Do I have Hypothyroidism? Help Out Here...

[riprockwell]

Good info Doc and 2rude. It is sad but it is true. Synthroid is in the doctors pockets. They pay and host for many conferences for all these docs year after year. This goes back years and years. Synthroid isn't the only company who does this, but the biggest one for thyroids though. Your best bet is to get the word endo out of your mind. You need to look at doctors that are familiar with combo meds. Here is my experience in that area.

1. D.O (Look up Doctors of Osteopath) in your area. Call them and ask the secretary if the doctor there prescribes any T3 medication or Armor or combo thyroid meds.
2. D.O.M ( Doctors of Oriental Medicine). I would look in to this as well. My current doctor is a DOM and she has me on 50mcg per day of T3 only by script. Not all will be this generous but these doctors generally have more time to talk and discuss shit. While she is giving me acupuncture, I am talking about hormones with her, etc.
3. When you do go in to your doctor, make sure you bring in evidence and key points. Tell them the last thing you want to do is treat a range, but rather alleviate your negative symptoms. Patients who feel like shit are unfortunately not familiar with google and are not self-informed. As you know, you know your body better than any doctor. So make sure to come with ammo. I will give you an example. I was on T4 only. Put on 10lbs of fat in 1 month all while dieting, got anxiety, felt depressed, no sex drive, etc. I printed out info and Thyroid tissue resistent people, etc and came at her with that ammo. She read over my paperwork and decided she would let me have some T3. She gave me T3 from a compounded pharmacy. It was SRT3 (Slow Release T3). I didn't feel a thing on it. So I went in for my next appointment and I gave her paperwork that showed that SRT3 is subpar treatment for a lot of patients, etc. So I demanded pharm grade T3 (King Pharmaceuticals Brand) and once I got on that, I felt better. She was hesitant because she said that the Slow release stuff is safer. I told her I would multi dose my pharm T3 and start low. I felt 10 times better and she realized she had to be more open minded. Just don't hand your doctor 50 pages of shit to read. Bring in a page or 2 with highlighted parts with key facts/notes. Thats the best way to get a point across. Good luck!! Rant over. Lol

Just try to get the word Endocrinologist out of your mind. I have yet to meet one that prescribes any armor or even bothers to check your iodine levels.

 

[riprockwell]

The main reason is big pharma. You can't patent a natural hormone, so there's no money in it unless you get real creative. As a result, they design and patent synthetic hormones then convince docs that synthetic is better. You would be surprised how many docs have been brainwashed into believing that Armour is actually arsenic.

This is very true. There is such a negative stigma on Armour and Cytomel. Those make Endo's cringe. I guess apparently they haven't had thyroid problems and felt like death with subpar T4 treatment. On a side note, I actually am proud because over the years, I have helped hypothyroid patients regain their lives back with Armour or T3 only and helped them figure out their problems. A good 50% of the people I have helped are self medicating but not feeling like death so I guess they can't complain. Took me going to 6 doctors before I finally found one that was open to having T3 in the mix. On another note, another complaint I have heard about Armour is that a long time ago they had a bad batch and a few endos have mentioned that to me and that armour dosages are not consistent. I know Synthroid has pushed this on Endo's as well. Basically scare tactics. Armour even addressed it by saying this happened in the late 1980's. Comical that Endos still bring that up. Lol.

 

[My_Pitch27]

This is all great information... I should have an answer by tomorrow on whether my endo will prescribe a t3 mix or armour.
Keep you guys posted!

 

[My_Pitch27]

If you successfully convince your endo to treat you with t4 and t3 please let me know hwat you said in your message i would like to try to convince my endo again.

Brizza-

So my endo told me that she first tries t4 meds and if doesn't help she will add t3 or armour...
below is the message I sent her and her response. Hope this helps man!

:::Message to her:::
I've been doing my research on possible hypothyroidism and I've come across a number of things.

a) Is it possible that I have 'Subclinical Hypothyroidism' as my TSH values are between 3.0-5.0?

b) It appears that a t4 only treatment may not be as effective as a combination medication of t4 and t3, such as Armour Thyroid. Reasoning is, while taking the t4 only medication it may work for the first year or so but, the dose will have to continue to rise and rise as the years pass.

c) Should be begin to frequently test TSH, RT3, Free T3, Total T3, Free T4 and Total T4?

Thank you in advance.

:::Message from her:::
Yes, one can use the term "subclinical hypothyroidism" for people who have hypothyroid symptoms with TSH between 3.0-5.0.

Many people do well with just T4 therapy, so I usually start off with T4 therapy first and if the person does not feel better, then consider adding on T3 therapy, such as Armour. Many people are on T4 therapy their whole lives and require little adjustment in their doses.

The main tests I recommend checking are TSH and free T4 - the other tests are not as helpful because they are not always accurate. I usually check these labs 2-3 months after we make medication changes since it takes that long for the hormone levels to stabilize.

 

[My_Pitch27]

Thank you all for helping me out with the info! I have great news that my doctor is one of the "willing" that prescribes Armour!!!
Thanks again guys! Alot of anxiety has been released now that I don't have to shop for a new doc!

 

[2rude4u]

Thank you all for helping me out with the info! I have great news that my doctor is one of the "willing" that prescribes Armour!!!
Thanks again guys! Alot of anxiety has been released now that I don't have to shop for a new doc!

That good news bro... you will feel much better on Armour than on T4 only.

 

[My_Pitch27]

Quick update.... Talked to the endo and she put me on Armour Thyroid at a starting dose of 15mg/day... She says we will gradually increase the dose every 4 weeks or so.

Can anyone tell me what to expect from this medication?
Will my hormone levels change?
Mood?
Metabolism?
Fat Reductions?
Hair loss/ or thickening?
Sense of well being?

Any input is greatly appreciated.

 

[lakers0812]

Most people don't do well on synthroid/levo. If you want to know the sides that you can expect to experience while on t4 only, I'll tell you. When I first started on ology, I had been taking synthroid for about 8 months. At first I noticed an improvement. This was very short lived because although it was an improvement, it was an improvement from feeling very hypo with a tsh of 15. I took synthroid for 8 months and the sides that still remained were fatigue, less stamina, terrible brain fog, hair loss, and very poor memory. I realized quickly that I couldn't live like this. I talked to people like RIP and joined forums such as health boards, and did my own research. MOST DOCTORS DON'T KNOW HOW TO TREAT THIS. I took NDT for a few months, and it was great! All my sides went away. The problem is I built up too much rt3, which I am currently in the process of clearing. Right now I am taking cytomel or t3 only. It is definitely working. I would personally skip the levo and start with NDT. Your biggest issue may be finding an endo that is on board with this. I suggest going to your pharmacy and asking which endos prescribe NDT. Your TSH isn't terrible, but then again it is all based on how you feel. Good luck!

 

[lakers0812]

Quick update.... Talked to the endo and she put me on Armour Thyroid at a starting dose of 15mg/day... She says we will gradually increase the dose every 4 weeks or so.

Can anyone tell me what to expect from this medication?
Will my hormone levels change?
Mood?
Metabolism?
Fat Reductions?
Hair loss/ or thickening?
Sense of well being?

Any input is greatly appreciated.

Peronally I think your armour dose is too low. Most people start with half a grain or one whole grain, and then taper up. I started at 1 grain = 65 mg. I increased it by half a grain every 2 weeks because my hypo symptoms would return around the 2 week mark. After every increase I felt great. I increased it all the way up to 3.5 grains and that is where I felt my best. I think with your dose of 15 mg you'll feel better initially but your hypo symptoms will come back. Hopefully your endo doesn't believe that you should be on 2 grains maximum like mine did.

 

[My_Pitch27]

Peronally I think your armour dose is too low. Most people start with half a grain or one whole grain, and then taper up. I started at 1 grain = 65 mg. I increased it by half a grain every 2 weeks because my hypo symptoms would return around the 2 week mark. After every increase I felt great. I increased it all the way up to 3.5 grains and that is where I felt my best. I think with your dose of 15 mg you'll feel better initially but your hypo symptoms will come back. Hopefully your endo doesn't believe that you should be on 2 grains maximum like mine did.

My endo seems pretty open to upping my dose and treat symptoms... first, what is ndt?
also, is there a universal dose per bodyweight to take?
what happens when u build up to much rt3? and how do u get rid of it?

thanks for responding...

 

[lakers0812]

My endo seems pretty open to upping my dose and treat symptoms... first, what is ndt?
also, is there a universal dose per bodyweight to take?
what happens when u build up to much rt3? and how do u get rid of it?

thanks for responding...

Ndt is natural desiccated thyroid (armour, naturethroid, erfa). The average dose of Ndt is 3-3.5 grains. Building up rt3 can come from many sources such as, stress, adrenal fatigue, and even having the t4 in your drugs convert to rt3 instead of t3. I don't know for sure how I got high rt3. It could've been from doing a restart for testosterone, or it could've been the t4 from levo and t4 from ndt. What I can tell you is that before my rt3 was high, I was feeling great on ndt. The only way that I know to get rid of it is to use t3 only like cytomel. You take it for 8-12 weeks, increasing your dose by 6.25 mcg (25 mcg tablets) every 3-5 days.

Most people should respond well to ndt because it gives you exactly what your normal thyroid would give you: t1,t2,t3,t4, calcitonin. You don't start on a high dose of natural desiccated thyroid med because it can stress out your adrenals and increase rt3. You have to increase it over time. That's good to hear that your dr is open to treating symptoms and not labs. Remember while take anything above 2 grains, your tsh will be suppressed close to 0. Also, I dont know if you know this but the companies that produce naturethroid and armour changed the formula some years back. The new ones have a lot of cellulose in them. This makes it hard to absorb. When you take your armour chew it up, put it under your tongue, and wait for it to dissolve. This increases the absorbtion. A lot of people are doing terrible on amour and naturethroid because they simply swallow the pills. You most likely need to chew it first and take it sublingually.

stopthethyroidmadness.com

 

[Yebro]

Don't mean to hijack this thread but it made me ask myself a question..

T3 raises the metabolic rate.

Are there substances that LOWER the metabolic rate? If someone were to have the hyperthyroidism..

Very curious.

 

[My_Pitch27]

Ndt is natural desiccated thyroid (armour, naturethroid, erfa). The average dose of Ndt is 3-3.5 grains. Building up rt3 can come from many sources such as, stress, adrenal fatigue, and even having the t4 in your drugs convert to rt3 instead of t3. I don't know for sure how I got high rt3. It could've been from doing a restart for testosterone, or it could've been the t4 from levo and t4 from ndt. What I can tell you is that before my rt3 was high, I was feeling great on ndt. The only way that I know to get rid of it is to use t3 only like cytomel. You take it for 8-12 weeks, increasing your dose by 6.25 mcg (25 mcg tablets) every 3-5 days.

Most people should respond well to ndt because it gives you exactly what your normal thyroid would give you: t1,t2,t3,t4, calcitonin. You don't start on a high dose of natural desiccated thyroid med because it can stress out your adrenals and increase rt3. You have to increase it over time. That's good to hear that your dr is open to treating symptoms and not labs. Remember while take anything above 2 grains, your tsh will be suppressed close to 0. Also, I dont know if you know this but the companies that produce naturethroid and armour changed the formula some years back. The new ones have a lot of cellulose in them. This makes it hard to absorb. When you take your armour chew it up, put it under your tongue, and wait for it to dissolve. This increases the absorbtion. A lot of people are doing terrible on amour and naturethroid because they simply swallow the pills. You most likely need to chew it first and take it sublingually.

stopthethyroidmadness.com

very interesting information, thank you for sharing your experience...im also searching that site as well sttm
ive read that people are chewing up their medication and also letting it dissolve under the tongue. i have been setting my alarm for 7am taking the pill then going back to sleep and having my second alarm wake me up at 9am. would this be sufficient in allowing my body to absorb the medication? i know there should be a 1-4 hour window as not to have fiber, calcium, etc...

also i see that the dose is 1.2-1.8 per kg, im 187 so thats about 84kgs so i should be taking 100-151mgs.... starting at 15mg, its going to take me a long time to get up there...

from what ive read i need to test
tsh
free t4
total t4
free t3
total t3
and rt3
correct?

and thank you for replying... this is all helpful information!

 

[My_Pitch27]

Don't mean to hijack this thread but it made me ask myself a question..

T3 raises the metabolic rate.

Are there substances that LOWER the metabolic rate? If someone were to have the hyperthyroidism..

Very curious.

there is medication to bring your numbers up. r u hyper?

 

[Killer.7]

Hey bro..I saw your informative post on the hypothyroid thread

I too am a young bodybuilder..23 now. I had elevated TSH 7 and 6.6 on my second blood test. So my doctor tested for t4 and did an ultrasound on my neck. The t4 was normal as well 18, however the ultrasound found little noduels on my thyroid...which might mean hashimotos. I am scheduled to see a thyroid specialist to discuss treatment and what not.

What is NDT and have you tried supplementing with armour?

also how do you find bodybuilding and having a hypothyroid? Currently I don't have any major symptoms which is why this is bugging me so much. Can you gain muscle while running t4 for the thyroid?

 

[Killer.7]

^^ that msg was for lakersboy

for some reason I can't send private msgs?

 

[DreDay187]

^^ that msg was for lakersboy

for some reason I can't send private msgs?

You need 50posts to be able to PM

 

[DreDay187]

Hey bro..I saw your informative post on the hypothyroid thread

I too am a young bodybuilder..23 now. I had elevated TSH 7 and 6.6 on my second blood test. So my doctor tested for t4 and did an ultrasound on my neck. The t4 was normal as well 18, however the ultrasound found little noduels on my thyroid...which might mean hashimotos. I am scheduled to see a thyroid specialist to discuss treatment and what not.

What is NDT and have you tried supplementing with armour?

also how do you find bodybuilding and having a hypothyroid? Currently I don't have any major symptoms which is why this is bugging me so much. Can you gain muscle while running t4 for the thyroid?

Hashimoto's is the most common type of hypothyroid there is, it's your immune system attacking your thyroid gland leaving it under active. My sister suffers from Hashimoto's and is currently on synthroid but it doesn't seem to help her much. I think she'd greatly benefit from cytomel (T3), thyroid armour, or the NDT.

Bodybuilding shouldn't be affected if you're taking medication. Being hypothyroidic can make it hard to lose fat, build muscle, and leave you feeling less energetic. Treating it with the necessary hormones would increase quality of life/bodybuilding.

 

[Killer.7]

Thanks for the response bro. Is there any way of finding a doctor to prescribe armour rather than simple t4 alone. From what I have read Armour is much more effective.

What's weird is I have no symptoms really and not to sure what to think of all this. What do you think about the ultrasound finding noduels on the thyroid?

 

[DreDay187]

Well your doctor would know best but generally nodules can be nothing or can be everything. An ultrasonography is done to see if they're cysts or solid nodules, a biopsy might be done to see if they're cancerous or benign, and hot nodules (that cause you to produce too much hormone) are almost always benign while cold nodules (cause thyroid to produce too little hormone) have a few types that are cancerous.

Treatment options for nodules are usually either synthetic hormone replacement or surgery if cancerous. If you've been diagnosed wth Hashimoto's though this is moot, you're primarily concerned with replacing the hormone your body isn't producing. Most thyroid hormone replacement therapies are reversible meaning if you start them and decide to stop later on, your thyroid will go back to 'normal' after a few weeks, whatever normal is to you in this case hypothyroidic. If you really suffer no symptoms you don't necessarily have to treat it but with what I just said, you can try treating it to see if something changes for the better and if not come back off. Thyroid armour and T3 would def be better options than T4 (especially considering you have great T4 values so you may also have a conversion to T3 issue). T4 is the inferior treatment method for the most part. The only way to know what your doctor will prescribe is to ask. If he does T4 and refuses to hear you out on other options go doctor shopping and call ahead to see what treatment options each doctor is used to prescribing.