GYNO Starting

[TestRocks]

Ok I have been on Test E @ 500mg/week.

The first sign of gyno was at week 4. Now I am at week 6 and I have been taking Tamox(40mg X 4 days) from (ar-r) and at first I thought it might be working but now nipples still puffy and lump still present behind nipple. They are not sore like they were before the Tamox.

Should I try to get some Letro or Aromasin?
What dose of either?

Also what is the shipping time at ology? 2-3days?

Should I stop with the Test and start PCT 2 weeks from now?

How long before it is irreversible?

 

[DeadnBloated]

letro will shut it down if the nolvadex isn't working. I had gyno that was puffing out big time with hard lumps...I ran letro @ 2.5mg for about a week and also some pramipexole (anti-prolactin) My shit is nice and flat now..no lumps, nothing...it's like I had surgery.

I wouldn't stop your cycle just yet. It would be like you wasted 6 weeks. After the gyno subsides with letro, then switch to aromosin @ 12.5 mg ED during your cycle. You can continue to use it during your PCT as well. Another great place for your ancillary drugs is RXhealthdrugs...I've used them, and alot of stuff is from Geneza Pharm. It takes 10 days to get to my house from Europe. Remember your Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) during your cycle if you don't have it already.

 

[TestRocks]

Thanks Dead, would I need pram with a test only cycle or would that matter. I am thinking of Letro from ology because I need it faster than 10 days I think. How does the liquid Letro compare to the RXhealthdrugs pills. But I need aromasin so I may just order it all from RXhealth.

Anymore thoughts?

 

[macro]

while its less common to have prolactin issues on test only cycles, you are likely either a high plasma or local producer of prolactin. the tamox makes it stop hurting because it lower igf-1, but while its doing this (in cases like yours) its actually making the gyno worse or doing nothing.

have you had blood work done? would be interesting to see if such predisposition is apparent in blood or solely due to local (paracrine) action.

but agree with deadnbloated... prolactin elevation or upregulation are the most likely cause of your presentation.
Pramipexole and prolactin suppression: prevention vs. treatment dosing - AFboard

read through it, and the host of other threads on the forum. so you can make an informed decision. cabergoline (cabaser tablets is another option, also effective. though the more feedback that comes in, the more that pramipexole seems to dominate)
as a note- because of the prevalence of prolactin issues, pretty much reccomend against tamoxifen during cycle (am not really a fan of it at all, but as a primer its decent, though toremifene may be a better choice)

thread on pramipexole treatment and prevention dosing (self authored )

 

[TestRocks]

Thank macro. I did the research to start with and now I get all these new drugs to what I thought is simple problems.

Everything I was reading said on Test only cycle "have Nolvadex on hand". Well I did and now I am told I need something else.

 

[macro]

generally with test only cycles, nolvadex is OK (not the best, but generally effective). The puffyness and hard tissue may even go away with nolva, but when there is puffyness its less likely.

people often give advice that they dont understand. Like "dont use anything till you get the gyno"... NO... thats really bad advice. use an Aromatase inhibitor (AI), preferably exemestane or AIFM (otc). you can even low dose, if you want more estrogen (the concept of estrogen related anabolism is one of much contention--- what is not of contention is that excess estrogen is the cause of almost all the side effects of test based cycles). even just moderating that estrogen with a low-moderate dose Aromatase inhibitor (AI) can make a significant difference.

nolva on the other hand suppresses Igf-1, so using it as a preventative is not as reccomendable... plus many of its effects are estrogenic...

now the reason for reccomending the pramipexole (or other dopaminergic) is because of the puffyness. Since you are not using an Aromatase inhibitor (AI), which would help with prolactin from estrogen but because of the extent of the flare direct suppression is reccomended.

And you are using nolva, which may or may not help, depending on a lot of factors. because of the mixed er activity, under some circumstances nolva just wont be doing much, in others it will work fine (because its actions relies heavily on receptor distribution and regulation-- which can be different because of genetics or other factors)....

are you by chance taking any medications--- OTC or prescribed? especially SSRI's?

 

[rpwhit777]

Buy a bra!!!!!!!! Just kidding bro, I been there, the advice you have been given above is a jem of wisdom follow it and the tittiess will disappear,

Personally I like 50 mg proviron 20 mg nolvadex daily.......

 

[Avenger101]

letro will shut it down if the nolvadex isn't working. I had gyno that was puffing out big time with hard lumps...I ran letro @ 2.5mg for about a week and also some pramipexole (anti-prolactin) My shit is nice and flat now..no lumps, nothing...it's like I had surgery.

I wouldn't stop your cycle just yet. It would be like you wasted 6 weeks. After the gyno subsides with letro, then switch to aromosin @ 12.5 mg ED during your cycle. You can continue to use it during your post cycle therapy (pct) as well. Another great place for your ancillary drugs is RXhealthdrugs...I've used them, and alot of stuff is from Geneza Pharm. It takes 10 days to get to my house from Europe. Remember your Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) during your cycle if you don't have it already.

so then is letro more effective at combating gyno then adex? i have had the same problem with my nipples and haven't tried either yet, which would you reccomend

 

[macro]

Thank macro. I did the research to start with and now I get all these new drugs to what I thought is simple problems.

Everything I was reading said on Test only cycle "have Nolvadex on hand". Well I did and now I am told I need something else.

this advice is commonly given, that does not necessarily make it good advice. Its not really bad advice, because with test only nolvadex generally "works". But it is certainly not ideal and its use as a gyno preventative can yield as many issues as it prevents.

what you really want to do is run an aromatase inhibitor, with strong general preference for exemestane (not that some people will not prefer letrozole or anastrozole). Even just a low to moderate dose (depending on need- and this will vary) for those that want some of the estrogenic influence (primarily bloat for mass).

you on the other hand, dont want that. You have concurrent prolactin issues, perhaps driven primarily by estrogen or perhaps not. But to have that level of response definitely puts you in a high risk category for other issues from estrogen and prolactin, primarily male breast cancer and prostate cancer. (these are known and highly linked, there are certainly others that dont yet have the same level of linkage.) High prolactin and estrogen also presents high risk of autoimmune diseases.

now, cycling for most people, even those that let estrogen run rampant, is not excessively likely to present a tremendous increase in risk (your response, would indicate that you do fall into a category that might see a much higher risk) but there is some.

 

[TREN.PIMP]

i like arimadex 1 mg eod

 

[baldie99]

i had great success with 1.25mgs of letro/day, took care of the puffyness,sensitivity and even the little lump I was getting. only down side was that my sex drive has gone down, but still able to get him up no problem. 1.25mgs may be too low for you, but you'll have to figure that out on your own.