Second cycle advice - Test E/Deca

[Rayquaza]

I am planning my second cycle and would like some advice on what I’m considering. My first cycle consisted of 12 weeks of test cyp (500mg weekly). I felt great at 500mg and saw okay gains (gained at least 20 lbs, am sure I’ve lost at least 5). I am on PCT right now and it’s been rough, I also got sick during the first week of PCT which definitely didn’t help. I have bloods from before, during, and will be getting them done 4-6 weeks after PCT as well, so I do have a baseline. Nothing was out of the ordinary and some values were actually better while I was on. I will obviously not start my second cycle until at least 20 weeks after my PCT is over and my bloods come back flawless. I’m hoping using HCG prior to PCT this time will help with the transition, I just did not have access to it before. During my first cycle I found out I’m relatively prone to gyno. So during the third week when I was experiencing symptoms, I started taking .3mg adex EOD. It cleared the symptoms up right away. I did not get any bloat and did not get acne until PCT which honestly hasn’t been that bad anyways. Anyways, onto my stats;

Age- 25
Height – 6’
Weight 205
BF% - 8-9%

Goal of this cycle is to put on as much mass as possible while keeping sides and damage to my body to a minimum. As for my diet, I have it written by my coach. Training wise, I’ve been seriously lifting for about 5 years, and competing for almost a year.

The cycle;
Deca-Durabolin - nandrolone decanoate –300mg (Pinned 2x weekly with test) 14 weeks

Test E – 500mg (250mg 2x weekly) 16 weeks

Arimidex - Week 2-16 – .3mg EOD

HCG -Week 1-16 : 500iu E3D
Week 17-18: 1000iu EOD

Caber on hand, because deca dick really worries me

PCT – 4 Days after last HCG pin
Clomid – 50/50/40/40/30
Nolva- 25/25/25/25

Besides general advice on the cycle itself, I have a few questions;
1. Should I kick start this cycle with Dbol or hold off as it’s only my second cycle?
2. I am not opposed to NPP for this cycle. Would it be a better alternative?
3. Should I drop the deca even earlier, or is 4 weeks before PCT enough?

Help and advice is very much appreciated.

 

[tbonexl]

No need for the dbol kicker. Might want to hold off on pct till 3 weeks after last pin. Look up pct calculator. No need to blast hcg towards the end. Just stick with the same dose. Deca does aromatize to a degree. You might have to up your adex dose...

 

[oldmusclemike]

These two Deca n Test are very commonly used for exactly what your goal is. It used to be fore bulking by the bro0science types because of having that trait of aromatizing people were doing Deca Test with high Deca plus Dbol and filling up with water to get that BIG BOY look.

Dropping the Dbol kicker and running the Test lower and Deca higher the Deca can enable you to put on solid LMM . Having some of the Test attributes to building while holding the aromatizing to a lower amount then the Test does. However any combination of these two together does well when stacked with or without. Depends on what you are working for. Diet, Diet ya know as well.

You're young and will build real good with these two at your age. Plan which way, before, and then work everything, diets and workouts for the goal.

 

[Bundy1991]

Hey man. I'm like you in that I'm very gyno prone... Were the same age and same weight (25 and 209lbs), although my body fat is a little higher than yours (13-14%).For my 2nd cycle (which I'm currently in week 4) I ran dbol the first week with 500 mg test and .5 adex eod and I STILL developed gyno... Some great advice given to me on this board is that if you are going to run the dbol and you know your prone, DEFINITELY run tamoxifen at 20mg ED right from the start and especially since your also running deca... I finally got my gyno down after dosing tamoxifen at 50mg ED for a week then cruising back on 20-40 depending on how It feels (its still there but not sensitive and very small). Get an early blood test after your first week just to get an idea of how much your aromatizing and how to adjust your AI dose. And If you do decide to do this, run your nolva through PCT. And yes you can run adex and nolva at the same time. Some studies show that nolva will decrease plasma concentrations of adex but nonetheless it will still be effective. I love dbol and I wish I could take it but I just cant take the risk with gyno. Best of luck bro...

 

[Rayquaza]

Hey guys, thanks a lot for the responses. I really appreciate the insight. Honestly the Dbol kicker wasn't my personal idea, I just noticed a lot of guys in other threads starting they're second cycle off with that as a kicker. Personally, I have no problem taking my time and slowly adding new compounds, so I'll leave Dbol out of this one. I think Deca and test e (versus cyp) will be enough, and am interested in seeing how I handle them. As for the PCT calculator - I found at least 40 different threads on it, but I couldn't find a link to a functional PCT calculator anymore. Right now I'm nearly in my third week of PCT doing clomid 50/50/50/50 and tamox 20/20/20/20 and was back online after a week, which I'm taking as a good sign. Been getting wood every single morning as well lol.

As for the HCG dosing, I was following a protocol from THE-DET-OAK in another thread with a very similar cycle plan. I'll just keep it the same throughout though.

I'm prone to gyno, but I didn't actually get any. I just knew the symptoms, had the Adex on hand and started taking it when I experienced the sensitivity and slight puffiness. My nips have since returned to completely normal status. I have no problem upping the Adex dose, it made me feel great when I took it, no acne or bloating, and half way through the cycle when I got my bloods done my estrogen was completely in check.

And If you do decide to do this, run your nolva through PCT. And yes you can run adex and nolva at the same time. Some studies show that nolva will decrease plasma concentrations of adex but nonetheless it will still be effective.

I was unaware you can run adex during PCT, unless I'm misunderstanding you. On my last cycle, my last dose of Adex was one day after my last pin I believe.

 

[Tpowered]

I thought it was common practice to run your AI up until the start of PCT. because after your last pin the remaining estro does not just disappear. need to run it until starting PCT. just my thoughts.

 

[Roush]

2. I am not opposed to NPP for this cycle. Would it be a better alternative?

NPP is just fast acting nandrolone . instead of the Dbol kicker, just front load your deca (slow acting nandrolone) with NPP for the first 6 weeks. That will get the nandrolone juices flowing muck quicker rather then waiting the long 8 weeks for deca to kick in.

NPP - 100 mg eod weeks 1-6
Deca - 400 mg weeks 1-14

I'd bump the dosage of deca up from 300 to at least 400

 

[darek]

How long does it take nandrolone is released into the blood after injection?

 

[tbonexl]

How long does it take nandrolone is released into the blood after injection?

You'll have to be more specific. You can check out the steroid profiles at the top of the page...

 

[darek]

You'll have to be more specific. You can check out the steroid profiles at the top of the page...

How long after the application takes nandrolone decanoate before it becomes active and begins to work? I tried to find it, but I failed.

 

[tbonexl]

Look into the streroid profiles. Spoon feeding isn't something we do here. Your all over the forum posting questions in other's threads when they've been answered in your own started threads.

 

[darek]

Look into the streroid profiles. Spoon feeding isn't something we do here. Your all over the forum posting questions in other's threads when they've been answered in your own started threads.

Go cry something else please. I try to learn something here.

 

[Rayquaza]

NPP is just fast acting nandrolone . instead of the Dbol kicker, just front load your deca (slow acting nandrolone) with NPP for the first 6 weeks. That will get the nandrolone juices flowing muck quicker rather then waiting the long 8 weeks for deca to kick in.

NPP - 100 mg eod weeks 1-6
Deca - 400 mg weeks 1-14

I'd bump the dosage of deca up from 300 to at least 400

I think I'll go ahead and do what you suggested. 400mg a week for deca won't be too much for me? I've read about a lot of guys staying with 300mg saying anything above that generally causes sides.