 ED), Cardio, Less Na, Less BF
*Range: 120-140 mmHg/80-90 mmHg Good

-High RBC/High Hemoglobin:
*RBC Carry Oxygen and Remove CO2 from Lungs
*Donate Blood, Donate Double RBC, Drink Water, Less Red Meat, Asprin (100mg ED), Half GrapeFruit Study ED
*Range: Hematocrit Less than 45 Good


-Watch LDL/HDL Levels:
*LDL = Bad Builds Plaque in Arterys, HDL = Good helps remove Plaque in Arterys
*LDL Lower by: Chromium (15-200mcg ED) Less BF/Exercise, Eat Veg/Whole Grains/Fiber,
*HDL Raise by: Niacin Caps (2-3g ED), Coenzyme Q10 (200mg ED Especially if taking Niacin/Chrom)
*Statin Drugs = Lower LDL Levels By blocking Enzymes = Must Take Coenzyme Q10 Supp
*Range: LDL 100-130 mg/dL Good, HDL 45-60 mg/dL Good

 

[halfwit]

Careful with the grapefruit. It is a CYP3A14 downregulator, which means that it slows your body's ability to metabolize drugs. This can lead to potential overdose situations as it literally changes projected half-lives.

Having a red complexion is often a sign of higher hematocrit, which is often mistaken for high blood pressure. Funny thing is, you can't see any visible signs of high bp, but that extra iron in your blood sure shows up!

Fish oil should be added to your bp stack, and it's DIASTOLIC that's the important one. Systolic can actually climb quite a bit before you may experience organ damage. I am on lisinopril as well as hydroclorothiazide, so while I have been able to control bp without drugs - on blasts, you may have to go through the process of picking up pharmaceutical drugs.

I advise against statin use. Every single study not funded by big pharma not only show that statins are dangerous, but the correlation between cholesterol and plaque causing heart disease is weak at best. In fact, our bodies NEED cholesterol as that's the source of material used in many hormones (steroids to be exact). Fiber intake will honestly do more for you than anything else in that stack.

 

[omgmike1]

Careful with the grapefruit. It is a CYP3A14 downregulator, which means that it slows your body's ability to metabolize drugs. This can lead to potential overdose situations as it literally changes projected half-lives.

Having a red complexion is often a sign of higher hematocrit, which is often mistaken for high blood pressure. Funny thing is, you can't see any visible signs of high bp, but that extra iron in your blood sure shows up!

Fish oil should be added to your bp stack, and it's DIASTOLIC that's the important one. Systolic can actually climb quite a bit before you may experience organ damage. I am on lisinopril as well as hydroclorothiazide, so while I have been able to control bp without drugs - on blasts, you may have to go through the process of picking up pharmaceutical drugs.

I advise against statin use. Every single study not funded by big pharma not only show that statins are dangerous, but the correlation between cholesterol and plaque causing heart disease is weak at best. In fact, our bodies NEED cholesterol as that's the source of material used in many hormones (steroids to be exact). Fiber intake will honestly do more for you than anything else in that stack.

Interesting, did not know that about grapefruit messing with half lives.

I heard that celery extract is very powerful against high BP, so I'm looking to throw that into the stack and I'll see how BP goes from there. I remember reading a story of a guy eating so much celery in 1 day that it killed his BP so low that he needed to get help. So it Should not be too hard to manage this one with proper dosage if this is correct. I also take 2 fish oils a day for breakfast. What does the fish oil do in regards to BP/Hemo?

I don't have anyway of lowering Hemo if it's aproblem in my up coming blood tests now. Nott sure what I can do other than donate blood, but even if I do a double RBC, then would I not have to do it EVERY month crusing on 500? Can u give me advise on this to lower hemo. I heard blood thinners like 100mg-80mg asprin can lower it down if taken every day, but I'm also running accutane for acne, not sure if I want to combine orals, let alone when I run anadrol or d-bol in a blast..

As for HDL/LDL stuff, U say that I should throw out the other stuff and just work with fiber? I get almost ALL of my carb sources from Oats, Rye breads ect.. Nothing sugary whatsoever. So using this reasoning I'm thinking my chol should be okay.

 

[oldmusclemike]

Interesting, did not know that about grapefruit messing with half lives.

I heard that celery extract is very powerful against high BP, so I'm looking to throw that into the stack and I'll see how BP goes from there. I remember reading a story of a guy eating so much celery in 1 day that it killed his BP so low that he needed to get help. So it Should not be too hard to manage this one with proper dosage if this is correct. I also take 2 fish oils a day for breakfast. What does the fish oil do in regards to BP/Hemo?

I don't have anyway of lowering Hemo if it's aproblem in my up coming blood tests now. Nott sure what I can do other than donate blood, but even if I do a double RBC, then would I not have to do it EVERY month crusing on 500? Can u give me advise on this to lower hemo. I heard blood thinners like 100mg-80mg asprin can lower it down if taken every day, but I'm also running accutane for acne, not sure if I want to combine orals, let alone when I run anadrol or d-bol in a blast..

As for HDL/LDL stuff, U say that I should throw out the other stuff and just work with fiber? I get almost ALL of my carb sources from Oats, Rye breads ect.. Nothing sugary whatsoever. So using this reasoning I'm thinking my chol should be okay.

I have done 500mg -1,000mg a week fluctuating the 500 - 750-1,000 mg for 8 months straight. Myself the only problem I had with my lab results was my Estrogen. That was hard because I was not consistent with dosing. Keep the BW going regularly and manage you "E" level. I had no other problem myself. That's my 2 cents. Good luck!

 

[halfwit]

Interesting, did not know that about grapefruit messing with half lives.

I heard that celery extract is very powerful against high BP, so I'm looking to throw that into the stack and I'll see how BP goes from there. I remember reading a story of a guy eating so much celery in 1 day that it killed his BP so low that he needed to get help. So it Should not be too hard to manage this one with proper dosage if this is correct. I also take 2 fish oils a day for breakfast. What does the fish oil do in regards to BP/Hemo?

I don't have anyway of lowering Hemo if it's aproblem in my up coming blood tests now. Nott sure what I can do other than donate blood, but even if I do a double RBC, then would I not have to do it EVERY month crusing on 500? Can u give me advise on this to lower hemo. I heard blood thinners like 100mg-80mg asprin can lower it down if taken every day, but I'm also running accutane for acne, not sure if I want to combine orals, let alone when I run anadrol or d-bol in a blast..

As for HDL/LDL stuff, U say that I should throw out the other stuff and just work with fiber? I get almost ALL of my carb sources from Oats, Rye breads ect.. Nothing sugary whatsoever. So using this reasoning I'm thinking my chol should be okay.

I honestly don't remember the mechanism by which fish oil reduces blood pressure, but I had read a bunch of studies was able to get the wife completely off bp meds by just having her supplement 1g of fish oil daily. If I stumble upon one of the studies, I'll edit it in.

I'm skeptical when it comes to stuff like hawthorn berry/celery seed/milkthistle as most of the results are often anecdotal and my personal experience has been less than spectacular with them. Unfortunately I do not know of ANY product that can reduce hematocrit. Aspirin just helps to prevent clots as it makes your platelets and blood cells "slippery", preventing them from sticking together.

I would avoid prescription blood thinners as they have their own issues, and can be more trouble than they're worth. I donate platelets every other week myself, as my red marrow just shits out RBCs and platelets. This is a fact you're going to have to face if you want to do this, and stay healthy. It's a pain in the ass, but certainly beats the alternative.

Yep, the dirty secret that for some retarded reason the medical community never talks about is that fiber intake is HUGE. A great deal of our body's "operating system" resides in the gut. If you have poor gut health, everything else will suffer. Fiber helps to regulate things "down under", which includes your cholesterol. Of course, there's far less money in docs telling folks to just get more fiber in their diets than a script for a statin of their pharma rep's choice. Maybe I solved that mystery afterall.

As Mike mentioned, just stay on top of bloods, and you should be fine.

 

[Repo]

I honestly don't remember the mechanism by which fish oil reduces blood pressure, but I had read a bunch of studies was able to get the wife completely off bp meds by just having her supplement 1g of fish oil daily. If I stumble upon one of the studies, I'll edit it in.

I'm skeptical when it comes to stuff like hawthorn berry/celery seed/milkthistle as most of the results are often anecdotal and my personal experience has been less than spectacular with them. Unfortunately I do not know of ANY product that can reduce hematocrit. Aspirin just helps to prevent clots as it makes your platelets and blood cells "slippery", preventing them from sticking together.

I would avoid prescription blood thinners as they have their own issues, and can be more trouble than they're worth. I donate platelets every other week myself, as my red marrow just shits out RBCs and platelets. This is a fact you're going to have to face if you want to do this, and stay healthy. It's a pain in the ass, but certainly beats the alternative.

Yep, the dirty secret that for some retarded reason the medical community never talks about is that fiber intake is HUGE. A great deal of our body's "operating system" resides in the gut. If you have poor gut health, everything else will suffer. Fiber helps to regulate things "down under", which includes your cholesterol. Of course, there's far less money in docs telling folks to just get more fiber in their diets than a script for a statin of their pharma rep's choice. Maybe I solved that mystery afterall.

As Mike mentioned, just stay on top of bloods, and you should be fine.

I had a major surgery a while back and was taking two 1200mg caps 4-5 times a day... fish oil is also a blood thinner and when
I told the anesthesiologist how much fish oil I was taking, they had to do a blood clog test to make sure my blood wasn't too thin.

Yes - fish oil is great for the heart.

 

[omgmike1]

I honestly don't remember the mechanism by which fish oil reduces blood pressure, but I had read a bunch of studies was able to get the wife completely off bp meds by just having her supplement 1g of fish oil daily. If I stumble upon one of the studies, I'll edit it in.

I'm skeptical when it comes to stuff like hawthorn berry/celery seed/milkthistle as most of the results are often anecdotal and my personal experience has been less than spectacular with them. Unfortunately I do not know of ANY product that can reduce hematocrit. Aspirin just helps to prevent clots as it makes your platelets and blood cells "slippery", preventing them from sticking together.

I would avoid prescription blood thinners as they have their own issues, and can be more trouble than they're worth. I donate platelets every other week myself, as my red marrow just shits out RBCs and platelets. This is a fact you're going to have to face if you want to do this, and stay healthy. It's a pain in the ass, but certainly beats the alternative.

Yep, the dirty secret that for some retarded reason the medical community never talks about is that fiber intake is HUGE. A great deal of our body's "operating system" resides in the gut. If you have poor gut health, everything else will suffer. Fiber helps to regulate things "down under", which includes your cholesterol. Of course, there's far less money in docs telling folks to just get more fiber in their diets than a script for a statin of their pharma rep's choice. Maybe I solved that mystery afterall.

As Mike mentioned, just stay on top of bloods, and you should be fine.

I'm not sure for My Hemo Yet, I'm goona just have to let that wait till I get bloods done in the coming up week, I've never donated blood before. Is there anything I should do in the process? I heard that I can just lie about AAS, get blood removed, Opt out at end? Not exactly sure...Can u tell me ur experiences and How often would u say I should do it if my hemo is high?

As for the fish oil, I'll be taking it a lot more often. Repo is giving some high doses for fish oil, What do u think is good to run by. I did a quick BP check and it turned out to be 160/79. I recall u said Diastolic was most important, thats always been good for me, but this systolic is going damn crazy...even running 1g garlic a day and not sure what else to do right now... thoughts? U think I should up my fish oil to what g a day?

 

[halfwit]

I'm not sure for My Hemo Yet, I'm goona just have to let that wait till I get bloods done in the coming up week, I've never donated blood before. Is there anything I should do in the process? I heard that I can just lie about AAS, get blood removed, Opt out at end? Not exactly sure...Can u tell me ur experiences and How often would u say I should do it if my hemo is high?

As for the fish oil, I'll be taking it a lot more often. Repo is giving some high doses for fish oil, What do u think is good to run by. I did a quick BP check and it turned out to be 160/79. I recall u said Diastolic was most important, thats always been good for me, but this systolic is going damn crazy...even running 1g garlic a day and not sure what else to do right now... thoughts? U think I should up my fish oil to what g a day?

The donation question is a moral one. While it's a fact that the hormones in your blood will decay long before they see a recipient, some still feel that it's wrong to donate and not have them dump the blood.

I personally have zero issue donating and only admitting to TRT. I have verified that my platelets (and blood) are not hazardous to others, so my conscience is clear. You're probably going to need to donate every time you can, or start doing apheresis.

The process is really as simple as coming in, reading a book, answering some questions, getting a finger prick for hemoglobin (x3 for HCT), then sitting in a chair while they drain a pint of blood. Just make sure you're well hydrated before you go in.

How long have you been on a higher dose? It sounds to me like your estradiol is high, bringing up that blood pressure. I personally have found great results at 2g of fish oil a day, but have gone higher. This is something you'll need to experiment a bit with to see what works best for you.

A systolic under 190 is fine short term. (100 diastolic) Just try not to let it stay there. (your blood test should hopefully bring light to the situation)

 

[omgmike1]

The donation question is a moral one. While it's a fact that the hormones in your blood will decay long before they see a recipient, some still feel that it's wrong to donate and not have them dump the blood.

I personally have zero issue donating and only admitting to TRT. I have verified that my platelets (and blood) are not hazardous to others, so my conscience is clear. You're probably going to need to donate every time you can, or start doing apheresis.

The process is really as simple as coming in, reading a book, answering some questions, getting a finger prick for hemoglobin (x3 for HCT), then sitting in a chair while they drain a pint of blood. Just make sure you're well hydrated before you go in.

How long have you been on a higher dose? It sounds to me like your estradiol is high, bringing up that blood pressure. I personally have found great results at 2g of fish oil a day, but have gone higher. This is something you'll need to experiment a bit with to see what works best for you.

A systolic under 190 is fine short term. (100 diastolic) Just try not to let it stay there. (your blood test should hopefully bring light to the situation)

I read that 180 Sys should admit to ER asap and when I was near 160 I was very worried and ur telling me that 190 is fine, are you sure on this cause I do not understand and would really not like to have cardiac problems

I'll try running 2g fish oil daily, see how it goes and run BP again in a week or so.

I been on Test E 500mg since 3/31, so thats about 3-4 months? I was using the test to cut , dropped about 15-20 lbs. Pretty lean now and planning on doing a small bulk, u think if I keep running test 500, that I would put on good size off it, even though I been running it for so long? Never really used it to bulk in the first place or would it be a stagnant effect with little gains after being on for about 4 months? Planning a few blasts for the up coming year when I can get the stuff within a few months coming up and running 500 as a base for each blast

 

[DinoTexas]

I spoke to my nurse about this. For the record, I donate every two months religiously and I find that if I don't that I will cross over into high hemo land. My nurse knows I'm on TRTand had no issue with it whatsoever. As we were having this discussion, a big mother fucker walked in to donate. I'm talking 6'2 285kind of big and clearly on a bunch of gear. He may have had a needle sticking out of his Delt, that's how obvious it was. So I asked my nurse, what do you guys think when a guy like that comes in to donate? She said, we need the blood and it is all cleaned before getting used so we're fine with it. Honestly, she didn't want to talk about it but made it clear that it was fine

 

[halfwit]

I read that 180 Sys should admit to ER asap and when I was near 160 I was very worried and ur telling me that 190 is fine, are you sure on this cause I do not understand and would really not like to have cardiac problems

I'll try running 2g fish oil daily, see how it goes and run BP again in a week or so.

I been on Test E 500mg since 3/31, so thats about 3-4 months? I was using the test to cut , dropped about 15-20 lbs. Pretty lean now and planning on doing a small bulk, u think if I keep running test 500, that I would put on good size off it, even though I been running it for so long? Never really used it to bulk in the first place or would it be a stagnant effect with little gains after being on for about 4 months? Planning a few blasts for the up coming year when I can get the stuff within a few months coming up and running 500 as a base for each blast

Yes, they call it a hypertensive crisis, however that is intended for the general public which is likely not on top of keeping track of their vitals. Remember, the majority of people that have any health issues are obese and do not exercise. It's more or less intended to scare them into getting things under control. I've spoken to a few cardiologists about this, and while it's not healthy to have a systolic above 170, your heart isn't going to explode instantly.

You do want to bring it down, but I'm saying not to panic.

What's your AI dose looking like? Stagnation occurs from a lack of diet change, not the hormones. Unless you've gotten so huge that 500mg is a maintenance dose, which means you better get ready for the Olympias lol.

 

[omgmike1]

Yes, they call it a hypertensive crisis, however that is intended for the general public which is likely not on top of keeping track of their vitals. Remember, the majority of people that have any health issues are obese and do not exercise. It's more or less intended to scare them into getting things under control. I've spoken to a few cardiologists about this, and while it's not healthy to have a systolic above 170, your heart isn't going to explode instantly.

You do want to bring it down, but I'm saying not to panic.

What's your AI dose looking like? Stagnation occurs from a lack of diet change, not the hormones. Unless you've gotten so huge that 500mg is a maintenance dose, which means you better get ready for the Olympias lol.

Okay, I'll simmer down on the 160 level and maintain for the 2 weeks till I get get to my doc. Deal with it then, but I'lll work with all the good info you guys given me. TY

My AI is .5 Adex E3d and 500mg Test E a week. I had no Gyno on this dose, no hair loss, no acne (accutane ran). All seemed good but the BP stuff to me. I used it to cut for 4 months and now I want to bulk on it with the remainder few vials before I get the blasting stuff, I'm upping my calories by about 250-500 a week after losing decent amount of weight to find my new mateience level and once I do, I'm going to use that as a decent base for blasts. I know regularly natural guys should put on .5-1lb a week as a goal, but when ur on a blast with 3 or more compounds, would it be more optimal to aim for a higher weight gain such as 1.5-2lbs a week? And is that extra weight done by the calories in take OR do the compounds help defy the rule by u just being in a surplus in general? What do u think or stick to the general 1 lb a week rule? I do understand diet very well, I'm slowly changing it, I was asking this Q cause I heard stag gains can appear after being on the same stuff for so long. Just something I read

 

[halfwit]

Okay, I'll simmer down on the 160 level and maintain for the 2 weeks till I get get to my doc. Deal with it then, but I'lll work with all the good info you guys given me. TY

My AI is .5 Adex E3d and 500mg Test E a week. I had no Gyno on this dose, no hair loss, no acne (accutane ran). All seemed good but the BP stuff to me. I used it to cut for 4 months and now I want to bulk on it with the remainder few vials before I get the blasting stuff, I'm upping my calories by about 250-500 a week after losing decent amount of weight to find my new mateience level and once I do, I'm going to use that as a decent base for blasts. I know regularly natural guys should put on .5-1lb a week as a goal, but when ur on a blast with 3 or more compounds, would it be more optimal to aim for a higher weight gain such as 1.5-2lbs a week? And is that extra weight done by the calories in take OR do the compounds help defy the rule by u just being in a surplus in general? What do u think or stick to the general 1 lb a week rule? I do understand diet very well, I'm slowly changing it, I was asking this Q cause I heard stag gains can appear after being on the same stuff for so long. Just something I read

I'm definitely curious what your estradiol comes back at then. That's a good AI dose, but everyone's different.

Those numbers are pretty optimistic lol. I'd probably cut that natty number in half, and limit it to like 40lbs overall, unless we're talking a very underfed person starting up. After that, it becomes quite difficult to keep putting on mass naturally.

OK, so it's the calories (food) that determines what happens, and if in a surplus - either fat is deposited, or lean mass is grown based on the needs from the environment. In our cases, the environment is a constant tearing of muscle fibers, telling our body that we need more to survive.

That's where the AAS come into play as it not only promotes an anabolic environment (higher nitrogen retention, which is used with protein to create muscle), but it also improves recovery time - allowing for more frequent and intense training (more fiber tearing).

I would be super happy to gain 6-10lbs of lean mass on cycle, as that's a significant amount of tissue growth. Think of a 5lb hamburger log, now imagine your prediction of adding one of those a WEEK to your body. Unfortunately, our bodies just can't do that.

Guys that tout 40lb gains from a 12 week cycle are often carrying 3 gallons of water (24lbs), 10lbs of fat, and maybe 6lbs of new lean mass. Of course, those are the same guys that scream how they lost all their gains after PCT too (you'll always lose *some*), and start crying about how AAS is a joke.

Geez, I'm rambling. Anyhoo, hope that makes sense.

 

[omgmike1]

I'm definitely curious what your estradiol comes back at then. That's a good AI dose, but everyone's different.

Those numbers are pretty optimistic lol. I'd probably cut that natty number in half, and limit it to like 40lbs overall, unless we're talking a very underfed person starting up. After that, it becomes quite difficult to keep putting on mass naturally.

OK, so it's the calories (food) that determines what happens, and if in a surplus - either fat is deposited, or lean mass is grown based on the needs from the environment. In our cases, the environment is a constant tearing of muscle fibers, telling our body that we need more to survive.

That's where the AAS come into play as it not only promotes an anabolic environment (higher nitrogen retention, which is used with protein to create muscle), but it also improves recovery time - allowing for more frequent and intense training (more fiber tearing).

I would be super happy to gain 6-10lbs of lean mass on cycle, as that's a significant amount of tissue growth. Think of a 5lb hamburger log, now imagine your prediction of adding one of those a WEEK to your body. Unfortunately, our bodies just can't do that.

Guys that tout 40lb gains from a 12 week cycle are often carrying 3 gallons of water (24lbs), 10lbs of fat, and maybe 6lbs of new lean mass. Of course, those are the same guys that scream how they lost all their gains after PCT too (you'll always lose *some*), and start crying about how AAS is a joke.

Geez, I'm rambling. Anyhoo, hope that makes sense.

Thanks halfwit, It's people like you that make a major diff for others. All the advice you gave is great and the answering the Q's is much appreciated. It means a lot to me compared to other times when people just say go search and u end up with a million diff answers and more confused and I also appreciate the fact u didn't flame or troll about 500mg cruise like I would have expected a decent amount of members to do. Your a good guy

 

[halfwit]

Thanks halfwit, It's people like you that make a major diff for others. All the advice you gave is great and the answering the Q's is much appreciated. It means a lot to me compared to other times when people just say go search and u end up with a million diff answers and more confused and I also appreciate the fact u didn't flame or troll about 500mg cruise like I would have expected a decent amount of members to do. Your a good guy

And I'm on trenbolone right now...

My pleasure, just trying to do my part.

 

[Dirkmcgirk]

OMGMike what would be you objective at cruising so high??

 

[omgmike1]

OMGMike what would be you objective at cruising so high??

I was using 500 to cut for about 15 weeks, then Going to bulk up for 15 weeks with it. Then drop down and cruise on maybe 250 or 125 for a while, then do my winter blasts.