First Cycle. Criticism welcome.

D

DaVinc

New member
This is my first post here as well as any forum like this. Anyways lets get to the meat of things. I've trained for 6-7 years. 25 years old. Always around 8-9% BF at most. Weighing in at 185lbs. 6'Ft tall.
Okay so with all of that out of the way.
Starting my cycle in Feb 2017. I'm currently waiting on my lab req so I can go get my bloodwork done. I went thru the route of privatemdlabs for the female hormone panel and liver test as well.
Depending on that bloodwork the cycle Im looking at it is 12wks long. I already have the gear just finalizing my diet, workout and bloods before I dive in.
1-4 DBOL 20mg ED
1-12 Test E 600mg (300mg twice a week)

pct 14-18 Torem @60mg tapered down

I have letro on hand as a just in case. My main question to you guys is do you think I should add an AI for the first four weeks based off your experience with DBOL? I know it heavily aromatizes and every one reacts differently to it. Another route that I have been thinking of going is switching out the Fareston for Raloxfiene based off some of the reviews and studies I have been reading.

Still havent pulled the trigger on what route I want to go for needles. General consensus seems to be 20G for withdrawing, however I'm still not decided between a 23G or 25G 1" for the injecting. Any words of wisedom for that route would be very appreciated.

Any input, good or bad, would be much appreciated.
Thanks.
 
Save the Dbol for your next cycle . even without it you SHOULD be running an AI with 600mg a week of test. don't run the dbol on your first cycle because you need to learn how to manage sides, and estrogen control with just test alone first .

for Pct I'd go with nolva and clomid. also I'd run HCG the duration of your cycle to help you recover better.

as for needle size , depends on the muscle group your injecting . I go as small as 30g for my biceps and chest, and as large as 23g for my shoulders. just depends on personal preference
 
i usually use a 25g 1 inch for pretty much everywhere i pin, but i havent started pinning my smaller muscle groups yet.
 
I agree with roush 100%!
Don't forget to get blood work after started to keep an eye on E2 levels.
BUT,
What are you going to do if your natural test levels come back high?
Are you sure you need to jump in already? You're only 25 yrs old. Have you thought about trying a SARM?
 
Thanks for the replys and advice. You could say that the dbol kickstart is just me being too impatient waiting for the Test E to kick in.
Any reason in particular you would recommend the Nolva over torem or ralox?

I plan on injecting in my quads possibly glutes.
Im honestly expecting my test levels to come back higher than average, but who knows. I'm going to get the blood drawn Friday morning. Ill post the results up once I get them.
I've looked into Sarms before and honestly feel as if they're still in a large gray area. It seems to me that they tried to pick up where prohormones left off once they were banned. I'd rather commit to a tried and true method.
 
DaVinc said:
Thanks for the replys and advice. You could say that the dbol kickstart is just me being too impatient waiting for the Test E to kick in.
Any reason in particular you would recommend the Nolva over torem or ralox?

I plan on injecting in my quads possibly glutes.
Im honestly expecting my test levels to come back higher than average, but who knows. I'm going to get the blood drawn Friday morning. Ill post the results up once I get them.
I've looked into Sarms before and honestly feel as if they're still in a large gray area. It seems to me that they tried to pick up where prohormones left off once they were banned. I'd rather commit to a tried and true method.
Click to expand...

yeah thats pretty common . if you really wanted things to kick in quicker , then just add a small amount of test prop to this cycle for the first few weeks along with the test e. that way your still only running test, but things are kicking in much quicker.
the problem with going with a Dbol kicker on your fist cycle is you really don't know how your body Aromatizes and deals with estrogen . Dbol kicks in fast and you could bloat up with a ton of estrogen , have BP issues, sex drive issues, etc. and thats not how you want to start off a cycle.

^thats not to say I'm not a fan of Dbol. I run it all the time , but I know how many body reacts and what I need to take with it , and if I'm running a high dose of test with a high dose of Dbol, I actually run an AI like arimidex PLUS letro with it 3 x per week. I learned that through trial and error. however, if I just run my low TRT dose of test, and just add in 30-40mg of Dbol, then I just run adex .5mg Eod and I have no issues.

BUT you should learn how your body amortizes and deals with Test only before adding in these other highly aromatizing compounds.

IF you were dead set on wanting to run an oral with this cycle , then you should stick to something that does not aromatize , like Var or Tbol. but still i recommend test only


as for pct , I personally don't pct as i'm on TRT and I blast and cruise . but most guys have had really good luck running hcg and then stacking Nolva and clomid. if you prefer ralox in place of nolva that would be fine i'm sure.


for injecting glutes, 1"- 1.5" 25g usually works just fine. for quads, if your low body fat, you could get by with just a slin pin
 
your cycle looks good but add HCG thru cycle and run normal PCT ( nolva and clomid ) after cycle. Remember each time you are on cycle you destroy something in your body so make sure that you destroy as little as possible thats why you need to take hcg thru cycle and good/normal PCT after it.
 
Congrats on your first post OP and we'll done!! Can see u have done some research. Follow above.advise and u should be smooth sailing. Gains will come given your diet and training are on point with your goals. Welcome to ology btw. Stay teachable.
 
very good first post but is you are so educated why the Fvck don't you understand what is and what how an AI is used for. Ralox is NOT an AI, read up OP on AI's and why. WTF are you gonna use Letro for. AND yes start your AI right off the dock. YOU would know that if you knew what you are doing and why these things happen.

Needles dammit lets keep this simple. Draw with what you want. ANYTHING YOU WANT. Pin with what you are comfortable with. IM with 23G or 25 G. You do not have to change needles if you puncture the rubber stopper only once.

All this complicated crap. Get a 23G ' x 1" and use it for everything. Never had a problem. Done deal. But OP you gotta get educated here/ ..

I warm up my gear with a blow dryer and draw with a 23 g and then pin with the same.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the reply. Im having a tough time reading your post. If you could point out where I commented to cause you to think that I thought Ralox was an AI. I have letro "on hand just in case" as stated.

And also not everybody needs to run an AI. Everyone responds differently to different gear. If an AI is not needed then why would I want to use it? I was asking for people own personal experience with the cycle I had in mind.

I personally dont think you could look into a cycle too much that it becomes complicated. I believe everything even down to the needle should be thought out. I personally wouldn't withdraw and inject from the same needle if someone paid me to do it. Based off of how its inevitable that the needle will lose its edge and also the cleanliness factor.

But this is exactly what the forum is meant for. People to share their own personal experiences and to read with an open mind.
 
oldmusclemike said:
very good first post but is you are so educated why the Fvck don't you understand what is and what how an AI is used for. Ralox is NOT an AI, read up OP on AI's and why. WTF are you gonna use Letro for. AND yes start your AI right off the dock. YOU would know that if you knew what you are doing and why these things happen.

Needles dammit lets keep this simple. Draw with what you want. ANYTHING YOU WANT. Pin with what you are comfortable with. IM with 23G or 25 G. You do not have to change needles if you puncture the rubber stopper only once.

All this complicated crap. Get a 23G ' x 1" and use it for everything. Never had a problem. Done deal. But OP you gotta get educated here/ ..

I warm up my gear with a blow dryer and draw with a 23 g and then pin with the same.
Click to expand...
Ok, I thought this thread u wrote first thing in the morning and was going to tell u to chill drink a cup of coffee. But then noticed u wrote it last nite!! At least this newbie had an idea of what to run instead of the usual, " hey i wanna run my first cycle what should i run???" lol.
 
soldier74 said:
Ok, I thought this thread u wrote first thing in the morning and was going to tell u to chill drink a cup of coffee. But then noticed u wrote it last nite!! At least this newbie had an idea of what to run instead of the usual, " hey i wanna run my first cycle what should i run???" lol.
Click to expand...

Yea sorry as you see my T levels were up :dunno: but I seem to be getting real grouchy lately.
Not an excuse but a factor being ill isn't making me a sweet butter cup lol...:) If I'm not careful by friend Milton might show me the door out...

However you know when they say they've been reading and say dumb shit I know they are misinformed or NOT well read. AND needles I don't know why the deal. It is strictly mechanical and has nothing to do with chemistry , biology or even medicine for that matter. A few pointers and go for it.

SO OK for the madness.........
 
oldmusclemike said:
Yea sorry as you see my T levels were up :dunno: but I seem to be getting real grouchy lately.
Not an excuse but a factor being ill isn't making me a sweet butter cup lol...:) If I'm not careful by friend Milton might show me the door out...

However you know when they say they've been reading and say dumb shit I know they are misinformed or NOT well read. AND needles I don't know why the deal. It is strictly mechanical and has nothing to do with chemistry , biology or even medicine for that matter. A few pointers and go for it.

SO OK for the madness.........
Click to expand...

Your all good in my hood Mike...no explaination needed sir. I get it!
 
DaVinc said:
This is my first post here as well as any forum like this. Anyways lets get to the meat of things. I've trained for 6-7 years. 25 years old. Always around 8-9% BF at most. Weighing in at 185lbs. 6'Ft tall.
Okay so with all of that out of the way.
Starting my cycle in Feb 2017. I'm currently waiting on my lab req so I can go get my bloodwork done. I went thru the route of privatemdlabs for the female hormone panel and liver test as well.
Depending on that bloodwork the cycle Im looking at it is 12wks long. I already have the gear just finalizing my diet, workout and bloods before I dive in.
1-4 DBOL 20mg ED
1-12 Test E 600mg (300mg twice a week)

pct 14-18 Torem @60mg tapered down

I have letro on hand as a just in case. My main question to you guys is do you think I should add an AI for the first four weeks based off your experience with DBOL? I know it heavily aromatizes and every one reacts differently to it. Another route that I have been thinking of going is switching out the Fareston for Raloxfiene based off some of the reviews and studies I have been reading.

Still havent pulled the trigger on what route I want to go for needles. General consensus seems to be 20G for withdrawing, however I'm still not decided between a 23G or 25G 1" for the injecting. Any words of wisedom for that route would be very appreciated.

Any input, good or bad, would be much appreciated.
Thanks.
Click to expand...

I use 22guage 1 inch for everything.
 
DaVinc said:
Thanks for the reply. Im having a tough time reading your post. If you could point out where I commented to cause you to think that I thought Ralox was an AI. I have letro "on hand just in case" as stated.

And also not everybody needs to run an AI. Everyone responds differently to different gear. If an AI is not needed then why would I want to use it? I was asking for people own personal experience with the cycle I had in mind.

I personally dont think you could look into a cycle too much that it becomes complicated. I believe everything even down to the needle should be thought out. I personally wouldn't withdraw and inject from the same needle if someone paid me to do it. Based off of how its inevitable that the needle will lose its edge and also the cleanliness factor.

But this is exactly what the forum is meant for. People to share their own personal experiences and to read with an open mind.
Click to expand...

This post kinda cracked me up about ai use. How do you even know? You've never ran a cycle to know if you'll need an ai or not. Why do you think it's recommended to get midcycle bloodwork? Most do need an ai even on trt doses. Don't be stubborn...
 
You stated your going to do :
1-4 DBOL 20mg ED
1-12 Test E 600mg (300mg twice a week)

And you don't think you should use an AI right off the dock. Start learning and stop listening to bro -science. Yes an Ai is not ALWAYS needed but learn about your compound and then tell me you don't think or you wanna wait and use what you have on hand "JUST IN CASE" .
When you are in free fall off a roof then try and tie off your safety rope. Maybe in some cases, well let me elaborate a bit more wiith my analogy . You are on a 6,8,or 10/12 roof when using Dbol and test at 600mgs week. So you better tie off ahead of time...:dunno: get it.........

Read up OP
 
He'll be another one of those guys telling everyone at the gym how he can get the best gear because he put on 20 lbs of muscle in two weeks.

Then pisses out his 20 lbs of muscle at the end of his cycle lol.

You definitely want an ai with dbol and test. Even with just test you should be using an ai.
 
oldmusclemike said:
Anon you are looking so good in your Avi picture. Doesn't look like you used an AI either... :elephant:
Click to expand...

Well I'm in the middle of my bulk.

D-bol/ anadrol only cycle. Why would I need an ai while using those 2 compounds.

Lololololololol

I had to put that pic op for my avi.
 
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