A Comparison of Poundage differentials : Deads vs Squats vs Bench

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Toranaga

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here goes:
I can dead at least 90lbs more than I can squat (i.e >=90lb differential). But my squat-bench differential is only 50lbs or so i.e I can squat only about 50-60lb more than I can bench.

Ain't that weird ? I've heard that dead poundages are usually smaller than the squat and squats are way way higher than the bench. What's it like for you guys ?

BTW, I'm talking of ATF squats i.e slightly deeper than the PL regulation squat.
 
it varies from person to person. depends on body types and skeletal make up. guys with long torsos and short legs usually have a bigger squat/dead than bench % wise. guys with short arms will normally have a better bench % wise and a smaller dead.

a lot of guys when they first start training seriously lack lower body power from the previous years of all upper body work and minimal/no lower body work.

typically in plers who compete in full power squats are 1.5-2 times more than bench. deads can be any where from lower to higher than squats by 20%. most (not all) plers have a bigger squat than dead.

plus there is a differnce too in how you squat and dead. sumo, convential, low bar, high bar, etc.... same with bench. wide grip, big arch, close grip, leg drive, no leg drive, arch of the press, etc..... too many variables to give a one answer fits all.
 
I have a similar deal, but I lack chest development compared to my back and legs, which I have always been strong in. Now, with that said, my numbers aren't that high, but here they are.

Dead - 485lbs
Squat - 495lbs
Bench - 385-405lbs, this may vary because I use a Smith machine for flat during workouts.
 
nice post PB. What I was talking about was the regular dead,squat,bench. Say in a comp, they won't be critiquing the technique, just the final number. Your rationale as to the differences in body type, skeletal make-up are right on I think.

Just that I'm disappointed in my squat right now. I think I'll be doing more of the ancilliary movements - abs especially. I think they're letting me down with the real heavy weight.
I also have long legs/arms and a (relatively) shorter torso which might be contributing to the lower squat poundages and heavier deads.

RJH: those are some good numbers you got there. You got a 90lb differential on your squat-bench which is pretty much optimal. Hope to have that by the time Santa comes around :)

Thanks to all for your input.
 
oh and I'm squatting twice a week. Once ATF and box squats the second time around. Also doing both SLDs and reg deads on another (different) day.

Westside got some of their boys doing this stuff thrice a week, so I'm thinking I'm OK.
 
just keep an eye out for overtrining signs. some guys do OK on the 2xw for each body part. most dont.

i havent maxed out in a long while but last time i did i hit 805 squat (deep), 585 bench and a 675 dead. so as you can see there is roughly 100lbs betwen the three lifts working up from bench. i rarely max out anymore. its just an ego thang that get s people injured. if and when i get to compete again i am sure ill blow these numbers out of the water.

long leg guys i recommmend a very wide stance to shorten the stroke. this incorporates more muscle groups as well. send me a clip and let me look at it. it may be a very simple adjutment. or film your self and then watch it compared with some of the footage posted in the video section. the camera dont lie.

i am gomnna guess and say that you are squatting with a lot of back and not a lot of quads. this is usually typical for people pulling moe then they squat.
 
My best raw pull is 705.5
I did a raw squat last sunday for an easy 625...hope to get 682 soon.
Best raw flat bench is only 431.5 but I don't do them often.
I got 331 in the overhead log press recently though.

B True
 
b fold the truth said:
My best raw pull is 705.5
I did a raw squat last sunday for an easy 625...hope to get 682 soon.
Best raw flat bench is only 431.5 but I don't do them often.
I got 331 in the overhead log press recently though.

B True
great lifts B :D
 
RJH8541 said:
I have a similar deal, but I lack chest development compared to my back and legs, which I have always been strong in.

Sounds like genetics, because by the numbers you are doing fine IMO. The guy I know deadlifting 635 only benches 350, this is raw and he is "drug free" minus M1T use. His squat is about 500, he is 5'10".
 
pullinbig said:
i am gomnna guess and say that you are squatting with a lot of back and not a lot of quads. this is usually typical for people pulling moe then they squat.

My problem exactly, my reps actually go up if I litterally GM the damn thing as part of my movement towards my last couple reps.
 
well Mudge, I'm not GMing the dayum thing, that's for sure ! There's a bit of a lean forward when I come out of the hole, but that's prob cause I'm over 6ft and have long legs.

PB: wouldn't a wide stance (as in PL) incorporate more of the posterior and very little quads ?

PB/Bfold/RJH : I might just have to go out there and buy a digi cam ! what camera do you guys use ?
 
Toranaga said:
well Mudge, I'm not GMing the dayum thing, that's for sure ! There's a bit of a lean forward when I come out of the hole, but that's prob cause I'm over 6ft and have long legs.

PB: wouldn't a wide stance (as in PL) incorporate more of the posterior and very little quads ?

PB/Bfold/RJH : I might just have to go out there and buy a digi cam ! what camera do you guys use ?

you can move your stance out so as to incorporate more hips and glutes while still hitting the quads.

if you leaning forward coming out of the hole it has nothing to do with height. it is a form/balnace issue. i see it all the time in the gym. i can ususally work with someone for just a few minutes and correct the problem. in fact wednesday i helped a young lady who was having the very same prob with her squats. 5 minutes and she was squatting like a pro.

i bought a cheap 99 dollar camera, added a bigger mem card and bought rechargable batteries. i got about 175 bucks invested and it works great. the clips i posted in the training forum are from this camera. i think mine is a digitrex.
 
thanks for the cam specs PB..... hopefully, I'll get one soon.

well, here's what Mr Tate has to say on leaning forward. Wish I could join a hardcore PL gym ....hopefully in a few months !

Falling forward coming out of the hole: This is the king of missed squats. I see this one more than any other sticking point. This can happen for several reasons, many physical and many technical.

One technical reason is not rising with your chest first out of the bottom. You're rising with your hips first. When your hips flex first your chest will always go forward. You have to think of rising with your chest first and squatting the bar back, not up. If you have the bar driving back it'll travel in a straight line instead of going forward. The shortest distance between two points is a straight line and this is how the bar must travel.

You may also have allowed your head to drop down. Your body will always follow your head so you must keep your head back. Notice I didn't say up, but back. Watch the eyes of any great squatter as he rises out of the bottom. Through the blood clots you'll see his eyes are focused up and he's driving his neck back into the bar. Even the guys you think are looking down are still driving their head into their traps.

Now, why are these technical problems happening in the first place and how do you fix them? All technical problems should be corrected by learning what you're supposed to do and then perfecting it with the lighter weights. You should also use verbal queues. The best queues I've used for this one are "Head up!" or "Chest up!"

Falling forward may also be caused by weak abs and lower back. If your core isn't strong enough to transfer the flex from the lower body to the bar, then the body will have no choice but to collapse. The best movements for this are exercises that work both the abs and hip flexors (pulldown abs, leg raises, spread eagle sit-ups etc.) For the lower back, reverse hypers, back raises, and good mornings are ideal.

One last thing that can really help with this is to use a cambered squat bar for low box squats. The reason? If you don't rise with your chest first you'll have some very serious instability issues. This will only happen once and then you'll automatically figure out what to do.

The bottom line here is, no matter what weakness you have, act on them and fix them! This will take commitment and discipline. Basically, do what you gotta do because no one will do it for you!

 
I don't generally lean forward; maybe lil bit on that last rep on my work set , but then I don't think that's that bad. I just want to increase the poundage and that's why I was researching a couple of good articles on squatting errors.

I'm not doing much ab work (maybe once a week) and I think thats whats lacking. WHatdya recommend for Abs PB ? Any good vid links ?

Thanks man.
 
Toranaga said:
I don't generally lean forward; maybe lil bit on that last rep on my work set , but then I don't think that's that bad. I just want to increase the poundage and that's why I was researching a couple of good articles on squatting errors.

I'm not doing much ab work (maybe once a week) and I think thats whats lacking. WHatdya recommend for Abs PB ? Any good vid links ?

Thanks man.

squatting increases squatting poundages. if your form is good then your numbers will slowly and steadily climb.

as far as abs goes any kind of weighted situp will work. lower reps with heavier wieght is the general rule for squat assitance.

the reason i mentioned the shoes is cause you mentioned you have a slight lean coming out of the hole. normally what happens/causes is your back and hams are stronger than your quads. so your body is looking for the easiest way to complete the rep, ass comes up first before the knees unfold. almost all guys who pull more than they squat pull more back than legs therefore their squats are lagging out of the hole which pushes you forward.

once you get some footage we'll see if that is the problem. it may or may not be. hard to know for sure without seeing it.

oh and ronnie going back to PLing would be like giving up a 1,000,000 dollar a year job to work at mcdonalds flipping burgers. there is no money in PLing. travis mash just won the wpo finals and set the new all time world record total in the 220 divsion and won 5500 bucks. ronnie is 40 years old so he can move up into the masters divsion. i think the guy looks great. better than anybody on this board. =0)
 
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