overtraining???????
- Thread starter pboy2201
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Insane_Man
Guest
It sounds a lot like overtraining. But it really depends on volume. How many sets are you doing?
gymphreak said:
saturday legs or off? have you lost your mind. you have to do legs. thats still too much for putting on size. unless you are one of the small % of folks who can sustain high volume. i'll post this one more time:
Here’s a generic routine that is a good starting point. This is a mass building routine. Probably less volume than you are used too but very effective. Three days per week because that’s all most folks can handle if they are training heavy. They key is forced/assisted reps. Painful but very effective if you really want to put on size. This does not include warm ups so that is up to you to make sure you are stretched and plenty warm before performing work sets. A work set is defined as a set that you just barely get all reps or need assistance on one or two reps. If you get all the reps fairly easily then it is a warm up and not a work set. Add abs and cardio on the days off to fit your needs. Limit cardio to 3 times week for 30 – 45 minutes of low impact as intense cardio burns muscle.
Monday:
Squats 2 x 5
Box squats 2 x 4
Leg presses 2 x 5
Calves (your choice of exercise) 2 x 10
Tuesday:
Wide grip flat bench 2 x 6
Decline medium grip bench 2 x 6
Weighted dips 2 x 10
Upright rows 2 x 5
Thursday:
Dead lifts (rotate variations each week) 2 x 5
Bent over rows 2 x 4
Reverse grip narrow grip pull downs 2 x 6
Standing wide grip curls 2 x 6
Every one of these movements is a mass building exercise. These are the essential movements for putting on size. Rest and nutrition are just as important as lifting, neglect any one of the three and you will not grow. Juice or no juice all will grow with this routine or a similar one. Consistency is the key. Adding 5 lbs to the bar every other week equals 130lbs/year. Not bad considering many are moving the same weight year in year out. Strength gains are the key to growth, not other way around.
I hope this helpful to all who read it. I have designed many programs for a variety of athletes with varying needs. If you have special needs such as martial arts, football or gymnastics (to name a few) the program can be altered to accommodate these needs.
I
Insane_Man
Guest
Vennom96 said:
You're doing too much.
Work smarter not harder my friend. I've struggled with overtraining min the past myself. You always want to do more to see more results, it's a mental thing. I doubt myself all the time, but looking back at all the diff routines I have used, I always gain more with lower volume. Always. In my opinion, it's better to undertrain than to overtrain, because at least that way you'll get some results out of your workout as opposed to none.
Listen to Pullin, he knows his shit.
Vennom96
New member
See thats whats wrong w/ our bodies....seems the harder you work and the more work you put out, the worse off you're doing yourself. I know, moderation is the key. But to me I think that if you put forth all the extra hard work and time and duration then you should be *rewarded* by your muscles getting bigger and stronger. Unfortunately our bodies don't work this way 
Vennom96 said:
i am 6' 300lbs how much you weigh? lololololol too much volume and you not gonna grow. if you do the forced reps like i outlined clearly you will be spent when you leave the gym. I know those flex mags have led many people astray and it takes a while to reprogram folks but i promise if you do this routine you will get stronger and that is the key to growth. core movements are essential.
hell what you got to loose? your way isnt making you happy so try some thing else for 12 weeks and see what happens. 1 set of heavy squats and deads will work the entire body better than 50 sets of iso movements. works every time. i started off doing a lot of volume and made some initial gains but they slowed quickly. over the years i have continually cut volume and have gotten stronger/bigger each time.
Vennom96
New member
pullinbig said:
I'm 235. I wasn't bashing your routine, I just said it doesn't SEEM like it would be enough b/c I'm used to doing 12 sets for most muscles. Doing 12 sets is clearly a lot of work so it's not like I'm afraid of hard work. I bust my ass on every set. And like I said, I do do deads and bench and heavy core movements, I just do a lot of iso work too. I'm gonna try and drop a few sets and see if that gets me anywhere.
josh81
Jiu-Jitsu Blue
Ahh...Some people never learn
Vennom, I used to have the same issue as you've got now. Then I switched to a routine pullinbig made for me, and have made great gains since then. These high set routines that you are on are not nearly as effective as the routine pullinbig is offering to you. Take it from me, my old routine was no different than the one you are currently on. High sets, many iso exercises. Give this one a try, I assure you that you will not regret it. A low volume, high intensity program will add size and strength like no other you've ever tried!
Give this a shot. Many of the site would agree. You'll never want to go back.
Vennom, I used to have the same issue as you've got now. Then I switched to a routine pullinbig made for me, and have made great gains since then. These high set routines that you are on are not nearly as effective as the routine pullinbig is offering to you. Take it from me, my old routine was no different than the one you are currently on. High sets, many iso exercises. Give this one a try, I assure you that you will not regret it. A low volume, high intensity program will add size and strength like no other you've ever tried!
Give this a shot. Many of the site would agree. You'll never want to go back.
Cakalac
Informed Member
Just my .02!
I have always said that most people overtrain and that is why they give up on training quick. They don't make gains and they simply give up! I by no means have near the knowledge as some of you on here and i don't claim to know as much as most. I always just listen to my body if I feel like I am overtraining. I don't believe you build your physique in the gym. I believe you build it at home by what you put in your mouth. Before I get any smartass remarks I am just saying that I think your diet is more important than figureing out if you should do 6 reps or 10. Know, if I wake up and I feel really lethargic, I sometimes skip that day. Again, you have to seperate a long days work and muscle tiredness. I don't necessarily say 3 days on and 1 off, I may go 2 on and 2 off or 4 on and 1 off. I listen to my body!! If you are losing your appetite and aren't resting well at night and are not making gains, you could be overtraining. I think people get too caught up in how many days they made it to the gym and how many sets or reps they did and completely forget about recuperation of the body. I by no means am saying you should not dedicate yourself to the gym so many days a week. You do have to get in there but if you are not enjoying the gym and it is seeming like a chore to go, just chill out eat all you can take a couple days and regroup and go get'em again. I may be wrong but I have been training like this for 2 yrs now after I convinced myself I was overtraining. I have made great gains and look forward to getting up @ 6:00am and going to the gym to start my day!
I have always said that most people overtrain and that is why they give up on training quick. They don't make gains and they simply give up! I by no means have near the knowledge as some of you on here and i don't claim to know as much as most. I always just listen to my body if I feel like I am overtraining. I don't believe you build your physique in the gym. I believe you build it at home by what you put in your mouth. Before I get any smartass remarks I am just saying that I think your diet is more important than figureing out if you should do 6 reps or 10. Know, if I wake up and I feel really lethargic, I sometimes skip that day. Again, you have to seperate a long days work and muscle tiredness. I don't necessarily say 3 days on and 1 off, I may go 2 on and 2 off or 4 on and 1 off. I listen to my body!! If you are losing your appetite and aren't resting well at night and are not making gains, you could be overtraining. I think people get too caught up in how many days they made it to the gym and how many sets or reps they did and completely forget about recuperation of the body. I by no means am saying you should not dedicate yourself to the gym so many days a week. You do have to get in there but if you are not enjoying the gym and it is seeming like a chore to go, just chill out eat all you can take a couple days and regroup and go get'em again. I may be wrong but I have been training like this for 2 yrs now after I convinced myself I was overtraining. I have made great gains and look forward to getting up @ 6:00am and going to the gym to start my day!
Vennom96 said:
i didnt take it as bashing. i hear it all the time from my new trainees. I start them out a two day/week routine for the first month or two. then if they are holdin up we'll try three. they have all made great gains. its not uincommon for me take on someone who has never been to a gym in thier life and watch them dbl weight moved two or three times in the first month. I too used to feel just as you did. i have learned over the years that only a small % of folks can maintain high volume work. when i run across one i will load him/her up and they flourish but as i said this is a very small%. try it and se what happens. do the routine i posted, as posted, for 12 week sand i promise if you have the big three in place (lifting, nutrition, rest) you will be very happy with results. leave one of the big three out and you will not grow no matter what routine you are doing.
damn i feel like a car salesman. lololololol
Last edited:
Vennom96
New member
pullinbig said:
Thats cool. I might try it, or at least not by doing so many sets on iso stuff. But the thing is I'm not a newbie to lifting. I've been lifting for 10 years. Since I was 13, I'm 23 now. The first few years was just piddling around in my bedroom w/ the little "my first home gym" type deals. But I've been lifting seriously for 7 years and the past 3 w/ nutrition and diet and serious lifting. I've gained 35 lbs in the past 15 months all naturally. Some of that is fat but I can still see my abs so a good portion of it is muscle. I just feel like I'm small as hell. My arms unflexed down by my side are 15.5" and for lifting that long, I just feel like I should be a lot bigger. Heres my workout, tell me what you think:
Monday - Back: Lat PD or pullups: 4 sets 7-10 reps
: Bent over rows or Seated rows: 3-4 sets 7-10 reps
: Deadlifts 3 sets 10 reps each
: chainsaws or other rowing exer: 3 sets of 8-10 reps
Traps: 3 sets barbell shrugs to front
: 3 sets barbell to rear or db or seated machine
Tuesday - Shoulders: Seated DB press 3-4 sets 6-10 reps
: front raises and side raises 3 sets each, about 8-10 reps. then a rear delt exercise. sometimes I'll do 3 sets of barbell presses too.
Calves: 5-6 sets of 10 or so reps
Wed: off
Thurs: Upper legs: leg press 5 sets, sometimes squats for 3 sets instead. Then leg ext and leg curl 3 sets each.
Bi's: barbell curl 4 sets of 6-10 reps
seated curl 4 sets of 6-10 reps
hammer curl 4 sets of 6-10 reps
Fri: Chest: Bench 3-4 sets 6-10 reps
Incline DB or barbell 3-4 sets 6-10 reps
(rotate which one I start with)
incline flyes or pec machine 3-4 sets (6-10 reps)
Tri: DB ext behind head 4 sets 8-10 reps
Tri pushdown 3-4 sets 8-10 reps
skull crushers 3-4 sets 8-10 reps
dips or rope or cable pushdowns 3-4 sets 8-10 reps
Thats it. Thats a lot of shit. Usually first set on stuff I get 10 reps then I add 5-10 lbs then reps usually drop to 7-8 then usually add 5 or 10
lbs more and get as many reps as I can. I usually do 12 sets for everything except back I usually do 16 b/c its your entire backside.
if you not happy withyou results why continue it? when i say take on new trainees that includes seasoned lifters as well. I have trained guys/gals that been working out for years and are stuck and dont know why. within 2 or 3 week swe have already broken thru barriers that seemed to big to tackle.
you said a mouthj full about your routine when you said "that is a lot of shit." too much iso training and not enough core training. thats why you got small arms. I dont do any direct arm work and got 19" guns relaxed. why you say cause i squat, bench, pull deads and do heavy back work. i dont do direct shoulder work either. dont need it on my routines. i may have you throw in some side lateral sor upright rows on chest day but thats it. I can assure that i got big delts too.
when you get tired of struggling with your routine and want a change we'll be here. best of luck to you.
you said a mouthj full about your routine when you said "that is a lot of shit." too much iso training and not enough core training. thats why you got small arms. I dont do any direct arm work and got 19" guns relaxed. why you say cause i squat, bench, pull deads and do heavy back work. i dont do direct shoulder work either. dont need it on my routines. i may have you throw in some side lateral sor upright rows on chest day but thats it. I can assure that i got big delts too.
when you get tired of struggling with your routine and want a change we'll be here. best of luck to you.
