t3

bump as I would like to know how to use research chem also, so if I ever use them I will know.
 
First off, go out and buy a syringe from the drug store. This way you have much more accurate measurements.

You should start your dosage beteen 25-50mcg, then up it every 3-4 days until you reach no more than 100mcg/day. Most people say 75mcg is sufficient. As for tapering down, it's a debated topic so do you own research and make your own decision. I probably wouldn't bother. It's generally run for 6 weeks, and kept to no more than 2 times a year (and that's for serious bb'ers, it can be dangerous).

Also, diet and cardio are key in cutting...dedication is the word of the thread.
 
You don't need to divide the dose throughout the day, it is best to take the whole dose first thing in the morning on an empty stomach, and then waiting perhaps half an hour before eating anything. I don't taper either. I don't agree with the advice to restrict it to twice per year or for 6 weeks, since I don't consider it dangerous.
 
outlawtas2 said:
First off, go out and buy a syringe from the drug store. This way you have much more accurate measurements.

You should start your dosage beteen 25-50mcg, then up it every 3-4 days until you reach no more than 100mcg/day. Most people say 75mcg is sufficient. As for tapering down, it's a debated topic so do you own research and make your own decision. I probably wouldn't bother. It's generally run for 6 weeks, and kept to no more than 2 times a year (and that's for serious bb'ers, it can be dangerous).

Also, diet and cardio are key in cutting...dedication is the word of the thread.

Very good advice. As for tapering down, I do it. Thats just the way I was taught and it works for me so I stick with it. Hope the chems work well for you.
 
Trevdog said:
I don't agree with the advice to restrict it to twice per year or for 6 weeks, since I don't consider it dangerous.

Trev, do you have any evidence to support the idea that it won't cause permanent damage? Because I haven't really seen any research that supports the idea that it is dangerous, it's just something that people seem to say. I just put up that advice because it seems that it is a fairly accepted notion. But like I said, I haven't really read any research that proves it either way.

what's the longest you've run it?
 
outlawtas2 said:
Trev, do you have any evidence to support the idea that it won't cause permanent damage? Because I haven't really seen any research that supports the idea that it is dangerous, it's just something that people seem to say. I just put up that advice because it seems that it is a fairly accepted notion. But like I said, I haven't really read any research that proves it either way.

what's the longest you've run it?

I've run it for something like 12 weeks at 100 mcg. per day.

Here's something I found that Nandi (RIP) posted:

"There are many misunderstandings about the thyroid. You have about a 2 month supply of T4 stored in your thyroid (5000 mcg in the average 20 g gland) plus another 1000 mcg stored peripherally. Moreover, the body has a poorly understood "thermostat" that upregulates the conversion of T4 to T3 when T4 is depressed (1). In (1) subjects were put on a month long T3 cycle: 50 mcg/day week 1; 75/day week 2; then 100/day weeks 3 & 4, then stopped abruptly. Six days after withdrawal TSH was back in the normal range; 8 days after withdrawal it had returned to baseline and then spiked above baseline until dropping back to baseline by day 42. The point being TSH recovery is very fast.

As for thyroid hormone levels, after going cold turkey T3 dropped to only 22% below baseline and had returned to normal within 2 weeks. The 22% drop in T3 compared to a 60% drop in T4 represents the "thermostat" upregulating conversion of T4 to T3 in a state of thyroid suppression.

Your thyroid will come back quickly after only a minor suppression of T3 (22%) during a relatively heavy cycle (100 mcg/day). I would not even worry about trying to speed recovery.


(1) J Clin Invest. 1984 Feb;73(2):570-5. "
 
Hmm...while looking for some studies, I stumbled across another post by Nandi which indicates that I may have given some bad advice about the frequency of dosing. For those that don't know, Nandi had one of the biggest brains in bodybuilding. Here is his post followed by the abstract he cited to.

"...the vast majority of thyroid studies show that twice daily dosing is required to maintain uniform blood levels of T3. This review is typical:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...1&dopt=Abstract"


Department of Endocrinology and Metabolism, Academic Medical Centre, University of Amsterdam, NL-1105 AZ Amsterdam, The Netherlands. w.m.wiersinga@amc.uva.nl

Thyroid hormone replacement has been used for more than 100 years in the treatment of hypothyroidism, and there is no doubt about its overall efficacy. Desiccated thyroid contains both thyroxine (T(4)) and triiodothyronine (T(3)); serum T(3) frequently rises to supranormal values in the absorption phase, associated with palpitations. Liothyronine (T(3)) has the same drawback and requires twice-daily administration in view of its short half-life. Synthetic levothyroxine (L-T(4)) has many advantages: in view of its long half-life, once-daily administration suffices, the occasional missing of a tablet causes no harm, and the extrathyroidal conversion of T(4) into T(3) (normally providing 80% of the daily T(3) production rate) remains fully operative, which may have some protective value during illness. Consequently, L-T(4) is nowadays preferred, and its long-term use is not associated with excess mortality. The mean T(4) dose required to normalize serum thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH) is 1.6 microg/kg per day, giving rise to serum free T(4) (fT(4)) concentrations that are slightly elevated or in the upper half of the normal reference range. The higher fT(4) values are probably due to the need to generate from T(4) the 20% of the daily T(3) production rate that otherwise is derived from the thyroid gland itself. The daily maintenance dose of T(4) varies widely between 75 and 250 microg. Assessment of the appropriate T(4) dose is by assay of TSH and fT(4), preferably in a blood sample taken before ingestion of the subsequent T(4) tablet. Dose adjustments can be necessary in pregnancy and when medications are used that are known to interfere with the absorption or metabolism of T(4). A new equilibrium is reached after approximately 6 weeks, implying that laboratory tests should not be done earlier. With a stable maintenance dose, an annual check-up usually suffices. Accumulated experience with L-T(4) replacement has identified some areas of concern. First, the bioequivalence sometimes differs among generics and brand names. Second, many patients on T(4) replacement have a subnormal TSH. TSH values of < or =0.1 mU/l carry a risk of development of atrial fibrillation and are associated with bone loss although not with a higher fracture rate. It is thus advisable not to allow TSH to fall below--arbitrarily--0.2 mU/l. Third, recent animal experiments indicate that only the combination of T(4) and T(3) replacement, and not T(4) alone, ensures euthyroidism in all tissues of thyroidectomized rats. It is indeed the experience of many physicians that there exists a small subset of hypothyroid patients who, despite biochemical euthyroidism, continue to complain of tiredness, lack of energy, discrete cognitive disorders and mood disturbances. As organs vary in the extent to which their T(3) content is derived from serum T(3) or locally produced T(3) from T(4), these complaints may have a biologic substrate; for example, brain T(3) content is largely determined by local deiodinase type II activity. Against this background it is of interest that a number of psychometric scores improved significantly in hypothyroid patients upon substitution of 50 microg of their T(4) replacement dose by 12.5 microg T(3). Confirmatory studies on this issue are urgently awaited. It could well be that a slow-release preparation containing both T(4) and T(3) might improve the quality of life, compared with T(4) replacement alone, in some hypothyroid patients. Copyright 2001 S. Karger AG, Basel
 
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