doing only 12 sets just doesn't feel like a real workout.. I feel i'm going allout

[Milton]

This is a picture, I never showed on the forum before. It's me at 138 lbs. Funny to me brother how we like so much alike. This was natural and a complete joke IMO.
The Second Picture is my size. Of Course I'm not shredded to the bone and I'm holding water, but My mass and u say its a joke? Come on, The pic speaks for itself.....
And keep in mind, ur pic is taken from a bottom up angel to make urself look bigger. How about stand straight at the least....

View attachment 565860

BS, not the same person in the front pic and back pic and not the same person in your avi. I can spot it a mile away since I do loads of photography.
and you said that a pic speaks for itself? Oh yes it does buddy. I have software that enables me to download any pic online and analyze the entire image information down to time and date. Please dont try to con us vets here kid, its an insult to our intelligence.
Listen and learn from people who are way older than you, your 23 years old, we dont need a 23 year old kid here giving out shit advice and talking shit, again and again.

 

[Roush]

I really loved my first go with test... honestly thought it was one of the best, I thought it was amazing for gaining LBM.

Just look at TRT, I was hypogonadal for a few years (150ng/dl) and went to a total T of around 1,000 with my TRT dose which allowed amazing results in gaining lean mass and dropping body fat.

Are you one of them guys that just don't like huge doses of T? Seems to be a personal preference among some fellas.

test is great when you FIRST jump on it , especially if you had low natty tests to begin with . your body overcompensates and will respond very well with the first run or two of test. but over time its really easy to de-sensitize to it and your body simply adjusts to having high levels of test , it becomes a new norm and then you keep needing higher and higher , but that will not do anything for you other then make you 'spill over' , and all that spill over does is cause negative sides.

At that point you just need test in your cycles as a basis for sexual hormone function, and thats it . its no longer the primary muscle builder , where other chemically modified forms of test can become the primary muscle builders , cause thats what they are designed for to begin with , and they have no real sexual hormone function (like test does)

use test as your base and let the muscle building compounds do the job . at this stage higher and higher amounts of test won't do much for you other then cause negative sides . example, let the Tren bind to the receptors and do the bulk of the work , while the test is only in there to keep your sexual hormones functions going. its not there for the muscle building.
my 2 cents

 

[Gainjin260]

Keeping this in context of the OPs original question being this is his thread.

different body parts require different amounts of recovery time dependent on different factors, muscle size being one of them . A bicep muscle can recover from being overloaded during a training session in about 24-36 hours . But , a quad muscle is much larger and uses much heavier weights to be overloaded and it may require 36-48+ hours to recover.

once a muscle has fully recovered , then it is no longer growing , and if its not stimulated for some time after its done recovering/growing then it can atrophy. so if you hit the bicep muscle monday , and its recovered by wednesday , then after weds its no longer growing , its ready for stimulation again to activate more growth.

bro splits are not that effective for a lot of guys , one reason is because again of different muscle groups requiring different recovery times. Properly formulated programming takes this into account. it also takes into account secondary stimulation (example, your triceps get worked on chest day , so this stimulation has to be accounted for in the programming).

if your bicep can recover in one day , your chest in two days , and your legs in 3 days , then a once per week 1 body part split is not that ideal cause it does not take this into account. also peoples body types and genetics play a very big role . MOST people need volume and frequency for optimal growth . some genetic freaks can grow from hitting one body part per week , sure.
I don't think the OP is one of those guys and he may be the norm and need more frequency.


edit. OMGmike , give the 1 body part per week a try and see how it works . I'm not against it , I've done it myself for over a year before , and I still implement it on occasion dependent on my training cycle (mainly for de-loads, times where I need some rest but still need to hit the gym, or during phases when time is short and i only have a few hours a week to train).

I've got a hard time believing muscles will not only stop growing, but atrophy within 6 days of heavy breakdown in the gym.

Is this what you're implying?

Also, even muscles that we are not actively working are "stimulated" whilst working our primaries. Ie lats from working chest.

I'm in the gym 45min-1:15 max (Except back day where the first 50 min is all deadlifts with lots of rest), 5 days a week. I don't see anyway to hit body parts twice a week without increasing time in the gym.

I'd be interested in having you write out your split with exercises, sets and rest periods because I can't imagine hitting chest 3 times a week and still working the rest of my body.

 

[omgmike1]

BS, not the same person in the front pic and back pic and not the same person in your avi. I can spot it a mile away since I do loads of photography.
and you said that a pic speaks for itself? Oh yes it does buddy. I have software that enables me to download any pic online and analyze the entire image information down to time and date. Please dont try to con us vets here kid, its an insult to our intelligence.
Listen and learn from people who are way older than you, your 23 years old, we dont need a 23 year old kid here giving out shit advice and talking shit, again and again.

Milton, My gym has a varity of lights. Depending on how close I stand to the mirror, it will be more yellow or more white. THOSE ARE 100%%% my pictures and if I removed the head boxes u will see a redhead MALE with a beard, just like my AVI If I choose to put it up. I WOULD post my face pictures on here, but TBH i dont need that kind of rep for the amount of randoms looking on here at faces are the place and crap that goes on the internet, tends to stay.

Either way u said nothing about my physique in terms of negativity, so it'll take it as a prop.

BTW The first pic, me at 138, the back and tris are around 180 something. I was leaner in that stage before my fuck up bulk atm at 194. But Hell I wil be back there in no time.

PS: If u want PROOF and to remove ur statement calling me a fake, i'll email u all my pics w/Face. Same AVI and same face and IF thats not good enough ill take u a back pic with a sticker lol.....but even so the need to do this wtf man.

I worked hard for what I have and yea I'm 23 on gear.


MY advice also is not shit. I am HERE helping people. U have a guy telling u to trash chest 3 times a week? or to do high volume twice PW just because he is on gear??

I posted a link with old users u would know on this board that have had this talk before and all of them pretty much agree 1BP per week is bestt for mass, except calves, need to be hit twice. I dont have no science, just logic as I said above and solid guys experiences over the years on this board. How can u tell me thats shit advice VS what Roush is saying? And on top of all that, the other threads I reply to, I have given solid advice to each on how to handle what they run and use. I don't just tell them off because they are not 25, because half the time they are going to do it anyways. So u confuse me. I am not starting beef with u, I am just lost on the topic my friend.

 

[alphabravo]

test is great when you FIRST jump on it , especially if you had low natty tests to begin with . your body overcompensates and will respond very well with the first run or two of test. but over time its really easy to de-sensitize to it and your body simply adjusts to having high levels of test , it becomes a new norm and then you keep needing higher and higher , but that will not do anything for you other then make you 'spill over' , and all that spill over does is cause negative sides.

At that point you just need test in your cycles as a basis for sexual hormone function, and thats it . its no longer the primary muscle builder , where other chemically modified forms of test can become the primary muscle builders , cause thats what they are designed for to begin with , and they have no real sexual hormone function (like test does)

use test as your base and let the muscle building compounds do the job . at this stage higher and higher amounts of test won't do much for you other then cause negative sides . example, let the Tren bind to the receptors and do the bulk of the work , while the test is only in there to keep your sexual hormones functions going. its not there for the muscle building.
my 2 cents

This makes sense, after awhile on TRT (maybe 6-8 months) my body stopped changing on it's own... makes sense that eventually the body adjusts to the higher test. I have yet to try over 500mg and not sure I would, I agree that the other compounds come into play here. Personally I love running some masteron with my TRT dose here and there.

 

[Roush]

I've got a hard time believing muscles will not only stop growing, but atrophy within 6 days of heavy breakdown in the gym.
Is this what you're implying?

i never put a specific 'time limit' on it of say 6 days . my point was that AFTER a muscle is fully recovered that its ready to be worked and start growing again , but if its NOT stimulated again , then it seeks to go back to 'homeostasis' it has no overload or reason to grow. the last thing the body wants to do is put on more muscle . so it will 'atrophy' the muscle if that muscle is not used (thats a survival mechanism).
my point is don't go too long after a muscle has recovered to work that same muscle again. it needs constant stimulus for adaptations to occur and thus hypertrophy.

Also, even muscles that we are not actively working are "stimulated" whilst working our primaries. Ie lats from working chest..

absolutely . I specific say this in the post that you quoted of mine. saying about proper programming ""takes into account secondary stimulation (example, your triceps get worked on chest day , so this stimulation has to be accounted for in the programming).""

so a triceps day does not only occur on the day that you hit your arms, it also occurs on the days that you do heavy bench presses . a bicep day does not only occur on a day you do bicep curls but also on the day you do rows.
a properly formulated program takes this into account.

this also implies no one really hits one body part per week (even guys that do one body part per week bro splits), especially if they are doing compound exercises. body parts are getting hit multiple times per week (but still not frequent enough, imo , for most people)

I'm in the gym 45min-1:15 max (Except back day where the first 50 min is all deadlifts with lots of rest), 5 days a week. I don't see anyway to hit body parts twice a week without increasing time in the gym.

hmm i don't quite get this. yesterday I was running late for some things and I only had about 40 mins of time to hit the gym . I did a back and a chest spit. I got 14 working sets of back in with 3 different exercises, and 13 working sets of chest in with 3 different exercises . all in about 40 mins time.
i did not have my phone with me . I went from rows for one set , then went right to cable flies for one set then went right back to rows for next set , etc etc.. there was ZERO rest in between sets (for the whole 40 mins). and I got a total of 27 sets in in 40 mins. and it was not all fast paced light weight , I was seated rowing the entire stack for 8 reps. but my back got rest when I went to cable flies. again , i would do one set of each without rest.

so its absolutely possible to increase volume and frequency without increasing a ton more of your time in the gym. you just got to be efficient and learn proper programming.

it also as simple as this -- if your program right now consists of 25 working sets per week for your quads . well you don't need more time in the gym to do more frequent quad work , you simply take that 25 sets from you ONE quad day , and split it up over 3 different days and do say 8 sets on each specified day .
you don't have to have a whole 'leg day' you can have a quad work day for 8 sets along with a lats and traps day.

 

[49ER]

Everybody has time to workout extra if they really want it

 

[Gainjin260]

I guess the issue is that type of intensity isn't in the cards whilst off cycle with hypogonadal test levels. I've done the bro split for years and I'm still making good gains even with shitty test levels.

Ill be on cycle Jan-April and will try your way. Good discussion.

 

[49ER]

I guess the issue is that type of intensity isn't in the cards whilst off cycle with hypogonadal test levels. I've done the bro split for years and I'm still making good gains even with shitty test levels.

Ill be on cycle Jan-April and will try your way. Good discussion.

Any reason you dont stay on trt dose of test?

 

[Roush]

I'd be interested in having you write out your split with exercises, sets and rest periods because I can't imagine hitting chest 3 times a week and still working the rest of my body.

this totally varies dependent on what training block I may be in or micro/meso cycle.

I don't have a 'weekly split' , and so my programming is not designed to fit the gregorian calendars idea of a 7 day work week. our body does not care if its a wednesday or a saturday or whatever. so I don't design programming around that idea. so i don't do chest or back or anything a fixed amount of times per week or on a fixed day of the week

I do body parts a fixed amount of times per 'micro cycle' . my current micro cycle is an 11 workout cycle . that means I have 11 completely separate and unique workouts that need to be done . those 11 workouts take me about 2 weeks to complete. this is a micro cycle. about 5 of these micro cycles for me make up a meso cycle . when one meso cycle is complete , I then modify the training block and change the micro cycles to correspond with the new meso cycle.

I just completed a strength based Meso cycle . that means I had 11 workouts that needed to be done 5 different times with the exercise selection rep ranges and volume all formulated with an emphasis on increasing strength .

what that all looks like over a given week. i don't know , suppose I can break it down . but again my programming is not based on a weeks time , its based on cycles.
I can put my actual routine in a separate post and you can see how over a week or two how body parts are definitely getting hit multiple times per week

 

[Gainjin260]

Any reason you dont stay on trt dose of test?

Trying to regain fertility. Wasn't fertile before TRT, but have been blasting hcg for 5 months. Gonna have part of my nut sliced off on the 22nd. If there are immature sperm we can freeze them and do IVF. Still no sperm in the ejaculate. From the 23rd on its TRT for life.

 

[49ER]

Trying to regain fertility. Wasn't fertile before TRT, but have been blasting hcg for 5 months. Gonna have part of my nut sliced off on the 22nd. If there are immature sperm we can freeze them and do IVF. Still no sperm in the ejaculate. From the 23rd on its TRT for life.

Hope it works for you bro

 

[Gainjin260]

Hope it works for you bro

Thanks. We've got an awesome little girl we adopted at 5 days old- she's 2.5 now. So either way it's ok.

 

[49ER]

Thanks. We've got an awesome little girl we adopted at 5 days old- she's 2.5 now. So either way it's ok.

Kids are awesome i went 13 years no kids figured i was not able to have kids anymore actually hoped i couldnt but now i feel so blessed with my 20 month old baby. The love they give you can brighten up my worst day.

 

[blakey]

Thanks. We've got an awesome little girl we adopted at 5 days old- she's 2.5 now. So either way it's ok.

Cool man good on you

 

[RustySword]

I went through the whole thread, can't speak for everybody, but personally working my chest 2x a week led me to no-where.
I work it once a week, 13 sets total, and I progress alright (still natty).
I actually wonder if I should keep the same workout routine and volume even when I step on a gear.

 

[anzel]

Great discussion here! Roush I am always interested in all the different ways of training that can be done, its hard for me to stick to a program when I wanna try others!
If you can take the time to post up your training with your meso and micro that would be great!

 

[BigSwolenPussy]

Damn, this thread got hijacked like a 1980's flight on PanAM


OP: You said you gained 15 lbs in 9 weeks but aren't growing. I'm confused. If you think that you are going to keep up those gains all of the time, you are mistaken. If it were that easy, bodybuilders would 1000lbs. Everyone is different but I have been in the game for 20+ years and I can't name a single person that I know who makes great gains only working a bodypart once per week. Legs may possibly be an exception if you are doing balls to wall 20-30sets of squats, deads, hack etc. I have had times over the years where life got busy and I tried this. It was better than nothing but I never saw the gains that I wanted and quickly went back to training them 2-3 times per week.
You said yourself that you don't feel like you are working your muscles hard enough. Judging by your post, I would recommend changing your routine. Try high reps sets. I guarantee that if you change up and do you 12-16 sets for 15-20 reps, you wont leave the gym feeling unfulfilled. I have no idea what your daily routine is or how many calories you need for your lifestyle but 4000 calories at 190 lbs should be plenty. The problem that i see is that on a good day you are only getting 800-1000 calories(15-20%) of your diet from protein. If you are going to eat that many calories, Id shoot to add more protein. I just wonder how much fat you are taking in and how accurate your "calorie count" is.

Change your routine and push through it. If you are not growing, you need more calories but honestly, I have a hard time believing that 4000 calories at 190lbs with a hard core workout program isn't going to work for a guy on test.

 

[Ziegler]

Show me your results on test and ill show you results on orals and tren. Hes on what 400mg or 500? And expects muscle in a few weeks? So ya that is what im saying you are correct

Don't compare apples to oranges especially when it comes to a guy running 400 to 500mg's of test.

Everybody knows that Testosterone is an epic muscle builder that is a lot safer and less toxic than what you are doing.

 

[49ER]

Don't compare apples to oranges especially when it comes to a guy running 400 to 500mg's of test.

Everybody knows that Testosterone is an epic muscle builder that is a lot safer and less toxic than what you are doing.

Dude i know what you look like if you were on as low as 200mg of tren ew you would look 10× better with same shitty diet and whatever else you do