If you start taking steroids way before your natural limit you will NOT lose gains!

[halfwit]

Before anyone bashes me for 1 post count I come from another forum that is honest compared to this one. I have read so many damn times the same old questions and this forum and people straight up lie. (I have 14 consecutive years of steroid use under my belt.

If you take steroids after 3 months of working out with a KNOWLEDGEABLE FRIEND who is guiding you on diet and form and cycle use/pct then you are literally just going to be skipping 2-3 years of training for a few months of hard ass work while on gear. And once you reach or get close to your genetic potential and want to come off of gear for good you will f*cking keep the gains!

Yes you have an increased risk of injury obviously you are stupid if you think differently. If you are under 22-23 years of age DO NOT TOUCH THE SH*T! I repeat do not touch steroids at a young age this is stupid as hell.

People need to stop lying and saying you need to reach your genetic potential before using gear. This is complete BS if you are already knowledgeable or have a friend that is willing to guide you... if not DON'T TOUCH GEAR.

Remember that you have an increased risk of injury because of gaining strength at such a quick rate.

But if you're taking gear after 3 months of working out and decide to put on slabs of muscle and strength that first cycle then decide to come off and do PROPER PCT you're muscles are not just going to fu*king vanish and you can continue to grow naturally after!!(granted you are not over your genetic potential and off of one cycle you won't be)

(I CAN NOT STRESS ENOUGH HOW IMPORTANT PROPER PCT IS!) Don't f*ck up your body!

People on forums need to stop lying and being butthurt because we decided to train for years before taking steroids.

ONCE AGAIN DO NOT TOUCH THE STUFF UNLESS YOU HAVE COMPLETE KNOWLEDGE OF DIET TRAINING AND CYCLE USE OR HAVE A KNOWLEDGEABLE FRIEND THAT HAS A LOT OF TIME TO HELP YOU.

HAVE A GOOD DAY! It's 2015

You're absolutely correct.


If I was a lazy fuck twat and cycled thinking I could skip ahead, and put on one pound of lean mass over 12 weeks, I would likely keep that one pound of lean mass. This is assuming of course that my natural hormones and diet are capable of keeping said mass.

Not the best way to start off though. There's easily a dozen reasons why (many of them mentioned above) it's just smarter to be as close as possible to one's genetic limits before starting though.

Just an FYI too: if you're trying to impress everyone with how smart you are, I'd rethink some tact when it comes to your posts.

 

[.Vision.]

You're absolutely correct.


If I was a lazy fuck twat and cycled thinking I could skip ahead, and put on one pound of lean mass over 12 weeks, I would likely keep that one pound of lean mass. This is assuming of course that my natural hormones and diet are capable of keeping said mass.

Not the best way to start off though. There's easily a dozen reasons why (many of them mentioned above) it's just smarter to be as close as possible to one's genetic limits before starting though.

Just an FYI too: if you're trying to impress everyone with how smart you are, I'd rethink some tact when it comes to your posts.

I don't think he was trying to impress any on bro, I think he was trying to express what he believes, but it could be slightly misleading to anyone just getting into the game or even considering..

 

[.Vision.]

To be quite honest, the thing that would worry me more than anything would be my ability to recover.

You mention reaching 'genetic limit' - how will you ever find out what your 'genetic limit' is if you introduce synthetic compounds at supraphysiological dosages early on?

I trained clean until the age of 35. I'd say I reached my peak around 33, both strength and size wise.... at that point I had to make a decision.
Do I continue to train balls to the wall naturally, and see people on gear who eat slack diets and don't train with half the intensity I did, surpass me?

In the end I knew I had to get involved... I'd only be treading water and possibly going backwards with age.

When I look back, I'm proud that I did what I did, staying clean so long. I learned my craft, I mastered techniques and training methods over nearly 20yrs and in all honesty, I looked a damn sight better than all the 'seasonal puffer fish' that got big in the summer and then went into hiding every winter.

When I did start taking modest cycles - I exploded - it was the kick my body needed, and hiding the fact I had taken some 'help' was NOT easy. I attributed it to a better diet and new training methods, when in all honesty, they had been perfect for ages.

The downside to starting late at 35 was this. My T levels were already on a slippery slope, I must have been low in the range.
After a couple of cycles my ability to recover just wasn't there, queue a horrific 18 months of feeling like hell on earth, low libido, a nearly failed marriage due to the inability to please my wife. Joint pain, lethargy, daydreaming and brain fog - I was shot to pieces and rued the day I'd started taking gear.

Finally I found an endo that could help me, but even that took over a year to settle on a protocol that I could function like a normal male on.
I can't thank some of the vets on this site enough for helping me through those hideously low days. I'm forever indebted.

So when you come on here, calling the shots with one single post, shouting the odds and labeling everyone liars.
Maybe you should show some respect and realize that everyone of us is on a journey - some a lot LOT further along theirs than you are - and hence a LOT wiser!

These guys on here have people's health and safety as a priority, and help more people than you have probably met.

So in reference to your bold claims.... Yes, of course AAS will help you get big quick - that is a no-brainer!

But ask yourself this.... at what cost?

My 02cents...

BigBen

Excellent Post!

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

Its laughable because he comes from an honest forum. He clearly hasnt spent time here. His main point is to focus on diet and Post Cycle therapy. Im the one who made pct medsreadily avalible to the everyone 15 years ago. At that time it was harder to get clomid that testosterone.

We dont believe in Pct or diet here do we. What a joke.

 

[luckypaul]

You are not being bashed for 1 post count, you are being bashed because you are a fucking moron. Don't let the door hit you in the ass.

 

[Teutonic]

No you're probably one of those exact idiots I was talking about. You're full of sh*t and you KNOW this is the truth.

Do this again . I dare u ....

7 posts. Really...your gonna be a "in a vacuum" soon.

Your language skills and choice of words questionable; your knowledge of the point your trying to make is so limited it s obviously repeated bro - science.
This is a very knowledgeable crew and while some are harsh at times "they fkn earned it". U have not-----...savvy ?

Tread lightly type politely, you might just make 50 posts where u can pitch a bitch in private.

 

[Gainknowledge]

Once again none of you are taking in the information I posted. IF YOU TAKE 1-2 CYCLES TO GAIN 20-30 POUNDS OF MUSCLE AND COME OFF OF STEROIDS WITH PROPER PCT AND YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING YOU WILL KEEP THE GAINS AND CAN CONTINUE TO TRAIN NATURALLY if you are still not at your genetic limit you will keep a solid portion of those gains and will continue to gain off cycle!

THIS IS ALL I'M SAYING. And you all KNOW this is true.. Taking 1-2 cycles and never using gear after that your gains will not just vanish because you started early!!

 

[tx045]

Once again none of you are taking in the information I posted. IF YOU TAKE 1-2 CYCLES TO GAIN 20-30 POUNDS OF MUSCLE AND COME OFF OF STEROIDS WITH PROPER PCT AND YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING YOU WILL KEEP THE GAINS AND CAN CONTINUE TO TRAIN NATURALLY if you are still not at your genetic limit you will keep a solid portion of those gains and will continue to gain off cycle!

THIS IS ALL I'M SAYING. And you all KNOW this is true.. Taking 1-2 cycles and never using gear after that your gains will not just vanish because you started early!!

Thanks for all the solid info bro

 

[505jules]

Once again none of you are taking in the information I posted. IF YOU TAKE 1-2 CYCLES TO GAIN 20-30 POUNDS OF MUSCLE AND COME OFF OF STEROIDS WITH PROPER PCT AND YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING YOU WILL KEEP THE GAINS AND CAN CONTINUE TO TRAIN NATURALLY if you are still not at your genetic limit you will keep a solid portion of those gains and will continue to gain off cycle!

THIS IS ALL I'M SAYING. And you all KNOW this is true.. Taking 1-2 cycles and never using gear after that your gains will not just vanish because you started early!!

How will this benefit anyone in any way? First of all the odds of you having "complete knowledge of training and dieting" after three months of lifting is non existent, so then plan b rely on your friend full of bro science? Either way you are promoting the idea that people shouldn't push as far as they can naturally because you could cycle early and keep some gains? (I didnt reach my genetic potential before cycling and I wish I would've waited because I would be even better equipped to cycle now.) Why not educate ones self and reach as far as you can before cycling and then use gear to push you to that next level. Thanks for knowledge broseph. I BANISH YOU TO THE BRIDGE FROM WHENCE YOU CAME TROLL, BE GONE!!!

 

[Per]

I think wait until genetic potential is BS. You will do tons of steroids cycle and you think you should wait? If u dont start too early, with 2 cycle you will have probably the body you will never done without steroids.

If you think your health too much, dont use steroids! But you cycled 20 times and you worried for 2 cycles ? lol

 

[.Vision.]

Once again none of you are taking in the information I posted. IF YOU TAKE 1-2 CYCLES TO GAIN 20-30 POUNDS OF MUSCLE AND COME OFF OF STEROIDS WITH PROPER PCT AND YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING YOU WILL KEEP THE GAINS AND CAN CONTINUE TO TRAIN NATURALLY if you are still not at your genetic limit you will keep a solid portion of those gains and will continue to gain off cycle!

THIS IS ALL I'M SAYING. And you all KNOW this is true.. Taking 1-2 cycles and never using gear after that your gains will not just vanish because you started early!!

Before anyone of us even attpempt to touch this, let me ask you something..

What compounds.dosages, and cycle duration would you suggest for a 1-2 cycle with gaining 20-30lbs

thats a shit ton of weight to gain,Im sure they will be HUGE,jacked and ripped too!

and I thought gaining 6-8lbs of quality lean mass was a score.. (scratches head)

 

[.Vision.]

How will this benefit anyone in any way? First of all the odds of you having "complete knowledge of training and dieting" after three months of lifting is non existent, so then plan b rely on your friend full of bro science? Either way you are promoting the idea that people shouldn't push as far as they can naturally because you could cycle early and keep some gains? (I didnt reach my genetic potential before cycling and I wish I would've waited because I would be even better equipped to cycle now.) Why not educate ones self and reach as far as you can before cycling and then use gear to push you to that next level. Thanks for knowledge broseph. I BANISH YOU TO THE BRIDGE FROM WHENCE YOU CAME TROLL, BE GONE!!!

Why these people obsess about the volume of weight one can gain over quality beats me.. anyone of us VETs that know our body's and our macro's can gain a whopping 20lbs with little to no effort during a simple cruise,but why? 20 years ago when gains were all I knew, I had my cycles where I gained 20+lbs, and I looked like a complete train wreck.. 20-30 lbs in a cycle is a shit ton of weight,you can bet most will be dispositioned in all the wrong places!

 

[3J]

Its laughable because he comes from an honest forum. He clearly hasnt spent time here. His main point is to focus on diet and Post Cycle therapy. Im the one who made pct medsreadily avalible to the everyone 15 years ago. At that time it was harder to get clomid that testosterone.

We dont believe in Pct or diet here do we. What a joke.

yea.. its not like i personally haven't been drilling diet and proper cycle setup for almost 6 years on this forum now right?? lol...

and DPR speaks the truth.. he is the pioneer in this shit!!!!

 

[Teutonic]

At least he not s calling anyone names in his losing indefensible opinion.

OP quit while your only looking grossly mis and uninformed.
Any further beating of this drum will result in a shutdown....of the thread not anyone s HPTA. Noone in my 30 years of lifting were able to run 2 proper cycles...retain say 6-8 pounds pure muscle and never do another cycle w o returning to there normal non aas TRAINING...DIET..REST.
Age ?
Live w mommy ?
Buy ur own food and cook it ?

Trying to find something to LIKE about you.

 

[luckypaul]

At least he not s calling anyone names in his losing indefensible opinion.

OP quit while your only looking grossly mis and uninformed.
Any further beating of this drum will result in a shutdown....of the thread not anyone s HPTA. Noone in my 30 years of lifting were able to run 2 proper cycles...retain say 6-8 pounds pure muscle and never do another cycle w o returning to there normal non aas TRAINING...DIET..REST.
Age ?
Live w mommy ?
Buy ur own food and cook it ?

Trying to find something to LIKE about you.

Brother this guy is a fucking troll at best. Don't feed the troll

 

[3J]

Now you've done it.. Its rare to see T pissed at someone lol

 

[luckypaul]

Just for the hell of it, I would like to know one board that would claim this guy. My bet is we have no takers.

 

[Dickey]

I see where the op is coming from, and is it possible to do what he's saying? Probably. Is it gonna happen often? Not a prayer. Like other people have said you need your diet and training sorted, but lets say you're "knowledgable friend" does know his shit and can figure out how you're body works and how to get the best out of your body. In my opinion and experience watching friends and other people, 9 times out of 10 people are still going to lose all their gains. Why? Because for the length of the cycle, they are going to see good gains, then after they come off, the gains slow or stop or they realistically probably lose a little bit. 98% of people are going to see this, lose motivation and quit. I'll leave all the hormone/body chemistry answers to all the way more knowledgable guys than myself, but in my experience having an extremely solid base of training and diet builds the mental strength to overcome obstacles like injuries, plateaue etc. If someone doesn't have the motivation an discipline to get the gains in the first place, they most likely won't have the discipline to keep them after.

 

[luckypaul]

I see where the op is coming from, and is it possible to do what he's saying? Probably. Is it gonna happen often? Not a prayer. Like other people have said you need your diet and training sorted, but lets say you're "knowledgable friend" does know his shit and can figure out how you're body works and how to get the best out of your body. In my opinion and experience watching friends and other people, 9 times out of 10 people are still going to lose all their gains. Why? Because for the length of the cycle, they are going to see good gains, then after they come off, the gains slow or stop or they realistically probably lose a little bit. 98% of people are going to see this, lose motivation and quit. I'll leave all the hormone/body chemistry answers to all the way more knowledgable guys than myself, but in my experience having an extremely solid base of training and diet builds the mental strength to overcome obstacles like injuries, plateaue etc. If someone doesn't have the motivation an discipline to get the gains in the first place, they most likely won't have the discipline to keep them after.

In 25 years of use, I have never known one person to keep gains made using ped"s if they stop using them, not one.

 

[.Vision.]

In 25 years of use, I have never known one person to keep gains made using ped"s if they stop using them, not one.

I said this in an other post and it can apply here as well " This goes even without gear use (this you know, Im just putting it out there tho)..Any amount of acquired muscle through sports,training, work activities ext, would need nutrients, and load to sustain to a considerable degree.. At the end of the day, we still posses a genetic program/gene expression within ones internal network..Now versatility and adaptability once limits are stressed is a different story "muscle memory".. That's the beauty of this all! Don't you agree? "