Extreeeemly Nervous

[ZeOne]

Hi Guys,

First of all, please let me tell you that i am very happy to have found your forums, you all seem to be pretty friendly and knowledgeable.

I have been bodybuilding for 5 years now, "au natural". This last year, i have been training more seriously than ever. I made pretty good progress strength and shape wise, and still making gains, although marginal.

I am 30 years old, and i weigh 200 Lbs (5'10), roughly at 12%BF. I have my nutrition and my protein intake all under control. ( I take 2g/Lbs/Day worth of whey). I often get compliments about my body. Chicks dig me

This last year, i started noticing at the gym, younger and younger guys having freaking huge sizes. I mean, after training for 5 years, i seen it all, but it seems to me that people are starting juicing younger and younger. These guys get big so fast, it is unbelievable. It take them less than a year to get to a shape and strength it took me two years to obtain natural.

So i decided, now is the right time for me to join the S-club. After doing mucho research and consulting "gym" friends, i basically discovered that there is at least 2 school of thoughts. One which says take only as much juice as needed, the second one that said, since you are killing your system anyway, just go for high dosage.

Personally, to me, to go with lower dosage as a first cycle makes much more sense, since if one sees that the dose is not enough, that one can increment it. While if one take too big of a dose, it is already to late to lower the dose when the side effects appear.

Anyway, here is what i have decided to go with (14 weeks):

• 1 - 14 Week --> 400Mg Deca-Durabolin
• 1 - 2 Week --> 20Mg D-Bol
• 2 - 5 Week --> 30Mg D-Bol
• 5 - 14 Week --> 25Mg Winstrol
  
  **20 mg/day of Nolvadex upon any symptom with gyno

And for PCT

• 1 - 4 Week --> 40Mg Nolvadex

What really scares me to death is the dreaded gyno. I dont want to look like a muscular dude with female breasts! I asked if i could run 20mg/day of nolva during my cycle, and the reply was that if i wanted to do that, then basically it is of no use that i take the D-bol.

I already bought some D-Bol and the blue pills are staring right at my face. My first schedueld injection of the Deca-Durabolin is next Thursday. I feel excited and nervous at the same time.

Can i start taking the 20Mg of D-Bol right away, 3 days before my first Deca-D injection? or will that mess up something?

What do you guys think about that cycle? ( please do not forget that this is my first ever cycle, i only took creatine before ).

Thanks for your honest replies guys, and sorry for the long post.

 

[Trammelly]

what's up bro & welcome to the site. there are lots of people that know there stuff. i'm really not a pro at steroids yet, having only taken 3 cycles. but for being your first cycle i wouldnt stack other roids with your first cycle because if you have a reaction, how will you know what is causing it, and also how will you know which steroid you made your gains from, etc... i made a mistake and made a deca only cycle for my first and i had a little bit of deca dick for a while and i wished i wouldve ran test as my first cycle. so (in my opinion) i would suggest this for example as a first cycle instead of the one you have chosen: test-300-500mg/week for 10 weeks or eq-400-500mg/week for 10 weeks, just something along those lines. most of everyone grow like crazy off of test but some people react different to some roids than others, and from what i read i'm guessing you are bulking up, so make sure your diet is running right and you could get amazing results off of test and a good bulking diet. and for post cycle therapy (pct) id just use Clomid starting at 300mg/day 1, 100mg/day 2-11, and 50mg/day 12-21.

but overall bro, if you insist on running what you are going to, which IMO i wouldnt do it, but just be smart about your choices because STEROIDS are no joke.

so best of luck bro and im sure youll get the best advice from alot of advanced users...

peace

 

[cubanojoe]

For your first cycle just run test only at 300 - 500 mg a week and don't forget to take HCG so your nuts don't shrink

 

[Rokomuscle1]

Read this thread I started a few months ago...some good advice..

http://www.steroidology.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51758

 

[Johny J]

no offense, but that cycle kinda blows. for numerous reasons. However, it isnt your fault as to choosing it, because if you have been reading up on steroid profiles those would seem like great choices.

However, like stated above..
Test at no more then 500mg per week for 10 weeks
hcg during the cycle if you would like. Have nolva and or letrozol on hand if you are so worried about gyno. Letro being the bomb in my opinion.
have clomid for PCT.

And no, the higher dose "just for the fuck of it" idea is stupid in my opinion. There is a point of diminishing returns. Trust me homeboy, 500mg of test will do you proper.
Personally, i dont think i will go over that ever. no need as of yet.

 

[GymLift]

no offense, but that cycle kinda blows. for numerous reasons. However, it isnt your fault as to choosing it, because if you have been reading up on steroid profiles those would seem like great choices.

However, like stated above..
Test at no more then 500mg per week for 10 weeks
hcg during the cycle if you would like. Have nolva and or letrozol on hand if you are so worried about gyno. Letro being the bomb in my opinion.
have clomid for PCT.

And no, the higher dose "just for the fuck of it" idea is stupid in my opinion. There is a point of diminishing returns. Trust me homeboy, 500mg of test will do you proper.
Personally, i dont think i will go over that ever. no need as of yet.

Good advice.

"since you are killing your system anyway, just go for high dosage." <- If somebody makes this claim, then that is a strong indicator that they don't know jack about gear. For example, it only makes sense to balance the gains against the sides. e.g. The cycle that you mentioned might give you gyno that can't be controlled with an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) or Nolvadex. It might also give you deca dick. Not a good cycle. Go with testosterone only, 250-500mg/week for 8-12 weeks.

 

[ZeOne]

Thanks for the replies...

Thank you all for the replies. I never knew that there was so many testosterone advocates. I also got the same replies from different sources and forums. Everybody is recommending i switch the Deca to Test.

The reason i decided to go with Deca in the first place was to tell you the truth, because two of guys at the gym ( including the gym owner, which is a national bbuilding pro and the other is a bbuilding coach ) said that the "Deca, D-bol" cycle is the classic all timer. They also said that gains on the Deca-Durabolin are slow but steady, and the muscle mass one puts on, can be kept given proper PCT, training and nutrition. I also have been told that the deca durabolin is very "safe" ( of course all relative ) and the side effects are minimal.

So from there i visited many web sites that seem to confirm their saying. Heck, even in "Anabolics 2005" one of the "Beginners cycle" is exactly that: D-Bol and Deca-Durabolin. Everything i researched hinted that a Deca-Durabolin cycle was it for me. Safe, Effective, lasting gains, and i if i add the d-bol, then i get faster results and strength until the deca "kicks in".

I guess i was too focused on researching the Deca and the D-bol that i did not give the test cycle any more attention, or at least the attention it deserves. What i did conclude though with the findings i made on test is that the side effects and risks are that much greater with it than without it, and that the gains withholdings post cycle are minimal, even with best of efforts.

Since it easily converts directly to Estrogen, the chance getting water retention, fat retention (bye bye muscle definition) and gyno is that much greater. I do not want to look like a fat balloon with huge tits. The dreaded impotence of Deca, at worst, i can live with for a few weeks, at worst, i can take some viagra or similar ( would that even work? ), but bitch tits for life, scary

I know that all of the side effects can appear even with the relatively safe "Deca-Durabolin", or they might not appear at all even with the test. But using the test, for me, elevates the chances i can get them.

Anyway, I did not order any of the stuff yet, the only thing i paid for is 15$ for 25 D-Bols that i have in front of me as i am typing these lines.

Can anyone please explain in their own words, their reason for the test over Deca for example?

I know from my limited research on testosterone that the T. hormone comes under several forms some which are Cypionate, Enanthate, Propionate, Suspension.

What test would you guys recommend? and why?

Thanks all!

 

[fr8tren]

welcome to the Dark Side...

as far as gyno goes, have your Nolva around, but you will feel it coming before you will ever see "bitch tits". speaking from experience

 

[Trevdog]

Your cycle would be much better if you did add in some test, even at a level as low as 250 mgs. per week. You could either do that or just take deca out and run test at 500 mgs. per week. dbol is optional.

Test does not lead to gains any less "keepable" than deca or any other steroid. The only time you have trouble keeping gains is when they are water gains, or when you've gained more muscle than your body can naturally maintain. For example, pro bodybuilders generally stay on steroids all the time because if they go off, their bodies will return to their natural genetic limits, which would render them uncompetitive.

While test can aromatize, as dbol can, it is unlikely that you would have any estrogen related problems at such a low dose (e.g. 250 mgs. per week). Personally I can run at least 1000 mgs. of test per week without using any anti estrogen. I do retain water at that dose, but no gyno symptoms. Everyone is different, but I would guesstimate that most people can handle 500 mgs. per week with no problem or need for an antiestrogen. However, everyone should have countermeasures on hand in case of a problem.

Test really should be the base of any cycle. Deca may be added for extra anabolism (and sometimes to help lubricate sore joints) and has the advantage of being very unlikely to aromatize into estrogen. However, it is only about half as potent as test on a milligram per milligram basis.

I would recommend test cypionate or enanthate, they are basically interchangeable. They have relatively long half lives which means you can inject them twice per week and keep your hormone levels relatively stable. Test propinate will raise those levels more quickly, but they will quickly spike and decline, which means injections should be at least every other day with prop.

 

[DADAWG]

listen to trevdog bro . you have been given some lousy info which isnt your fault . as for deca giving slower steadier gains thats because its less potent than test so why not just run a low dose test cycle for slower steadier gains and at a low dose unless you are EXTREMELY sensitive to estrogen you shouldnt bloat any worse than with the deca . another bit of misinformation is about nolva ruining takeing dbol , nolva blocks estrogen from attaching to breast tissue it WILL NOT hurt you gains .

 

[ZeOne]

Thanks all for your replies. There is indeed much food for thought.

To tell you the truth the reason the winstrol was chosen is because it is known for it's muscle "hardening" abilities. I mean for the summer time, i am not looking to add that much bulk, maybe more lean muscle, "hard" body look.

In your individual experience guys, does the testosterone hold a lot of water? Do you loose definition? I dont want to be all puffy

So much to think about....


About the Nolva, I always beleived in prevention rather than repairing a problem. You do not know how much i want to take 20mg of Nolva dialy, but everyone is discouraging me. But the weird part is that they all say, if symptoms appear take 20mg daily. Why do not everyone take the 20mg daily, you know, just in case?