Need advice: 24 years old, Low Test, Time to get these levels up

J

jakesonyou

New member
I’m 24, 5’7, 157lbs, 10% bf. It has always been extremely hard for me to put on any amount of muscle mass or strength as well as maintaining a low body fat percentage (even while being on the strictest of diets and living the lifestyle of a pro bodybuilder). I have never done any prohormones or anything like that. I always suspected I had low testosterone levels (low energy, lack of sex drive, inability to increase muscle and strength, body fat accumulation on hips, etc) but I hate doctors so I never went to get it checked out. A few weeks ago I “bit the bullet” and went to a GP and my suspicions were confirmed. These are my test results:
Estrone, Serum 51 pg/ml
Estradiol 6.9 pg/ml
Total Testosterone, Serum 282 ng/dl
Free Testosterone (Direct) 7.8 pg/ml
TSH 4.160 uIU/ml
LH 2.9 mIU/ml
FSH 3.0 mIU/ml

Test levels are downright embarrassing. I can’t imagine where my physique would be if I had even half way decent levels. GP referred me to an endocrinologist (male) and I have an the earliest I can get an appt. is mid Feb (possible early Jan with another endocrinologist, a female).
I’m looking for some thoughts and opinions as well as some advice on how to handle the visit with the endo (I don’t want to screw around with things that won’t work). My goal is to get TT levels up to atleast 800 (preferably ~950).
Thanks guys.
Jakesonyou
 
You didn't include reference ranges for the labs. Can you add them please?

Yes your TT is low for your age, but I would focus on your Thyroid right now. Your TSH indicates that you may have hypothyroidism. Hypothyroidism can lower your Total Testosterone and cause all those symptoms you listed. Start by getting a full thyroid panel and working with your Endo to figure out what is going on.
 
Megatron28 said:
You didn't include reference ranges for the labs. Can you add them please?

Yes your TT is low for your age, but I would focus on your Thyroid right now. Your TSH indicates that you may have hypothyroidism. Hypothyroidism can lower your Total Testosterone and cause all those symptoms you listed. Start by getting a full thyroid panel and working with your Endo to figure out what is going on.
Click to expand...

Ok, Interesting.
Sure:

Estrone, Serum 51 pg/ml (12-72)
Estradiol 6.9 pg/ml (7.6-42.6)
Total Testosterone, Serum 282 ng/dl (348 - 1197)
Free Testosterone (Direct) 7.8pg/ml (9.3-26.5)
TSH 4.160 uIU/ml (.450 - 4.50)
LH 2.9 mIU/ml (1.7-8.6)
FSH 3.0 mIU/ml (1.5-12.4)

APOLLON said:
Ever take any AAS ?
what's "low" for T levels at this lab you went to ?
Click to expand...

No, never.
 
Last edited:
Labs report the wrong numbers for TSH. Anything over 3.0 is generally considered an indicator of hypogonadism. Do some reading up on it and go see a doctor about it. Hopefully that clears up your hypogonadism -- looks like you are Secondary. If not, TRT may be in your future or you could try doing a restart. At your age, I would try the restart if addressing your thyroid doesn't do the trick.
 
Megatron28 said:
Labs report the wrong numbers for TSH. Anything over 3.0 is generally considered an indicator of hypogonadism. Do some reading up on it and go see a doctor about it. Hopefully that clears up your hypogonadism -- looks like you are Secondary. If not, TRT may be in your future or you could try doing a restart. At your age, I would try the restart if addressing your thyroid doesn't do the trick.
Click to expand...

Just to make sure I have everything straight (I greatly appreciate the help, by the way).

You think if I bring my TSH levels down, my test levels will increase? If so, how do you think the endo will approach this/accomplish this?

Or are you saying that the increase in my TSH levels are result of Secondary Hypogonadism (which I'm guessing can only be treated through TRT or a restart)?


Sorry, just want to make sure I have everything correct.
Thanks again,
Jakes
 
jakesonyou said:
Just to make sure I have everything straight (I greatly appreciate the help, by the way).

You think if I bring my TSH levels down, my test levels will increase? If so, how do you think the endo will approach this/accomplish this?

Or are you saying that the increase in my TSH levels are result of Secondary Hypogonadism (which I'm guessing can only be treated through TRT or a restart)?


Sorry, just want to make sure I have everything correct.
Thanks again,
Jakes
Click to expand...


Don't want to give you any false hope but it's worth checking out. Though your statement looks to be reversed - Secondary Hypogonadism might have resulted in the increased TSH levels.

Testicular dysfunction in men with primary hypothyroidism; reversal of hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism with replacement thyroxine.
Donnelly P, White C.
Author information
Abstract
OBJECTIVE:

Primary hypothyroidism can cause disturbances in normal gonadal function. The aim of this study was to investigate the relationship in men between hypogonadism and primary hypothyroidism and the extent to which free and total testosterone levels rose after introduction of replacement thyroxine.
DESIGN:

Paired study of patients in a hypothyroid and thyroxine treated state.
PATIENTS:

Ten men with primary hypothyroidism.
MEASUREMENTS:

Free and total testosterone, gonadotrophin and prolactin levels before and after thyroxine replacement therapy.
RESULTS:

Low free testosterone levels (161 +/- 62 pmol/l) demonstrated at the time the men were hypothyroid rose significantly with the commencement of thyroxine replacement (315 +/- 141 pmol/l; P < 0.001). Gonadotrophin levels were not elevated consistent with hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism. Hyperprolactinaemia, which can occur in primary hypothyroidism and cause hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism, was not present in the majority of these patients. However a reduction in prolactin level was evident with thyroxine replacement and a rise in free testosterone levels.
CONCLUSION:

This suggests an effect of hypothyroidism on gonadotrophin secretion at the level of the hypothalamus-pituitary, either directly or through modulation of prolactin secretion. Low free testosterone may also be a contributing factor to some of the symptoms and signs of hypothyroidism in men.



Having a TSH level that high suggests a failing thyroid and you may need medication (thyroxine). Here's some good info on TSH values that high:

Endocrinologists Say TSH Normal Range is Now 0.3 to 3 -- Normal Thyroid Blood Test Range - "Endocrinologists say TSH Normal Range is 0.3 - 3.0"

TSH Reference Range Wars -- PDF File - "TSH Reference Range Wars"
 
Thanks alot JOWS7 and Megatron28. I appreciate the time and help. I will give you guys an update as soon as I get seen by the endocrinologist (hopeful early Jan, if not mid Feb). In the mean time, is there any other literature I should read or anything else I should make myself aware of?
 
Megatron28 said:
Awesome post JOWS7!!!

I agree. I don't want to get your hopes too high either, but you need to check the low hanging fruit first to see if that helps cure your hypogonadism. If you can avoid TRT and stay Natty, that is much preferred.

Here is some more reading you can do on hypogonadism.

http://www.steroidology.com/forum/testosterone-replacement-therapy/662394-basic-trt-overview.html
Click to expand...

Good post. Of special interest and noteworthy of highlight is where you said: "After age 30, TT typically decreases 1% every year as you age. By the time one reaches about age 60, the average TT is somewhere around 450"
In previous posts, I remember you were a strong advocate in the past for 40 years of age being the peak Testosterone period for a man.
I haven't found much info pointing toward that.
 
APOLLON said:
Good post. Of special interest and noteworthy of highlight is where you said: "After age 30, TT typically decreases 1% every year as you age. By the time one reaches about age 60, the average TT is somewhere around 450"
In previous posts, I remember you were a strong advocate in the past for 40 years of age being the peak Testosterone period for a man.
I haven't found much info pointing toward that.
Click to expand...

Go back to the old thread to revisit that discussion. I also posted a chart that you can look at. There are differing thoughts out there.
 
Just back back from the visit and wow, what a disappointing experience. Doc pretty much thinks I have low test because of past steriod use.
Sigh.
Me : "I've never used steriods"
Him: "Are you sure?"
He's sending me for an MRI of the brain to check for any tumors on the pituitary and also having me do additional blood work.
I mentioned the concern of the TSH levels but all he responded was that he was going to check them again.
He said in the situation that I would need TRT I would be given a gel. He said he very rarely does injections and when he does them, they are every 2 weeks. I brought up the half-life of testosterone, the ineffectiveness of the gel, and he responded that these concerns are incorrect and anyone who believes them are "doing that stuff on their own."
I'm suppose to see him in a month after I get all the tests done.
I'm going to get all the tests done but I'm going to start calling pharmaceutics to see which doctors are prescribing the injectable testosterone in case I need to go that route.
Feel like the wind has all but left my sails.
 
Can't remember. Have you talked to IMT yet? They would take good care of you and get you on a good protocol if necessary.
 
That's true. I thought I read before about calling around pharmacies see which docs are prescribing Inj. Test. Is this a good route to go at all?
 
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