Nolvadex vs Aridimex while on DBOL kickstart

[xtremegain]

Hey guy I'm the the process for researching for my first cycle. My proposed cycle is going to be:
Week 1-4: DBOL 40mg ED
Week 1-12: 500mg/week
Week 13-14: No AAS
Week 15-18: PCT

PCT) Clomid: 100/50/50/0
Nolva: 20/20/20/20

MY CONCERN: First of all, I have a bit of pubertal gyno. I read on a bunch of different discussion forums, that adding an AI(adex) while on dbol is useless since most of dbol's gains comes from its ability to convert to estrogen.
My original plan was to run Adex 0.5 EOD throughout entire cycle but my new protocol after reading on Dbol and AI's uncompatibilty is:
Week 1-4: 20mg Nolva (with the dbol kickstart to combat gyno)
Week 5-14: 0.5 Adex EOD.

Please give me your insight on my new protocol, and also regarding my PCT dosages.
Thanks!

**Edit: Please see post 12 for my new proposed protocol

 

[Mayomialoccah]

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[Joseph Goebbels]

Hey guy I'm the the process for researching for my first cycle. My proposed cycle is going to be:
Week 1-4: DBOL 40mg ED
Week 1-12: 500mg/week
Week 13-14: No AAS
Week 15-18: post cycle therapy (pct)

post cycle therapy (pct)) Clomid: 100/50/50/0
Nolva: 20/20/20/20

MY CONCERN: First of all, I have a bit of pubertal gyno. I read on a bunch of different discussion forums, that adding an AI(adex) while on dbol is useless since most of dbol's gains comes from its ability to convert to estrogen.
My original plan was to run Adex 0.5 EOD throughout entire cycle but my new protocol after reading on Dbol and AI's uncompatibilty is:
Week 1-4: 20mg Nolva (with the dbol kickstart to combat gyno)
Week 5-14: 0.5 Adex EOD.

Please give me your insight on my new protocol, and also regarding my post cycle therapy (pct) dosages.
Thanks!

Whether you have pubertal gyno or not, i would recommend that you use a quality Aromatase inhibitor (AI) on cycle to prevent unnecessarily high E2 levels that can play havoc on your endocrine system, which can lead to a host of other issues including water retention, BP, acne, ED..ect

And whoever told you that Adex was useless in managing your E2 while using Dbol has no idea what they're talking about. Yes its true that Dbol promotes water retention and typically high BP. But to suggest that a quality Aromatase inhibitor (AI) will have no effect on managing your E2 is ridiculous. An Aromatase inhibitor (AI) should be included on every cycle that includes any type of AAS that aromatizes, unless you have experience or bloodwork that suggests different.

post cycle therapy (pct) should be Clomid 100/50/50/50. Nolva 40/20/20/20 for a basic beginners cycle.

And dont forget hCG for a smoother transition to post cycle therapy (pct). Its not mandatory, but you will definitely notice a positive difference if you include it on cycle to prevent testicular atrophy.

 

[DexterMorgan]

Bump nolva up to 40/40/20/20. and run Clomid for 4 weeks with nolva, not 3.
I'm like you with mild gyno from puberty. Taking Aromasin and Nolva with my cycle. If you can, get aromasin instead of Adex to be sure estrogen rebound won't occur.

Drop Dbol since its your 1st cycle, 1st cycle should be test only cycle. You don't know how your body will react to steroids, so introduce one compound at the time. I personally wouldn't even touch Dbol if you already have gyno, it aromatizes like a mofo.

 

[halfwit]

Hey guy I'm the the process for researching for my first cycle. My proposed cycle is going to be:
Week 1-4: DBOL 40mg ED
Week 1-12: 500mg/week
Week 13-14: No AAS
Week 15-18: post cycle therapy (pct)

post cycle therapy (pct)) Clomid: 100/50/50/0
Nolva: 20/20/20/20

MY CONCERN: First of all, I have a bit of pubertal gyno. I read on a bunch of different discussion forums, that adding an AI(adex) while on dbol is useless since most of dbol's gains comes from its ability to convert to estrogen.
My original plan was to run Adex 0.5 EOD throughout entire cycle but my new protocol after reading on Dbol and AI's uncompatibilty is:
Week 1-4: 20mg Nolva (with the dbol kickstart to combat gyno)
Week 5-14: 0.5 Adex EOD.

Please give me your insight on my new protocol, and also regarding my post cycle therapy (pct) dosages.
Thanks!

Well...if you want strong boobies maybe? (Referring to the red part) Nolvadex being a SERM prevents estrogen from binding to your breast tissue while an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) (adex in this case) prevents more estrogen from being made in the first place. I really wish I knew where some of these ideas come from as it's the anabolic properties of dianabol that increase strength/mass, not the fact that it drives your aromatase into a feeding frenzy.

The other guys have you pretty well taken care of, but keep in mind that mixing nolvadex and arimidex is bad juju as they have a drug interaction, reducing the ability of the Aromatase inhibitor (AI) to work properly. If you insist on using both a SERM and an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) at the same time, I'd opt for aromasin as mentioned above as it does not interact with nolva, then if you want to switch to adex - you can.

 

[DreDay187]

Yes part of dbol's muscle building ability is due to its affinity to aromatize into estrogen but that does not mean controlling your estrogen will hinder results, especially if you already suffer from pubertal gynecomastia. Nolva will bind to the estrogen receptors in tissue, especially breast tissue, and prevent estrogen from binding there, which in turn will prevent gyno. Unfortunately this does little to help manage the high levels of estrogen in your blood which can wreak havoc in numerous other ways. By using only tamoxifen during cycle you are treating the symptom not alleviating what's causing it. During cycle (if you plan on using dbol, use an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) like Arimidex or aromasin. Start at a very mild dose and keep an eye out for estrogenic side effects. If they present themselves you can up the dosage of your Aromatase inhibitor (AI) then and if gyno starts to flare up, add tamoxifen at that point. Since gyno is a problem for you I would go with aromasin since if you need tamoxifen on cycle it would interact with Arimidex lowering the efficacy of the Aromatase inhibitor (AI). No such problem exists with tamoxifen and aromasin. Amd again, the ability to aromatize is a factor in how dbol works and builds muscle, but to say adding an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) will render dbol useless is someone's imagination at work.

 

[DreDay187]

Well...if you want strong boobies maybe? (Referring to the red part) Nolvadex being a SERM prevents estrogen from binding to your breast tissue while an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) (adex in this case) prevents more estrogen from being made in the first place. I really wish I knew where some of these ideas come from as it's the anabolic properties of dianabol that increase strength/mass, not the fact that it drives your aromatase into a feeding frenzy.

The other guys have you pretty well taken care of, but keep in mind that mixing nolvadex and arimidex is bad juju as they have a drug interaction, reducing the ability of the Aromatase inhibitor (AI) to work properly. If you insist on using both a SERM and an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) at the same time, I'd opt for aromasin as mentioned above as it does not interact with nolva, then if you want to switch to adex - you can.

If you beat me one more time Halfwit, one more time, I'm going to fly out to your neck of the woods and personally drink all your test and tren. Yes drink it right in front of you while playing pin the tail on the donkey with your pins!!!!

 

[Nosy Parker]

Personally I feel that if you are going to use dbol you mind as well see how it effects you (say for a week) and then adjust your oestrogen levels accordingly with arimidex. Again, personal opinion, but gains from Dbol and other heavily oestrogen aromatizing drugs are usually reduced when a oestrogen inhibitor is introduced. Also I would be cautious with taking .5 of arim for the remainder of your cycle. In general I have seen .25 per 500mg of test as a starting dose, then adjusted from there. Just keep in mind that suppressing oestrogen too much will cause lethargy and depressed mood, if you feel these sides (which you shouldn't while on) just drop your arim dose until you're feeling good.

PS: I realize this is my very first post. I literally just signed up about five minutes ago. It will be great to get to know all of you, best luck in your ventures!

Parker.

 

[tkasch30]

dbol armatizes like crazy so i would have a good Aromatase inhibitor (AI) to use from start to finish and letro just incase. i keep every Aromatase inhibitor (AI) on hand because me and estrogen dont get along, which is why im not a big fan of dbol

 

[halfwit]

If you beat me one more time Halfwit, one more time, I'm going to fly out to your neck of the woods and personally drink all your test and tren. Yes drink it right in front of you while playing pin the tail on the donkey with your pins!!!!

Hahaha, I might just have to take you up on this as I'd love to see your face after DRINKING tren LOL! I've put a little on my finger and tasted it just to see if the bro-tale of being able to "taste" if gear is bunk had any merit. I can't say I'd recommend it haha.

Personally I feel that if you are going to use dbol you mind as well see how it effects you (say for a week) and then adjust your oestrogen levels accordingly with arimidex. Again, personal opinion, but gains from Dbol and other heavily oestrogen aromatizing drugs are usually reduced when a oestrogen inhibitor is introduced. Also I would be cautious with taking .5 of arim for the remainder of your cycle. In general I have seen .25 per 500mg of test as a starting dose, then adjusted from there. Just keep in mind that suppressing oestrogen too much will cause lethargy and depressed mood, if you feel these sides (which you shouldn't while on) just drop your arim dose until you're feeling good.

PS: I realize this is my very first post. I literally just signed up about five minutes ago. It will be great to get to know all of you, best luck in your ventures!

Parker.

Welcome to 'ology man. You're totally correct in being cautious with estrogen management. I know what neck of the woods you come from based on your spelling of the notorious "female" hormone!

 

[DreDay187]

Personally I feel that if you are going to use dbol you mind as well see how it effects you (say for a week) and then adjust your oestrogen levels accordingly with arimidex. Again, personal opinion, but gains from Dbol and other heavily oestrogen aromatizing drugs are usually reduced when a oestrogen inhibitor is introduced. Also I would be cautious with taking .5 of arim for the remainder of your cycle. In general I have seen .25 per 500mg of test as a starting dose, then adjusted from there. Just keep in mind that suppressing oestrogen too much will cause lethargy and depressed mood, if you feel these sides (which you shouldn't while on) just drop your arim dose until you're feeling good.

PS: I realize this is my very first post. I literally just signed up about five minutes ago. It will be great to get to know all of you, best luck in your ventures!

Parker.

Introducing an aromatase inhibitor and severely limiting estrogen are 2 separate things, especially for someone who already suffered from gyno. The likelihood of dbol aromatizing heavily and affecting the gyno (making it worse) is much higher than the limitation of gains by introducing an Aromatase inhibitor (AI). Also gyno is easier to treat the earlier its caught and treating the source is better then preventing the side effect. He could start at .25mg/EOD and adjust from there but its a much safer route doing that than waiting for gyno symptoms to show and treating after the fact.

For this reason and from what Halfwit told you OP, you might be better off with aromasin instead of Adex.

 

[xtremegain]

Thanks to all of you!
So I'm definitely adding an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) while on the DBOL kickstart, but my concern is that I cannot get hold of aromasin atm, and don't want to delay my cycle.
I would need your help on how to dose my ADEX and NOLVA while on the DBOL kickstart.
My proposed plan is:
Week 1-4: 0.5mg ADEX (EOD) **need help to dose this(can increase if necessary due to a hindered effect by nolva**
**Have 25 tabs of 20mg nolva to work with for DBOL kickstart, so I can either do:
a) 10/20/20/20 Nolva ED
OR
b) 20/20/20/10 Nolva ED - I'm more leaning to this method as I read that you need to taper off nolva.


PCT would now be suggested as above,
Clomid: 100/50/50/50
Nolva: 40/20/20/20

Please give me your input on my new plan, Thanks!

 

[SolomonGrundy]

AI over SERM or both if you're truly paranoid

 

[DexterMorgan]

Thanks to all of you!
So I'm definitely adding an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) while on the DBOL kickstart, but my concern is that I cannot get hold of aromasin atm, and don't want to delay my cycle.
I would need your help on how to dose my ADEX and NOLVA while on the DBOL kickstart.
My proposed plan is:
Week 1-4: 0.5mg ADEX (EOD) **need help to dose this(can increase if necessary due to a hindered effect by nolva**
**Have 25 tabs of 20mg nolva to work with for DBOL kickstart, so I can either do:
a) 10/20/20/20 Nolva ED
OR
b) 20/20/20/10 Nolva ED - I'm more leaning to this method as I read that you need to taper off nolva.


PCT would now be suggested as above,
Clomid: 100/50/50/50
Nolva: 40/20/20/20

Please give me your input on my new plan, Thanks!

You can get Aromasin, Nolva and other SERMs from RUI (click red lion banner at the top of the page)
They are legit, domestic, and ship fast. I ordered twice and both orders took only 3 days.

You can start adex with .25 eod and then increase if needed the second week to .5 eod. You need to be careful, dont get your estrogen too low, you'll feel miserable.

It was recommend to me by a knowledgeable member here to take Nolva 10mgs ed. I got enough to take 20, so I'm taking 20mgs ed. Still I think you should use that Dbol on the next cycle, and go with test only. Who knows your test could be bunk, so you'll be taking dbol only, which will shut you down. You dont want to get shut down by oral only.

 

[DreDay187]

AI over SERM or both if you're truly paranoid

^^^ This, if you control estrogen from the beginning, chances are you won't need a SERM like nolva and gyno could be avoided. If paranoid, like Solomon said, do both but remember there's an interaction with nolva and adex. It will make adex less effective. AI's shouldn't be a problem (red lion on top of this forum has them).

 

[DreDay187]

You can get Aromasin, Nolva and other SERMs from RUI (click red lion banner at the top of the page)
They are legit, domestic, and ship fast. I ordered twice and both orders took only 3 days.

You can start adex with .25 eod and then increase if needed the second week to .5 eod. You need to be careful, dont get your estrogen too low, you'll feel miserable.

It was recommend to me by a knowledgeable member here to take Nolva 10mgs ed. I got enough to take 20, so I'm taking 20mgs ed. Still I think you should use that Dbol on the next cycle, and go with test only. Who knows your test could be bunk, so you'll be taking dbol only, which will shut you down. You dont want to get shut down by oral only.

Just remember the two interact. Aromasin would be a better bet with nolva or you might have to increase the dosage of adex to get the same effect of a smaller dosage.

 

[DexterMorgan]

^ Forgot about drug interaction.
OP, if you get some Aromasin from RUI you can take 6.5mgs eod the 1st week and then increase it to 12.5 or 15mgs ed.
If you already got lump, combo of Nolva and Aromasin is a good idea. I also heard that few people get gyno with low estrogen. So you can't go wrong with taking both on cycle just to be safe.

 

[xtremegain]

Thanks a lot to all you guys again!