Low (320) Testosterone at 25. 3 Doctors won't do a thing. Are they right?

[misterkobra]

Hello, I am new to this forum.

I signed up because this has been annoying me for the last year.

Sorry for the long post, but if someone has the patienc and is williong to help, please read.

For a long time, I have been feeling lazy as hell, unwilling to do stuff. Gains in the gym, even with good diet are always messed up. Im 6'2. 185. 15% bf. for a year everything was fine, gained about 15bs maintained bf, figured its because of noob gains. because like, now, If I eat over maintenance... I feel like I get more bloated and fat than I gain muscle and when I cut, I always seem to lose more muscle and keep a bit of the belly.


I also have had a girlfriend for one year now. And I've been having low libido. Sometimes I have ED, dick will go up on a bj and then out of the blue when im putting it.. opftt, goes down. Lost my morning woods pretty much, just low libido overall. I do have sex with my gf every time we see each other, but I feel like I should be WAY hornier at 25... I usually only have sex once a day, and dont feel like having sex anymore on that day. Sometimes at night I'll have sex, or i'll go limp. I just feel like I shouldnt be like this at 25.

so I thought to myself something must be wrong here... went to an andrologist, he got my testosterone tested up and it was 326... and said everything was normal, it was well within the range and my ED problems were psychological and he got me cialis 5mg to take every day or every other day. During that time, alright, I had better sex, didnt have ED but my libido kind of was the same.

So I searched up on the internet and every specialized website says that 300 is when people start doing testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) and that even 400 at 27 is like bottom 5% of the male population...

so I went to ANOTHER doctor 7 months later, because I was still having low libido/laziness/ED sometimes (especially at night, I wake up at full testosterone then I imagine that at night i must have like 150 test or so which SUCKS for libido and sex at night... especially if i had sex in the afternoon)

this doctor saw the last exam and said that If I kept low T levels, he would give me medication to stimulate the testicle to create more test... so I took the test again, it was at 330 and he said that it was also within the range because the stupid lab says the range is 220-850... wtf? And he said that whats lowering my testosterone could be the Varicocele I have (even though i have pretty much normal sperm count) so he said "do a surgery to remove that varicocele and it MIGHT improve your T". Read up on it and getting surgery on varicocele CAN raise test as much as 100 ng/dl free test.... which would be still low for me at 25!

So I went to like a private endo and this guy was more open to the testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) thing, saw my exam (330 test) and said that its still not enough to put me on TRT... he said that I should be at around 260-280 tops for him to put me on that... Fucking ridiculous...


so the questions are...
- are these doctors right? Am I really "within the range" even with these symptons of not caring about anything, low libido, some ED, sucky gains in the gym...
- is 320 test REALLY 'normal and within the range' for a 25 year old male? Should I keep looking for a doctor who isnt a fuking pussy stuck in the medicine of the 80s and try to get me some testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) or at LEAST medication to stimulate my testicle to produce more test?
- Or am I wrong and its all psychological? I know some of my ED is psychological because I get nervous about it but I've read on several websites that 300 test at 25 is NOT normal and SHOULD be treated but its like these doctors are scared of it...

-if i just go on a self-done testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) at 125mg a week of sustanon, how will that affect me health-wise? I dont give a fuck about babies right now, when I do, i'll just hop off, do a "PCT" and do it. does that low dose affect cholesterol/blood pressure or have any impact on my health? What do you guys think? Should I just do it alone (its easy to get the steroid here in Brazil) and get regular blood works? What kind of blood work should I ask?


sorry for the ridiculously big wall of text, This has been haunting me for the past year and its really getting to my nerves.

 

[misterkobra]

one last thing, Im going to get another bloodwork on my testosterone, because the last year I was kind of "sad" beacuse of college and I just finally graduated from it. I know I wasnt depressed, so theres no way it was like "depression was lowering your test"

 

[misterkobra]

Dude go to a different fourm this site is shit they scam people.

come on man...

 

[ScottyB28]

I think it's more how you feel than your levels. I mean, if you go to the doc with all these symptoms and your levels come back low, even if at the bottom of the range, you need more to feel better. I would contact IMT, not sure if they have an age limit. Sounds like you definitely need higher levels.

 

[misterkobra]

I think it's more how you feel than your levels. I mean, if you go to the doc with all these symptoms and your levels come back low, even if at the bottom of the range, you need more to feel better. I would contact IMT, not sure if they have an age limit. Sounds like you definitely need higher levels.

I dont know what IMT is. what is that?

 

[corvettels3]

Total test means shit. Free test is what matters.

 

[SicVic]

Try This. Take one shot of Triptorelin 100mcg. Then go back to the doctor in 4 weeks and have your blood levels checked.

 

[bodyofageekgod]

I've had physicians tell me at test levels of 360 or 425 that "oh your in the normal range" so we don't need to change/do anything but had never even asked me about my symptoms. I felt like crap even at 425. I was 35 at the time. I brought in charts from the internet that showed my T levels were in the range of a 65 to 75 yr old and the doctors scoffed and said those don't apply. They would tell me there was no standard, and each guy is different but then go by the "reference ranges" of the labs. Your physician should be treating your symptoms not just the lab values.

It's tough to find a good physician that will listen to you but keep looking. There are lots of physicians out there and if nothing else go to an Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) clinic (I recommend IMT) and pay out of pocket for the meds if you can afford it.

 

[misterkobra]

I've had physicians tell me at test levels of 360 or 425 that "oh your in the normal range" so we don't need to change/do anything but had never even asked me about my symptoms. I felt like crap even at 425. I was 35 at the time. I brought in charts from the internet that showed my T levels were in the range of a 65 to 75 yr old and the doctors scoffed and said those don't apply. They would tell me there was no standard, and each guy is different but then go by the "reference ranges" of the labs. Your physician should be treating your symptoms not just the lab values.

It's tough to find a good physician that will listen to you but keep looking. There are lots of physicians out there and if nothing else go to an Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) clinic (I recommend IMT) and pay out of pocket for the meds if you can afford it.

Im from Brazil so no IMT for me

 

[swim15]

I would consider testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) very carefully. You can try Triptorelin or clomid but ultimately this is just a temporary fix...there are docs that will perscribe but they are hard to find (at your age) in which case you may need to consider self administration with private blood work 2-3x/year

 

[misterkobra]

I would consider testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) very carefully. You can try Triptorelin or clomid but ultimately this is just a temporary fix...there are docs that will perscribe but they are hard to find (at your age) in which case you may need to consider self administration with private blood work 2-3x/year

yea i wanted to try clomid but you cant take clomid forever... so that would be just a temporary fix... and it sucks...

i wanted to try a 125mg permanent testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) with bloodwork every now and then... see what happens.

 

[swim15]

clomid is kind of temporary...but a long therapy should raise it some even after use is discontinued. that said it is cheap and you could dose it eod or e3d and still get an efffect be fine @ 50mg per dose

 

[misterkobra]

clomid is kind of temporary...but a long therapy should raise it some even after use is discontinued. that said it is cheap and you could dose it eod or e3d and still get an efffect be fine @ 50mg per dose

what would be the sides of using clomid eod, if any? wouldn't it just stimulate my body to produce more testosterone, or does it block estrogen or something like that?

how about the sides of a low dose testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) (125mg) other than reduced sperm count?

 

[SicVic]

what would be the sides of using clomid eod, if any? wouldn't it just stimulate my body to produce more testosterone, or does it block estrogen or something like that?

how about the sides of a low dose testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) (125mg) other than reduced sperm count?

Just try one shot of Triptorelin, just one shot, then wait a month or two and see if your levels go anywhere then after that see whats good. If you don't live the training lifestyle it would just be a huge burden to actually keep your hormones all leveled out FOREVER...

 

[misterkobra]

Just try one shot of Triptorelin, just one shot, then wait a month or two and see if your levels go anywhere then after that see whats good. If you don't live the training lifestyle it would just be a huge burden to actually keep your hormones all leveled out FOREVER...

i do live the training lifestyle though. Gains just suck.

it sucks when I bulk and get fuking bloated and fat easily and still remain wih skinny arms and when I cut I lose too much muscle.

 

[misterkobra]

Just try one shot of Triptorelin, just one shot, then wait a month or two and see if your levels go anywhere then after that see whats good. If you don't live the training lifestyle it would just be a huge burden to actually keep your hormones all leveled out FOREVER...

lol
i read on the side effects of triptorelin, and they are all the prostate cancer side effects , because it raises test and it can cause prostate cancer (even tho theres no real link between high test and prostate cancer)

but are there any sides?
apparently triptorelin is just a combination of 10 aminoacids?
that would be interesting.



now that i graduated and dont feel "sad" anymore, i want to take ANOTHER testosterone exam, just to see what my levels are. and if, even after i went thru that bullshyt in college (it had been 1 year that i was sad with it, probably lowering my test) then i'll do all this stuf.

 

[cross88]

I too suffer from a similar situation. Im 24 and my test is 10.5 on a range of 9-28. Ive suffered from low test symptoms for the past few years but due to my age they will not prescribe me anything. Im comtemplating self-administering testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) until I get old enough to be considered for script stuff, because ive never felt better than when on test and it cures all my symptoms

 

[riprockwell]

so the questions are...
- are these doctors right? Am I really "within the range" even with these symptons of not caring about anything, low libido, some ED, sucky gains in the gym...

No the doctors are not right. Everyone is different and doctors should listen to symptoms instead of basing their diagnosis on a fucking number that is in the range. The range for Total T is retarded as it is. The range is created for all different age groups. Now, if they had a range of just 27-28 year olds like you, then your number would be below the range or should be theoretically speaking. I was at a 200-300 level for so long and I was feeling like death on it. I couldn't find any knowledgeable doctor where I live so I had to get with a Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) company out of state. I had doctors give me androgel, no HCG, no knowledge of an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) and I am estrogen sensitive too so things were a disaster for awhile.
- is 320 test REALLY 'normal and within the range' for a 25 year old male? Should I keep looking for a doctor who isnt a fuking pussy stuck in the medicine of the 80s and try to get me some testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) or at LEAST medication to stimulate my testicle to produce more test?

No 320 is on the low side. For your age, you should be double that at least. Keep in mind, we are a very estrogenic society now. The water we drink, the containers we eat out of, etc. This range is going to continue to go lower and lower and pretty soon having a level like yourself will just be the norm. So yeah, everyone is different. Some guys could be at your level and feel fine. I on the other hand felt terrible.

- Or am I wrong and its all psychological? I know some of my ED is psychological because I get nervous about it but I've read on several websites that 300 test at 25 is NOT normal and SHOULD be treated but its like these doctors are scared of it...

Trust me, the ED part can be psychological but that is initially because you can't perform. So obviously to me, there are some low T issues that you will need to deal with.

-if i just go on a self-done testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) at 125mg a week of sustanon, how will that affect me health-wise? I dont give a fuck about babies right now, when I do, i'll just hop off, do a "PCT" and do it. does that low dose affect cholesterol/blood pressure or have any impact on my health? What do you guys think? Should I just do it alone (its easy to get the steroid here in Brazil) and get regular blood works? What kind of blood work should I ask?

I think you have a couple of options......First would be to do a system restart and run some clomid again for around 5-6 weeks this time. Your other option would be to self medicate and I think 125mg per week is a good starting point. A testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) dose can be anywhere from 100-200mg per week. I am personally on 100mg per week. There were very little side effects for me. I seriously doubt you will have any blood pressure issues at a testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) dose. My cholesterol numbers improved when I started TRT. Also, I would definitely run Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) along with your testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) dose at 250ius twice per week. Also grab an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) like Aromasin or Arimidex just in case you need it. As for blood work, test your Total Test, Free Test, Estrodial, liver values, CBC, PSA, Thyroid, SHBG, DHT, DHEA. I am pretty sure those are all I get tested. There might be some missing. Good luck!!



sorry for the ridiculously big wall of text, This has been haunting me for the past year and its really getting to my nerves.

See bold

 

[SicVic]

lol
i read on the side effects of triptorelin, and they are all the prostate cancer side effects , because it raises test and it can cause prostate cancer (even tho theres no real link between high test and prostate cancer)

but are there any sides?
apparently triptorelin is just a combination of 10 aminoacids?
that would be interesting.



now that i graduated and dont feel "sad" anymore, i want to take ANOTHER testosterone exam, just to see what my levels are. and if, even after i went thru that bullshyt in college (it had been 1 year that i was sad with it, probably lowering my test) then i'll do all this stuf.

If you do one shot 100mcg, thats all. One day. The side is if you use it continuiously, which is what they give prostate cancer patients so it overstimulates the pituitary gland so it burns out and produces less Test. But these are servings of 4 grams. You only take one 100mcg shot then thats it.

 

[misterkobra]

thank you two for the answers above.
i have no idea how to get this triptowhatever here in brazil, so i'll try running clomid first for a few weeks.

im going to get tested too, before doing anything. lets see if my test levels have improved the last couple of weeks, afetr graduating.