Eat real food? No protein shake.

[Mrrippedzilla]

Fine, I'll continue - it'll be interesting to see how people view you on this site after this

I don't care who you train when you don't even know carbs blunt hgh...... (that causes igf production)

Never said that - reread my post.

why don't you google intermittent fasting and see that they have higher levels of HGH then traditional dieters..........get ready for it....they retain muscle from the extra hgh igf in a calorie deficit.

Intermittent fasting has already been proven to offer no advantages over normal dieting methods - go to pubmed and find the studies for yourself.

And are you fkn kidding me diet doesn't play a role in hgh production????

Nope, didn't say that either - reread my post again.

And fat oxidation is mostly triggered by intramuscular triglycerides which are activated during intense cardio. Running an ckd diet during cardio is slightly different then eating carbs right before bed, so wtf r u talking about? unless you're referring to your type 2 diabetic that has sky high insulin that's been jogging for the last hour. What you're saying goes against the very concept of how fasted cardio works.

Fat oxidization is increased because your in a caloric DEFICIT - this overrides everything to do with insulin, how else do you think people lose fat even on high carb diets.
Under your bullshit we all have to completely deplete glycogen before we lose fat - studies show that this is nonsense.

Also, fasted cardio has been proven to be the SAME as non-fasted cardio for everyone outside of the very lean (sub 10%bf or so). Here is one of many studies to prove it:
[url=http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25429252]Body composition changes associated with fasted versus non-fasted a... - PubMed - NCBI[/URL]

And since I can't be bothered to go into the details with someone like you - here is a good explanation by Lyle Mcdonald (a legit expert) on why GH plays a secondary role & isn't significant for fat loss:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/growth-hormone-gh-release-and-fat-loss.html/

Before you continue this display of butthurt (I know you will), bear in mind that the meta-analysis I posted has disproven literally everything you've said here regarding insulin spikes, eating before bed, etc.

Now, considering all the evidence is against you, do carry on

 

[PrinceDianabol]

ooooh shit... you just got Zilla'd! Lol, this thread made my day.

 

[Rida5d]

ooooh shit... you just got Zilla'd! Lol, this thread made my day.

This guy zilla is amazing..

Wtf?? he is a walking encyclopedia ..

I know nothing about diet but when I read such studies I know that the way I approached things before was so much wrong..

So one more time I'm thanking you , zilla, for the info u are teaching me everyday.

 

[hiram1st]

This guy zilla is amazing..

Wtf?? he is a walking encyclopedia ..

I know nothing about diet but when I read such studies I know that the way I approached things before was so much wrong..

So one more time I'm thanking you , zilla, for the info u are teaching me everyday.

Same here Rida. Always learning about the right way to do something I was doing wrong for years.

 

[cybrsage]

I used to do fasted cardio because I read (on forums such as this, not necessarily this one) that is was better for you...depleting glycogen stores, etc. But most likely everyone saying it was at 10% body fat or less...and since I am not it does not apply to me. I have since stopped causing myself unneeded pain and I now do my cardio later in the day.

EDIT: I am giving those who said it was better the benefit of the doubt that they were low body fat. They could have been simply regurgitating bro science...but since I do not know, I think it is better to be nice than mean.

 

[tbonexl]

Zilla for prez '16

 

[bonexyster]

Fat oxidization is increased because your in a caloric DEFICIT - this overrides everything to do with insulin, how else do you think people lose fat even on high carb diets.*
Under your bullshit we all have to completely deplete glycogen before we lose fat - studies show that this is nonsense.

Fat oxidation is not (increased) or maximized on high carb. You just stated they are in a deficit. Low running full supply to begin with. The carbohydrates take longer to be broken down an capable of being deposited in adipose tissue and stored as fat. Anything you do while you have a deficit will deplete fuel supply and begin fat oxidation. When a ckd diet already has your body in fat oxidation mode. The high carb diet is another word from low fat which is simply more easily stored as fat then carbs so as long as your in a deficit your pretty close to a fasting mode. So high carb diet do (NOT) work by (INCREASING) fat oxidation. It's starves you body of its fuel source by taking longer to deposit fat then storing it.

REFERENCES
Gonzalez, J. T., et al. Breakfast and exercise contingently affect postprandial metabolism and energy balance in physically active males. Br J Nutr. 23:1-12, 2013.Deighton, K., et al. Appetite, energy intake and resting ********* responses to 60 min treadmill running performed in a fasted versus a postprandial state. Appetite. 2012 Jun;58(3):946-54.Hansen, K., et al.. The effects of exercise on the storage and oxidation of dietary fat. Sports Med 35: 363-373, 2005.

^^3 2014 journal of medicine studies proving fast cardio works better then having ate. And carbs absolutely do hinder the results.


In short short fat oxidation occurs when you depleted are short of glycogen regardless of what diet you're on. And again only ckd style diets induce the increase of fat oxidation.

Carbs oxidize fat LOL

 

[Mrrippedzilla]

Fat oxidation is not (increased) or maximized on high carb.
So high carb diet do (NOT) work by (INCREASING) fat oxidation. It's starves you body of its fuel source by taking longer to deposit fat then storing it.

And where exactly did I say that high carbs work by increasing fat oxidation?
What I said was CALORIC DEFICITS in general lead to higher fat oxidation than normal - regardless of macro composition.

That's at least 3 times were you've misinterpreted my posts on purpose in order to try and discredit me - how's that going by the way?

REFERENCES
Gonzalez, J. T., et al. Breakfast and exercise contingently affect postprandial metabolism and energy balance in physically active males. Br J Nutr. 23:1-12, 2013.Deighton, K., et al.

Appetite, energy intake and resting ********* responses to 60 min treadmill running performed in a fasted versus a postprandial state. Appetite. 2012 Jun;58(3):946-54.Hansen, K., et al..

The effects of exercise on the storage and oxidation of dietary fat. Sports Med 35: 363-373, 2005.

^^3 2014 journal of medicine studies proving fast cardio works better then having ate. And carbs absolutely do hinder the results.

Study 1:
I've actually read the full study unlike you.
All this study proved is the OPPOSITE of what your saying - it proved that lipolysis during low intensity exercise was NOT blunted when carried out in a fed state.
That means use of fat for energy during low intensity cardio was the same whether fasted or not.

It even states this in the abstract :
"REGARDLESS of breakfast, acute exercise produced a less positive energy balance following ad libitum lunch consumption."
The reason the group who skipped breakfast and did cardio had a lower energy balance than the group who didn't skip breakfast is because they consumed LESS CALORIES.

Well done for finding a study that completely goes against the point your trying to prove LOL.


Study 2:
LOL
Again this study clearly concludes that the cardio was equally effective when performed both before AND after breakfast:
"These findings suggest that 60 min treadmill running induces a negative daily energy balance relative to a sedentary day but is no more effective when performed before or after breakfast."

So that's 2 for 2 for studies NOT showing fasted cardio to work better or carbs to hinder results - lets see if we can make it 3 for 3...


Study 3:
Yes we can!

All this study proved was that fat burning must be considered over the course of days - not on an hour to hour basis - to meaningfully assess its impact on body composition.
It actually looked at the different intensity levels of cardio, not the timing of it.
It says NOTHING about fasted cardio working better & NOTHING about carbs hindering results.


Summary:
3 studies that DONT prove that fasted cardio works better or that carbs hinder results, in fact the first 2 prove that fasted/non-fasted is the same - further proof for me.
In your poor effort to support your position, you've somehow managed to find more evidence to support mine LOL.

Keep it coming man!
Everyone can see that you are WAY out of your league here.
I've already proven that you are full of shit, now lets see how long it takes you to realise this.
By the time I'm done, no one on this board will ever take your advice seriously again


Sidenote:
I appreciate all the support from you guys.
Its good to know that members can see who has real knowledge & who doesn't.

 

[Southernfish]

Holy!! I need some advil, lol. I think im gonna sit down and eat some chicken and rice. Probably do that once more too. Might even have ice cream before bed tonight too

 

[bonexyster]

Holy!! I need some advil, lol. I think im gonna sit down and eat some chicken and rice. Probably do that once more too. Might even have ice cream before bed tonight too

Hahahaha!!!!

 

[carverelli]

Shoot, I'm digging out my hot air popper. E fights are awesome! I was always under the false illusion that fasted cardio led to greater fat burn percentage. Exercise physiology facinates me to say the least

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

hahahaha

 

[Milton]

In my humble opinion its best not to force the body to shed pounds as those proteins for your body to do. Its best to go all natural, if you force your body to do anything it ages it, makes your heart to work harder, etc, etc, etc. I know that alot of people here are shaking their heads here, but like I said, its my humble opinion. The more natural a diet, the more you will gain or shed depending on your mission. I will drink right out of a cows utter if it will help me with my goals. 3J will give you the best advice here so follow his lead as he can design any type of diet regime that you require. Good luck.