anavar only cycle

[THE-DET-OAK]

I will never understand why people who are looking for strength gains do not include TESTOSTERONE in their cycles...

good point, my strength comes on the most when i run ANDROGENIC compounds, or stacks that accommodate both sides.

 

[pagal aadmi]

any cycle can be a good cycle depending on what your wanting out of it. im not looking to get huge or anything because im already big enough naturally i just wanted to add the extra strength nothing more. i am inexperienced but that doesnt mean lack of knowledge everyone has to start somewhere.

do what you see is doing good for you and suites your situation ,body and needs. dont experiment un-necessarily. i know you are running from test but if you feel like shit because lack of androgen anywhere between the cycle as you dont have test add some proviron.. 25 -50 mg/day would be enough giving extra strength..and intensity.

test is very very natural for the body..it does all the function which other dug just cant.but you can live without it for 6-7 if you are smart enough . and you seems smart ...you are gona have some 90% of your strenght gain from anavar post cycle...and also the lean muscle gain( if you eat shit of food)...it aint going no where ..


ps:if i was in your situation i would have run dbol with proviron to keep the strenght high and water bloat down.

and dbol+proviron=happy strong mofo


no need to run any oral over long period of time..after few weeks there effectiveness diminish . short burst cycle is fine. you wont feel depression after this short busrt cycle with weak compound..and guess what you are doing great and thats count

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

a small piece of the BIGAT's write up on proviron.

"Unlike what some suggest or believe, its not advised that Proviron be used when not used in conjunction with another steroid, as it too is quite suppressive of natural testosterone, leading to all sorts of future complications upon discontinuation. Ranging from loss of libido or erectile dysfunction all the way up to infertility. One would not be aware of such dangers because Proviron fulfills most of the functions of normal levels of testosterone."

you dont get "gains" from proviron. you do from test though.

 

[pagal aadmi]

proviron = increased strength =increase poundage=increase lean muscle mass (if eat right..if then its very little) ..but he is not looking for mass...and proviron provides such pure strength and little polishing effect on the body that user think from where the hell i am seeing these strength gains as i am seeing no muscle or mass gain at all.

proviron is not very suppressive..docs have used 100 mg per day for 12 months (not weeks) with little or no suppression at all at least not extremely at 25-50 mg day...and he is gonna use it for 6 weeks or so..even only if he feels to need it..otherwise not needed... and he is doing post cycle therapy (pct) anyway. here we are looking strength..not muscle mass gain.

anavar= strength increase with adipose fat loss= more room for lean muscle at the same body weight =much stronger then the same weight category dude...

and thats his mission.

proviron for his brain to think clear and positive and give him little strength with vigor he might lack when/if test is suppressed and not supplied from outside.. . anavar make some ppl lethargic when taken alone..proviron will tackle this psychological/physiological problem if he experience it which i highly doubt considering his young age.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

now your really selling me on this...........lets spend way more fucking money, to get less gains than a T only cycle cause im scared to pin. Brilliant I say, just fucking brilliant.

Not only that proviron is bad for the prostate, and so are low T levels, im thinking I should make a habbit of this cycle.

and you can argue your suppression theory with Llewellyn if youd like, he will tell you the exact opposite.

and bring on these 12 month studies, I would love to fucking see them

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

So are you a woman ? I didn't get that in your post. Why are you using Steroids at 19 your natural test levels are higher than the anvar will make them. Why not learn how to eat and wait on the steroids for another 5 years. You don't want to be a midget do you.

 

[pagal aadmi]

he is not looking for mass gain... or weight gain...his main target is to win the competition...to be strong without adverse side effect and keep-able strength gains .not to gain the mass and impress the homo judges and loose the competition by competing with stronger/bigger/heavier dude while looking like a bloat mess jabbing himself with test at the young age of 19 and trying to fight the gyno to high BP to water retension while high chance of getting caught in drug test.

i believe he needs to learn how to use anavar/proviron/halo rather than test/deca at this point of time. boxers power lifters are halo/anavar abusers for a good reason..its backbone of there career . some powerlifter use suspension with 18 gauge right before competition but they look like a bloat mess and generally fucked in head in order to bear the pain of it ROFL

 

[jimbo79]

now your really selling me on this...........lets spend way more fucking money, to get less gains than a T only cycle cause im scared to pin. Brilliant I say, just fucking brilliant.

Not only that proviron is bad for the prostate, and so are low T levels, im thinking I should make a habbit of this cycle.

and you can argue your suppression theory with Llewellyn if youd like, he will tell you the exact opposite.

and bring on these 12 month studies, I would love to fucking see them

Can you elaborate on the provron and being bad for the prostate,I'm not disagreeing or challenging this..but I was going to incorporate it with test in my next cycle..

On that note, is it safe in moderate dose for 14 weeks or so? I'm not getting any younger, so preventing future health issues is a concern always

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

he is not looking for mass gain... or weight gain...his main target is to win the competition...to be strong without adverse side effect and keep-able strength gains .not to gain the mass and impress the homo judges and loose the competition by competing with stronger/bigger/heavier dude while looking like a bloat mess jabbing himself with test at the young age of 19 and trying to fight the gyno to high BP to water retension while high chance of getting caught in drug test.

i believe he needs to learn how to use anavar/proviron/halo rather than test/deca at this point of time. boxers power lifters are halo/anavar abusers for a good reason..its backbone of there career . some powerlifter use suspension with 18 gauge right before competition but they look like a bloat mess and generally fucked in head in order to bear the pain of it ROFL

I made it through the first sentence when you said he was not looking for weight gain, so im done with this convo, who needs to gain weight on any compound when they can control their diet. so now your telling me with an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) to control water and a proper diet you can not cut on test????

je said he was a comp lifter-not that he was getting ready for one, and not a BBER lifter a powerlifter!!!!! fuck all i just realised this kid was 19 anyway, im outta here!!!!! let me go dig up that info for you jimbo my brudda.

 

[DADAWG]

he is not looking for mass gain... or weight gain...his main target is to win the competition...to be strong without adverse side effect and keep-able strength gains .not to gain the mass and impress the homo judges and loose the competition by competing with stronger/bigger/heavier dude while looking like a bloat mess jabbing himself with test at the young age of 19 and trying to fight the gyno to high BP to water retension while high chance of getting caught in drug test.

i believe he needs to learn how to use anavar/proviron/halo rather than test/deca at this point of time. boxers power lifters are halo/anavar abusers for a good reason..its backbone of there career . some powerlifter use suspension with 18 gauge right before competition but they look like a bloat mess and generally fucked in head in order to bear the pain of it ROFL

what do you know about powerlifting , ive been around powerlifting since you were shitting green in diapers lol.

please do not give advice when you dont have the right info , its not fair to newer members who dont realize you dont know anything.





excuses , excuses ,reasons , reasons , blah blah , blah . it all boils down to ignorence about steroids or FEAR of needles. everything that a powerlifter needs can be accomplished with injectables [ including testosterone ] and that will leave more Anavar (var) for the women lol.

 

[pagal aadmi]

now your really selling me on this...........lets spend way more fucking money, to get less gains than a T only cycle cause im scared to pin. Brilliant I say, just fucking brilliant.

Not only that proviron is bad for the prostate, and so are low T levels, im thinking I should make a habbit of this cycle.

and you can argue your suppression theory with Llewellyn if youd like, he will tell you the exact opposite.

and bring on these 12 month studies, I would love to fucking see them

dude even williom advised his first few cycle as deca/winni/proviron. i have read willioms book more than 10 times.

'''Stacking and Use:

Mesterolone is an oral alkylated steroid. If used primarily as an anti-aromatase drug, using it throughout a longer cycle (10-12 weeks) of injectables may elevate liver values a little bit, though much, much less than one would expect with a 17-alpha-alkylated steroid. Eventhough instead of inhibiting gains, mesterolone may actually contribute to gains. So that's a bit of a shame. Its not quite as toxic since its not alkylated in the same fashion, but at the 1 position, which reduces hepatic breakdown, but not like 17-alpha alkylation. The reason for the change of position I assume, is because alkylating at the 17-alpha position has been shown to reduce affinity for sex hormone binding proteins. This would in turn decrease its ability to free testosterone. Nonetheless the delivery rate is quite good. Its taken daily in 50-100 mg doses.

The best thing to stack it with is testosterone of course. Its most easily bound to SHBG and albumin, and deactivated for up to 98%. Since the DHT can compete for these structures with higher affinity it would naturally lead to a higher yield of whatever testosterone product you stacked it with. Since DHT levels are notably higher now there is also more stimulation of the androgen receptor causing more strength gains, and because of its affinity for aromatase the overall estrogen level decreases as well. This has as a result that gains are leaner, and once again the overall testosterone yield is increased as less I converted at the aromatase enzyme.

It's of course used in other stacks with products such as methandrostenolone, boldenone and nandrolone to reduce estrogenic activity and increase muscle hardness. The addition of proviron makes boldenone a dead lock for a cutting stack and for some may even make it possible to use nandrolone while cutting, although the use of Winstrol or a receptor antagonist in conjunction is wishful as well. The benefit of adding it to a nandrolone stack is that it may also help you reduce the decrease in libido suffered from nandrolone, since the latter is mostly deactivated by 5-alpha reductase, an enzyme that makes other hormones more androgenic.

Proviron is an anti-aromatase, so obviously anti-estrogens would be futile and redundant. Blood pressure medication for those prone to hypertension may be wise, as this DHT can increase the blood pressure.


Abstract refuting that Proviron is not highly suppressive


Here is the study I was referring to. Only 85 men out of 250 showed any suppression. Proviron did not shut down the HPTA in any of the subjects and that was at 150mg for 1 year. I would say its pretty safe and has very little effect on one's HPTA
This study shows no effect on normal LH and FSH with 100-150mg/ d mesterolone, and decrease of FSH/LH that were elevated.
Proviron doesn't substitute Clomid as hpta therapy, but doesn't get in the way, either.
The effect of mesterolone on sperm count, on serum follicle stimulating hormone, luteinizing hormone, plasma testosterone and outcome in idiopathic oligospermic men."''

forums.steroid.com/archive/index.php/t-76376.html

forums.isteroids.com/anabolic-steroids-questions-answers/51815-proviron-does-not-suppress-testosterone-fsh-lh.html

 

[pagal aadmi]

what do you know about powerlifting ,
ive been around powerlifting since you were shitting green in diapers lol.
please do not give adv ice when you dont have the right info , its not fair to newer members who dont realize you dont know anything.





excuses , excuses ,reasons , reasons , blah blah , blah . it all boils down to ignorence about steroids or FEAR of needles. everything that a powerlifter needs can be accomplished with injectables [ including testosterone ] and that will leave more Anavar (var) for the women lol.

ROFL

BTW orals NOT= fear of needle.

and you know what..i have some genetic problems on my scalp and docs jab injections on my scalp every few weeks or so with needle...it hurts a lot...injections on the skin of head..damn ..lol....so i dont think atleast i dont fear needle


and you are a good guy Dawg..

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

i didnt leave im having trouble finding Llewellyn's statement on proviron dosages. I read it last night. something about 50mg 3x a week was not suppressive but high doses were. I will find it give me time, it was a post from within the last 12 months.

either way doing this cycle IMO is a waste, since its more expensive than T only which would be better, and I explained your "not much weight thing"

problem is I knew a decent amount about proviron and now im finding its bullshit, and now im having a hard time figuring out if there actually is any use at all for proviron!!!!!!

I will have to bring a post from scally. problem is it contradicts what WL says!!!!!

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

anyone using an 18 gauge is a fool that would leave holes in them link a .22 calibur

 

[jimbo79]

It's all good Oak, I'm finding info on it about enlarging the prostate, not sure what doses are the causes though.

And having to get regular prostate exams while taking it..ummm maybe I won't go through with it. And having to explain to the doc why I'm getting frequent exams while young..no thanks.

What is a Prostate Exam Like? | eHow.com

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

I will be back with more info. after diggin deeper their are some VERY mixed opinions on it. Im not sold on the prostate cancer just yet now either, although this is what I always believed. It may have more to do with estrogen, but ive always known that may be what causes the cancer on high doses of test.

Im also getting mixed reviews if if actually does have any androgenic effects at all, and so far I think peggy or whatever his name is (until you apologize on quoting me being a scammer i will treat you like one) may be wrong about claiming strength gains. this is from literature.

I have taken proviron before up to 100mg ED and didnt notice a damn thing but libido. I just assumed I got more gains from reducing SHBG but maybe i didnt.

it will take me a little time to get to the bottom of ms peggy's claims.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

do what you see is doing good for you and suites your situation ,body and needs. dont experiment un-necessarily. i know you are running from test but if you feel like shit because lack of androgen anywhere between the cycle as you dont have test add some proviron.. 25 -50 mg/day would be enough giving extra strength..and intensity.

this statement is not supported by any medical data I can find. or by my experience. although it may make him think he is ok even though his T levels are in the toilet, you are wrong about the strenght and intensity. this is noted in my following post, quotation, an explanation on some studies on proviron.

test is very very natural for the body..it does all the function which other dug just cant.but you can live without it for 6-7 if you are smart enough . and you seems smart ...you are gona have some 90% of your strenght gain from anavar post cycle...and also the lean muscle gain( if you eat shit of food)...it aint going no where ..

this is your opinion and is worthless

ps:if i was in your situation i would have run dbol with proviron to keep the strenght high and water bloat down.

again you are making claims that proviron actually has some effect on aromtizing compounds, the following studies show otherwise. If it did, the TT levels would have changed due to inhibiton of aromatase, in the androgen therapy studies.

no need to run any oral over long period of time..after few weeks there effectiveness diminish . short burst cycle is fine. you wont feel depression after this short busrt cycle with weak compound..and guess what you are doing great and thats count

now your implying that he will have no suppression, which you have not supported yet. maybe you supported the fact that HPTA will not be suppressed by proviron, but im still not sold. you did say that 85 men experienced HPTA suppression from proviron right? not to mention that scally doesnt buy the study either. not to mention we CAN prove both dbol and Anavar (var) will suppress, so again worthless.

proviron = increased strength =increase poundage=increase lean muscle mass (if eat right..if then its very little) ..but he is not looking for mass...and proviron provides such pure strength and little polishing effect on the body that user think from where the hell i am seeing these strength gains as i am seeing no muscle or mass gain at all.

anavar= strength increase with adipose fat loss= more room for lean muscle at the same body weight =much stronger then the same weight category dude...

and thats his mission.



proviron for his brain to think clear and positive and give him little strength with vigor he might lack when/if test is suppressed and not supplied from outside.. . anavar make some ppl lethargic when taken alone..proviron will tackle this psychological/physiological problem if he experience it which i highly doubt considering his young age.

your strength claims are not supported are not supported by the following argument, which is backed up scientifically.

from Dr. Scally

This is a post on placed on another thread concerning the same topic.

Dianabol (methandione, methandrostenolone, metandienone, and a host of other names) suppresses the HPTA. The use of dianabol in the hope that it will provide HPTA normalization is misguided. More details, later, can be provided, if requested.

However, a brief note on proviron. What evidence is there that proviron lacks androgenic activity. The literature presents this by the absence of proviron to influence significantly infertility, erythropoiesis, lipids, and sex hormones. Except for the obsessive compulsive that needs to take a substance, thus replacing an AAS with adverse HPTA effects with one that does not, proviron is a worthless AAS, useful for nothing. Proviron will not support or provide any basis for the return of HPTA function.

The quoted abstract from the study by Varma and Patel really does not give one any information. [Varma TR, Patel RH. The effect of mesterolone on sperm count, on serum follicle stimulating hormone, luteinizing hormone, plasma testosterone and outcome in idiopathic oligospermic men. Int J Gynaecol Obstet 1988;26:121-8.] The study is poor from the abstract alone. Please note that the statement, "Mesterolone had no depressing effect on low or normal serum FSH and LH levels but had depressing effect on 25% if the levels were elevated," refers unidentified group. The groups in the study include, "One hundred ten patients . . . had normal serum FSH, LH and plasma testosterone, 85 patients . . . had low serum FSH, LH and low plasma testosterone." Nowhere is there a group with elevated levels. Nonetheless, the cited effect is a "depressing effect" not stated as significant. Knowing the fluctuation in gonadotropin levels on testing even at a P<0.05 would not be meaningful. But it does go to the point that proviron has no adverse effect on the HPTA.

Mesterolone is useless for infertility. A year after the Varma study, 1989, the World Health Organization published a study demonstrating, "[n]o significant changes semen quality during the course of the study, apart from an increase in sperm concentration 3 months after the start of treatment. The increase was greatest among the placebo treated group, but did not differ significantly between treatment groups." [Mesterolone and idiopathic male infertility: a double-blind study. World Health Organization Task Force on the Diagnosis and Treatment of Infertility. Int J Androl 1989;12:254-64.]

In 1991, a study concludes, "Because similar semen improvement also occurred in the placebo controls, our findings cast doubt on the possible usefulness of high-dose Mesterolone treatment of idiopathic male infertility." [Gerris J, Comhaire F, Hellemans P, Peeters K, Schoonjans F. Placebo-controlled trial of high-dose Mesterolone treatment of idiopathic male infertility. Fertil Steril 1991;55:603-7.]

These confirm an earlier study from 1983. [Wang C, Chan CW, Wong KK, Yeung KK. Comparison of the effectiveness of placebo, clomiphene citrate, mesterolone, pentoxifylline, and testosterone rebound therapy for the treatment of idiopathic oligospermia. Fertil Steril 1983;40:358-65.] Treatment with the mesterolone (100 mg/day) therapy did not result in a significant increase in the mean sperm concentration or pregnancy in the partners.

Proviron is useless in promoting erythropoiesis (formation of red blood cell elements) and bone formation (a mixed effect of testosterone through the androgen receptor and estradiol receptor), both evidence of androgenic activity. Mesterolone (100 mg/d) is ineffective in raising hemoglobin and hematocrit levels significantly from baseline in individuals with hypogonadism. The study cites that Mesterolone did not increase serum testosterone (but also did not mention that there is a decrease). [Jockenhovel F, Vogel E, Reinhardt W, Reinwein D. Effects of various modes of androgen substitution therapy on erythropoiesis. Eur J Med Res 1997;2:293-8.]

As recent as 2003, mesterolone (100 mg/d) for 6 months administered to hypogonadal males failed to significantly raise bone mineral density (BMD). Treatment with testosterone undecanoate (160 mg/d), testosterone enanthate 250 mg (every 21 days), or a single subcutaneous implantation of 1,200 mg crystalline testosterone did result in BMD increases. [Schubert M, Bullmann C, Minnemann T, Reiners C, Krone W, Jockenhovel F. Osteoporosis in male hypogonadism: responses to androgen substitution differ among men with primary and secondary hypogonadism. Horm Res 2003;60:21-8.]

Erythropoiesis and bone formation are positive aspects of androgens useful under certain clinical conditions. AAS consistently have adverse effects on lipid profiles that are generally observed as a decrease in HDL (good cholesterol). In 1999, twenty years after the study cited by MaxRep [Nikkanen V. Plasma cholesterol, triglycerides, FSH and testosterone levels of normolipemic male patients with decreased fertility treated with mesterolone. Andrologia 1979;11:33-6.] proviron was found to adversely effect the lipid profile in hypogonadal men. The study by abstract analysis is hard to detail but an adverse effect of proviron is reported. Also, the study reports on serum testosterone levels with androgen treatments. Androgen substitution led to no significant increase of serum testosterone in the proviron group, subnormal testosterone in the testosterone undecanoate group, normal testosterone in the testosterone enanthate group, and high-normal testosterone in the crystalline testosterone group. The message is proviron did not affect the HPTA. [Jockenhovel F, Bullmann C, Schubert M, et al. Influence of various modes of androgen substitution on serum lipids and lipoproteins in hypogonadal men. Metabolism 1999;48:590-6.] The same author reports that proviron administration has no effect on serum FSH or testosterone. [Nikkanen V. The effects of mesterolone on the male accessory sex organs, on spermiogram, plasma testosterone and FSH. Andrologia 1978;10:299-306.]

"I have said too much already. A further review of proviron literature will not change the use of proviron as an AAS for either anabolic or androgenic effects. Bottom line: Proviron is of no use for anything.

Thank you."

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

Lmao. I cant get over this study. thank god people like Scally know how to see the bullshit in it. so basically if i have good HPTA there is suppression. but if i have a bad HPTA there is none, what does that even mean???? just goes to show we cant believe all the shit we read.

 

[pagal aadmi]

this statement is not supported by any medical data I can find.


this is your opinion and is worthless



again you are making claims that proviron actually has some effect on aromtizing compounds, the following studies show otherwise.





"

you can kiss my brown ass with medical data in your hand.


your opinion also not matters,, if you think it matters because you spend ( waist ) so much time here and because of your high post count then i feel sorry for you mr. senior member. grow the fuck up


yeah proviron is useless thats why so many ppl take it around the world for the bodybuilding purpose even though its not cheap.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

and bro ..even i dont recomend oral only cycle...

irony at its best......................................... i never said it was useless, I clearly stated earlier it made me hard as a rock, downstairs.