How I prepare for that yearly checkup with the local Uro

lucius11

Novice
I just thought I would post a follow up on my yearly checkup with my local Uro. The short answer: he is happy, no changes at all. And ... I'm good to go for another year. Your mileage may vary ...

The goal: present the local doc(s) with nice clean blood work so that they do not mess with anything or otherwise conduct an investigation into my TRT. My local Uro sends my blood test results to my regular doc. If either doc sees an issue, they start asking questions, order more tests and try to "fix" the problem. This is what we want to prevent. No good can come from either doc messing with my TRT protocol. If I do my job right, they should never see any problems. I'm not trying to fake anything here. I'm just trying to keep my ducks in a row.

I typically run 100mg 2x per week and 0.5AI Eod (no HCG). The basic issues with this large of a dose are: 1) T levels are too high for the local docs; 2) Hemoglobin/Hematocrit can get too high - blood gets thick very fast; and 3) liver can get a bit stressed - perhaps from heavy protein intake, too much exercise or TRT in general (who knows).

My local Uro checks Hemoglobin, Hematocrit, PSA levels and does a prostate exam, liver function, T levels (Free and Total). My Uro is looking for T levels in the 400-800 range (from his perspective 600 is pretty much perfect) and Hemo 15 or under. I'm sure my local doc is looking for the same basic levels. These are all good things to check. I also want all these numbers to be good (particularly at checkup time). Of course, running 100mg 2x per week means I have to adjust the timing of my blood test and stay on top of the Hemo levels.

Here are the results from the blood test two weeks ago:
Test Total: ~600 ng/dl (250-1100 ng/dl)
Test Free: ~100 pg/ml (35-155 pg/ml)
Hemoglobin: 14.2 (13.2 - 17.1 g/dl)
Hematocrit: 43 (38.5 - 50%)
All other numbers were nicely in the normal range - liver panel, CBC, Prolactin. BP was 130 over 70. Pretty much everything is on-track.

T levels
I know from my own blood work that if I pin 100mg and wait exactly 8 days, my T levels will be about 700 (2013 - T level for local Uro was ~680). I started adjusting the T levels 1 month early and dropped the dose to 80mg 2x per week in an effort to hit that 600 number. After being on this dose for a month, I am ready for my yearly blood test. Basically, I skip one injection and wait one extra day - then do blood work. I pin on Thursday, skip my Monday injection and then do my blood work on Friday morning. Net result, the T levels were pretty much exactly 600 this year - bingo!

Hemo
My Hemo was ~17 about 6 weeks before my yearly blood test. This is not a good thing from a timing standpoint. I had planned to donate right before my blood test, but could not risk waiting another month. Basically, I screwed up and forgot to donate a month earlier.

Trust me on this, if your Uro and/or your regular doctor sees your Hemo is 17+ you are in trouble (plus it's bad for your health). My Uro sends all his blood test results to my regular doc. So they would have to take steps to fix the problem. You can't blame them, they would just be doing their job. You may be able to talk your way out of it (twice actually - once with your Uro and then again with your regular doc) but they may just try to cut your dose or otherwise mess with the protocol. You just don't want to go there.

So I did what I had to do. I ended up donating twice within 6 weeks. The last donation was 10 days before my blood test. And the Hemo came in at 14.2 - bingo! This is what the docs want to see, and all is right with the world.

I know this is not in strict accordance with the 56 day rule. But a single donation was not going to get this done. I would have come in around 16 with just a single donation. That would have been a tad high and the docs would start asking questions. A double red donation with Hemo at 17+ is probably a no go as well (machine does not work well with thick blood). So two single donations about 5 weeks apart were needed to get the job done. This first donation knocked the levels down to about 15+ which rises to about 16 within a month. The second donation drops the levels to 14+, just in time for the blood work. Donation every 2 months keeps the levels between 14.5 and 16.5.

I don't recommend two donations this quickly, but when you are on TRT you are making a ton of red blood cells. I doubt the 56 day rule was written with TRT in mind. Normal folks don't make red blood cells at the same rate. If I had just donated on schedule, this would not have been needed.

There actually was one blood value that that was a little off. Red blood cell distribution width (RDW) is a measure of red blood cell size variation. My RDW was just a little over 15 and the reference range is 11-15%. My Uro never even mentioned it. It could have something to do with donating blood fairly often, perhaps some extra "new" or smaller red blood cells in the mix pushed the percentage a bit higher. High RDW can also be an indication of iron deficiency anemia. With all the blood donations, the iron stores probably do take a hit. Not sure, but this is all the more reason to stay on top of donations and not violate the 56 day rule.

Liver values
All the liver values were dead solid perfect this year. I take 600mg NAC twice a day. I also try to stay well hydrated. This seems to do the trick. I did have some elevated levels of Alkaline Phosphatase. This happened on several occasions, I'm not sure why. I also had some slightly elevated AST and ALT on occasion (I saw all this on my own blood work). Once I saw this, I started taking NAC. The levels have been perfect ever since.

Next blood test for the local docs in one year - end of 2015. Of course, I will run my own blood work when needed just to keep everything in check.
 
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An alternative to donating whole blood at multiple locations, you may be able to donate platelets. At my blood bank, you can donate platelets 3 days after donating whole blood, and do platelets again one week later.

I knocked my HCT down from 53 to 46 in about 2 weeks this way early on in TRT.
 
Too much adex....imo for a Test only TRT protocol.
Whats your Estradiol level?
I never saw it listed in your post.
Take it easy with the blood donations..
Unless you know your bone marrow is in over drive from your T dose.
 
100 mg twice a week is a hefty dose if you are having so much trouble with Hemo elevating on you.
I'm not to sure how accurate the donation centre gadgets are in measuring HCT. I've seen my HCT at 50 % with Hemo of 17....blood labs a week earlier came in at 46% HCT with 15 Hemo.
How many days from shot are these levels of 600 ?
 
Too much adex....imo for a Test only TRT protocol.
Whats your Estradiol level?

Agreed - it's a lot of AI. If I cut the AI, the E2 tends to go out of range on the high side. With this AI dose, E2 is in the 25-30 range on the regular test every single time. Joints seem happy, no sides that I am aware off. I have had the BF as low as 12.5% (according to Bod Pod) - no help with aromatization. This is just what my body does.

I know my hemo goes up 1 point per month. I tried a lower T dose but did not feel as good. I varied the timing a bit and tried letting my T levels rise and fall a bit more (e.g., pinning once per week) but had trouble controlling E2 - and the Hemo was still rising fast.

Is there something in particular you are worried about when it comes to the AI dose. I know AI's are not that good for you but is there a particular blood level or organ that I should watch.

At this point, I know my liver is happy - all levels are good. I also know my cholesterol is about 165 - HDL and LDL are both fine. I also know my blood sugar levels are just fine. BF is probably about 17% which is decent for a guy in his mid 50s. I can move the body composition any way I want by making minor adjustments in diet and the amount of cardio. From my perspective, I'm not feeling the need to change much of anything in terms of TRT dose, exercise routine or diet - it's all good. BP was 130 over 70 this am and heart rate was 59. I'm just not seeing any problems and neither is my Uro.

100 mg twice a week is a hefty dose if you are having so much trouble with Hemo elevating on you.

Yes it is, no argument there. It's about the most I can reasonably do on a long term basis. I have run less T but I don't seem to feel quite as good (perhaps it's all in my head). This is the dose that seems to be the best tradeoff for me - at least for now.

I'm not to sure how accurate the donation centre gadgets are in measuring HCT.

Yep, I have noticed that they can be off as much as a whole point compared to actual blood work. In this case, we are looking at actual blood work. I have done a bunch of blood test so I know what my Hemo levels do at my regular TRT dose. At this dose, I need to donate every 2 months to make all the numbers work. I do not know what is happening to my ferritin levels, but I will do some blood work at some point and find out. I have no symptoms of any anemia, none at all. I fact I have no "symptoms" of any kind - it's all good, no complaints. I just feel good every day.

How many days from shot are these levels of 600 ?
8 days from last pin. This sets my levels perfect for my local doc. Then I go back to my regular protocol of 100mg, 2x per week. This sets the T levels are at the upper end of the normal range.
 
Well..... sounds like you know what you are doing!
Just keep an eye on estradiol in time it may lower some more if u stick to that dose.
I tried 1/4 tab of adex a few times with 60 mg T E3D as well as HCG 350 IU E3D. ..
felt runned down the day after adex dose. My T levels were at 830 ng/dl on that protocol. Felt good on that dose.
I have some b.f. not to sure what my estradiol was cause it was not tested on that protocol adjustment.
 
Look into your ferritin levels my friend. Its not good if they are low.
There's medical articles out there that warn against excessive donations because they can bring down ferritin too low...it could cause a stroke.
Whats your peak level on docs protocol ? 48 hours from shot?
 
Look into your ferritin levels my friend. Its not good if they are low.
There's medical articles out there that warn against excessive donations because they can bring down ferritin too low ...it could cause a stroke.
Whats your peak level on docs protocol ? 48 hours from shot?

Thanks for the comments. I definitely have this dose dialed in, at least enough to keep my docs happy. I don't measure peak levels, but they have to be up there. At 3.5 days I'm at about 1000. I have enjoyed riding this wave of 200mg per week for almost 3 years. It has made a world of difference.

I probably don't need to run 200mg per week any more. Any symptoms that I had from low T more than 3 years ago are long gone. Mentally, it’s just not that easy to cut back since you get used to the routine. After this last battle to get the Hemo in range and in the interest of long term health, I think it's probably a good time to drop the dose back and see how that goes. No sense in burning the candle at both ends - anymore.

I'll check those ferritin levels next time I do my own blood work. I would not be surprised if they are at the low end. I don’t want to run those down. It sure would be nice to donate less often. So far, I have not found an acceptable dose that is low enough (where I still feel good) to make a meaningful change in red blood cell production. But I'm running right up against that 56 day rule so I have to deal with this.

I have also had some high TSH levels (e.g. 5.25 – ref: 0.45 – 4.5), but with T4 in the normal range. Apparently, test results like this suggest the thyroid is OK, but should be monitored. I feel no symptoms of low thyroid function-yet. Not all tests come back with a high TSH so I’ll just have to see if this gets worse.

All in all, the numbers are pretty solid. Nothing to complain about. Perhaps if I back the dose down, some of these levels like Ferritin and TSH will have a chance to reset a bit.
 
Half this stuff is in your head Lucius.
Ha, that's fair enough ... I do wish this was true. Most of the levels I mentioned were because I already tangled with the local doc over them. Just trying to save folks from the same pain.

I don't really mind that the levels are off a bit, I just don't want to show up with blood work that causes the doc to order a bunch of extra tests. Because I have done this on several occasions and it sucked. The levels are off because I was on TRT and or GH, GH peptides or Var or something like that - not because I was actually sick.
 
donating platelets doesn't work well cause then you have to wait longer.

Nice to see you posting and doing awesome as usual lucius!
 
donating platelets doesn't work well cause then you have to wait longer.

Nice to see you posting and doing awesome as usual lucius!

The rules vary by organization, but at mine you can donate platelets 3 days after whole blood and every 7 days thereafter, and it does not extend the interval to the next whole blood donation.
 
If a lot of guys were realistic and/or not have experimented with running prolonged supraphysiological Testosterone levels, their bodies would be able to feel well in the mid to upper normal range for T which would minimize the amount of blood donations required to keep HCT down.
Those 1200 ng/dl T level guys are really losing in the long run. That level is unsustainable and they are getting their receptors use to it.
Wtf?????
They gonna run Test at 1200 ng/dl for 40 + years well into their 80's ???
Is that normal???
C'mon
 
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LUCIUS <> Very glad to see you timed everything right & that you are achieving the results you want overall. Just like when you helped me in my recent thread, this thread was informative & inspirational. Thank you for your input!

:)
 
Thanks for all the input guys. I really do feel good these days. TRT has made such a huge difference.

Those 1200 ng/dl T level guys are really losing in the long run.

Yeah, I'm in that boat. I'm dialing it back to 80mg 2x per week. This is not a small dose either, but I have to start somewhere.
 
Thanks for all the input guys. I really do feel good these days. TRT has made such a huge difference.



Yeah, I'm in that boat. I'm dialing it back to 80mg 2x per week. This is not a small dose either, but I have to start somewhere.

70 mg E3D had me at 1277 TT for trough....day before next shot.
Lol
 
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