How much Aromasin?

[Low-T-Hoss]

Currently I am on Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) mono therapy (800 iu 3x per week). I'm getting good T results but am struggling to control my Estradiol levels and the sides that go with high E. I had sides with arimidex and letrozole so I talked my dr into letting me try Aromasin.

Tried 25mg E2D but my E stayed high (78 (7.6-42.6)). Dr increased my dosage to 25mg ED. Just got my blood work back and my E only dropped to 72. My T was higher than it normally is at 661 (348-1197). The doctor wants me to increase the Aromasin to 50mg per day. I've never heard of anyone taking that much on a regular basis. Just looking for some reassurance that taking this much Aromasin on a daily basis for potentially forever is ok?

Not sure what else to do? Maybe drop Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) some? These high e sides suck. Thanks all.

 

[Megatron28]

Just wondering... Why are you only taking hcg? And what sides did you experience with the other AI's?

 

[halfwit]

Currently I am on Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) mono therapy (800 iu 3x per week). I'm getting good T results but am struggling to control my Estradiol levels and the sides that go with high E. I had sides with arimidex and letrozole so I talked my dr into letting me try Aromasin.

Tried 25mg E2D but my E stayed high (78 (7.6-42.6)). Dr increased my dosage to 25mg ED. Just got my blood work back and my E only dropped to 72. My T was higher than it normally is at 661 (348-1197). The doctor wants me to increase the Aromasin to 50mg per day. I've never heard of anyone taking that much on a regular basis. Just looking for some reassurance that taking this much Aromasin on a daily basis for potentially forever is ok?

Not sure what else to do? Maybe drop Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) some? These high e sides suck. Thanks all.

How long were you at 25mg ED? Exemestane takes a good week or so to even show a drop in E2, so hopefully you've had some time at that dose before he bumped you up. That's pushing AAS cycle doses of an AI...

 

[Low-T-Hoss]

Just wondering... Why are you only taking hcg? And what sides did you experience with the other AI's?

Can not find a doctor that will work with my insurance and prescribe T + Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) + Aromatase inhibitor (AI). I'm 33 and having kids is very important to me. I'm trying Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) mono before going down the T path.

Arimidex: high anxiety, chest pressure, dry cough, jittery
Letrozole: impotence even with low doses and low dose cialis

 

[Low-T-Hoss]

How long were you at 25mg ED? Exemestane takes a good week or so to even show a drop in E2, so hopefully you've had some time at that dose before he bumped you up. That's pushing AAS cycle doses of an AI...

I was on 25 mg (1 pill) E2D for 4 full weeks prior to blood work first. When E came back high, my doctor increased the dosage to 25 mg every day. I did that for 4 weeks and had the bloods done this past Friday. E is still high and he wants me to double my dosage again.....but I'm not sure. It seems like a lot for every day for the rest of my life (possibly).

My dr has no experience with Aromasin. I had to talk him into letting me try it....but how could he then know what dose is right?

 

[halfwit]

I was on 25 mg (1 pill) E2D for 4 full weeks prior to blood work first. When E came back high, my doctor increased the dosage to 25 mg every day. I did that for 4 weeks and had the bloods done this past Friday. E is still high and he wants me to double my dosage again.....but I'm not sure. It seems like a lot for every day for the rest of my life (possibly).

My dr has no experience with Aromasin. I had to talk him into letting me try it....but how could he then know what dose is right?

He's doing what most do, get a blood test after a period of time has elapsed and see if it's effective. You just may be one of those that are very susceptible to aromatization. Are you on the heavy side?

 

[Low-T-Hoss]

My E prior to taking anything was 68 with a T in the low 300's (out of range). I think I have had higher E levels most of my adult life. I am heavier. I'm a little over 6 foot and currently weight 278. At my heaviest about 1.5 years ago I was around 340 and very unhealthy. I lost 60lbs in about 8 months and have stalled out since. Doctors found low T while doing my yearly bloodwork and me complaining of bedroom issues and loss of energery (even with all the weight loss). I've got about 40-50lbs I want to lose prior to my wedding in late January of 2014 but can not get this thing dialed in. I work out, but they are weak workouts and finding the energy is tough.

I've thought about asking my current doctor to let me try T Cyp in the therapy, but even if he said yes, I'm still going to have this high E issue and I dont know what to do about it. I'm very tentative to try 50mg of Aromasin ED.

Thinking about giving Arimidex or letro another try. I only tried Arimidex for about 3 weeks and had to stop. Letro was only 2 weeks (which was long enough with those sides).

So.....back to the question......thoughts on taking 50mg of Aromasin a day to control high E?

 

[halfwit]

My E prior to taking anything was 68 with a T in the low 300's (out of range). I think I have had higher E levels most of my adult life. I am heavier. I'm a little over 6 foot and currently weight 278. At my heaviest about 1.5 years ago I was around 340 and very unhealthy. I lost 60lbs in about 8 months and have stalled out since. Doctors found low T while doing my yearly bloodwork and me complaining of bedroom issues and loss of energery (even with all the weight loss). I've got about 40-50lbs I want to lose prior to my wedding in late January of 2014 but can not get this thing dialed in. I work out, but they are weak workouts and finding the energy is tough.

I've thought about asking my current doctor to let me try T Cyp in the therapy, but even if he said yes, I'm still going to have this high E issue and I dont know what to do about it. I'm very tentative to try 50mg of Aromasin ED.

Thinking about giving Arimidex or letro another try. I only tried Arimidex for about 3 weeks and had to stop. Letro was only 2 weeks (which was long enough with those sides).

So.....back to the question......thoughts on taking 50mg of Aromasin a day to control high E?

Well, from what I understand Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) definitely does aromatize and could be part of the problem here. Yes, 50mg can most certainly reduce your E2 even more, but I would start to push for the test personally as it is thought that long-term Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) use can cause a desensitization of the hypothalamus. I don't know if this is true to be honest, but I have seen it come up quite a bit so there may be truth to it. The nice thing about aromasin is that it is one of the more "gentle" AI's in that it won't typically outright crush your E2 while letro most certainly can. I got sleepy on adex, so I can understand sides being an issue.

 

[JimiThing]

Stane is underdosed by many. First off it should be dosed at least daily preferably 2x/day , second off it needs to be taken with dietary fats-this increases the absorption of stane 40%. Just those 2 changes can make a world of difference.

 

[My_Pitch27]

Stane is underdosed by many. First off it should be dosed at least daily preferably 2x/day , second off it needs to be taken with dietary fats-this increases the absorption of stane 40%. Just those 2 changes can make a world of difference.

What type of fats would u recommend? I'm going to be jumping on aromasin after my letro protocol.... Plan on doing 12.5mg 2x day 8-10hrs apart....
Thanks!

 

[Low-T-Hoss]

Well, from what I understand Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) definitely does aromatize and could be part of the problem here. Yes, 50mg can most certainly reduce your E2 even more, but I would start to push for the test personally as it is thought that long-term Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) use can cause a desensitization of the hypothalamus. I don't know if this is true to be honest, but I have seen it come up quite a bit so there may be truth to it. The nice thing about aromasin is that it is one of the more "gentle" AI's in that it won't typically outright crush your E2 while letro most certainly can. I got sleepy on adex, so I can understand sides being an issue.

Thanks for your contribution. I'll talk to my doctor about trying test with the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and Aromatase inhibitor (AI). He said no last time but given we are 5 months into treatment with no real improvements....he might be more open to it.

 

[Low-T-Hoss]

Stane is underdosed by many. First off it should be dosed at least daily preferably 2x/day , second off it needs to be taken with dietary fats-this increases the absorption of stane 40%. Just those 2 changes can make a world of difference.

Did not know about consuming with dietary fats. I am taking 25mg in the morning right when I wake up.....typically on an empty stomach. Doctor said that would be fine. I take it with my daily allergy medicine. The pill is tiny and splitting it is a pain in the butt.....would it be ok to just take it once but with dietary fats? What would you recommend take it with?

 

[halfwit]

Thanks for your contribution. I'll talk to my doctor about trying test with the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and Aromatase inhibitor (AI). He said no last time but given we are 5 months into treatment with no real improvements....he might be more open to it.

Good luck man! Let us know how it goes.

 

[JimiThing]

Did not know about consuming with dietary fats. I am taking 25mg in the morning right when I wake up.....typically on an empty stomach. Doctor said that would be fine. I take it with my daily allergy medicine. The pill is tiny and splitting it is a pain in the butt.....would it be ok to just take it once but with dietary fats? What would you recommend take it with?

I would do it t 12.5mg - 2x/day but if you wanna ry one 25mg dose first then try it. It may work fine for you-who knows. As far as what fats its not that important but typically i take mine with fish oil caps in am and in pm i take with a small handful (small being key) of almonds, peanuts or walnuts.

 

[totalburnout]

Just wondering... Why are you only taking hcg? And what sides did you experience with the other AI's?

This doctor may follow Dr. Shippen's protocol (author of The Testosterone Syndrome). You'll find different doctors that follow different trains of thought. Urologists also seem to really like hCG. What sort of doctor is your doctor?

Here's some more info on that sort of protocol.
A Primer on Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and Dr. Shippen's Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) Protocol (2 of 8) (hypothalamus depression nail testicular down) - Mombu the Medicine Forum

 

[totalburnout]

Well, from what I understand Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) definitely does aromatize and could be part of the problem here. .

hCG aromatizes much more readily than T.

 

[Low-T-Hoss]

This doctor may follow Dr. Shippen's protocol (author of The Testosterone Syndrome). You'll find different doctors that follow different trains of thought. Urologists also seem to really like hCG. What sort of doctor is your doctor?

Here's some more info on that sort of protocol.
A Primer on Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and Dr. Shippen's Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) Protocol (2 of 8) (hypothalamus depression nail testicular down) - Mombu the Medicine Forum

Thanks everyone for your advise. Yes....this is a urologist who specializes in fertility and dabbles in Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) as well. He originally had me on weekly shots of 5000iu's. Obviously a fertility dose. I talked him into lower doses...he thought for sure my T would drop and it wouldn't work....but my T levels have stayed around 650-675....problem is my E level has stayed high.

I'm not sure what I am going to do. I am very uncomfortable taking 50mg every day. I might go back and try Arimidex again and see how the sides are. Other option is to add T Cyp to my deal and cut back on the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) drastically just to keep things working down there...at least until I have kids, which probably wont happen for a while.

I am most definately benefitting from HRT. I am better than I was off HCG....but I think things could be way better.

 

[totalburnout]

Thanks everyone for your advise. Yes....this is a urologist who specializes in fertility and dabbles in Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) as well. He originally had me on weekly shots of 5000iu's. Obviously a fertility dose. I talked him into lower doses...he thought for sure my T would drop and it wouldn't work....but my T levels have stayed around 650-675....problem is my E level has stayed high.

I'm not sure what I am going to do. I am very uncomfortable taking 50mg every day. I might go back and try Arimidex again and see how the sides are. Other option is to add T Cyp to my deal and cut back on the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) drastically just to keep things working down there...at least until I have kids, which probably wont happen for a while.

I am most definately benefitting from HRT. I am better than I was off HCG....but I think things could be way better.

Sorry I can't recall all your dosages since I'm postin from my phone and its difficult to see it all.

My opinion?

As a basic template, if the amount of aromasin you're taking in comparison to your current hCG dose is 62 than you need additional aromasin. The downside of taking additional Aromatase inhibitor (AI) is possible effects on your joints and cholesterol profile. Although I'm much more familiar with anastrozole (Arimidex/Adex) than aromasin.

Now what is your other option from taking more AI? Well you can change the frequency of your hCG or your dosage. It sounds like you already changed dosage. I'd stay at 500-1000iu's of hCG 2-3 days per week.

If you inject hCG daily you can potentially constantly be stimulating estrogen production depending on dosage and how much you aromatize. From what you've said and from what we've seen on labs, you do have estrogen concerns so I'd shy from this approach.

I'd take those 2-3 500-1000iu hCG injections per week. I'd increase aromasin in increments until the estrogen issues went away. I'd do so by breaking the dosage of Aromatase inhibitor (AI) into morning and night. You won't run as much risk or shutting down E2 completely. Based on the half life of the Aromatase inhibitor (AI), you'll always have a solid dose flowing through you.

I would not be concerned about your fertility concerns, even if you went on Test but definitely not given your current hCG usage (unless you use very high doses for a very long time).


Apologize for the rambling post

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

hCG aromatizes much more readily than T.

Please provide some evidence for this statement.

 

[Low-T-Hoss]

UPDATE 8/7/13
Current Protocol 750iu's Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) 3x week & 3mg Arimidex 3x week (same day as shot)

Well, I'm officially stumped. I've got no real idea what to do next and I'm getting very frustrated. I've been on this journey since November and I'm just not satisfied at where my numbers are or how I feel.

After 4-5 weeks on the above therapy, my total T came in at 479 (348-1197) and my E came in at 45.3 (7.6-42.6). Even with all this Arimidex in my system and what most would consider an excessive dose of weekly Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG), my numbers are not where I thought they would be. How can my E be so high with this much Adex? Am I just a hyperaromatizor (sp?)? The last 4 weeks or so I've even lost about 9lbs (changed up some things on my diet and added an extra day to the gym).

So....how do I feel? About the same as I have on any of my therapies. My E sides are down...but I still have some bloat and get moody. Morning wood is so so and very hit or miss, libido is definately better on therapy, but still not great. Workouts are about the same as before therapy....sometimes I get an extra pump and feel better, but it is nothing consistent. Not sure I would say my memory is any better. Overall, I'm glad I'm on therapy and definately dont want to stop....but there has to be a better one for me?

I just got the blood test in the mail yesterday so I have not had a chance to talk to my doctor yet about the next step. On the blood test he wrote...."continue current dosages and retest in 3 months." I'm NOT happy with that. I think he is getting a little frustrated with this also. I dont think most of the guys he works with question him or push for somethign better. They just take his standard 5,000iu Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) once weekly with daily 1mg Arimidex and call it a day. However, those guys are actively trying to get pregnant.....I'm just trying to hang onto my fertility for when we want to start having kids in a year or so.

I think I'm going to request a trial on Test cypionate. 1000mg weekly with 2x 400iu's Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and Arimidex 3mg weekly. It's my understanding that the aromotization occurs in the testicles and because I am stimulating them with so much Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and I am a hyper aromotizer, I'm just producing too much E and that ratio sucks. With less stimulization, maybe I'll get less E conversion....then let the test cyp do it's job and get my total t where it needs to be.

The more and more I read.....the more I realize that Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) mono may just not be the right treatment for me?

Thoughts?