Need help deciding on next run.

[Bronny92]

OK so I'm looking into running another cycle this fall. Not really near experienced as most you guys on here but, would love to have some opinions. I was looking into a good bulk as lean as possible. Right now I stand 6 foot about 211 pounds body fat mabe 18%. Been weight training around5 years going on 6. I have ran test only 500/week and test and dbol. Interested in putting on some size and pull out my lacking parts. Im very familiar and comfortable with training and DIET (B.A in Sports med.). Thanks guys.

I am contemplating on adding anther oral or trying lowish tren, Iv heard very good stuff about that. If everything is on key of course.

 

[oldmusclemike]

Welcome to the board. It's hard to tell by your post just how educated in AAS use you are but I get the opinion not very well read.

You didn't mention if you ran your PCT and an AI.
Do you mind telling us your age?

Also no need for another oral. Best try not do much in the way of orals

 

[Milton]

Welcome to the boards.

 

[Bronny92]

I understand, I'm 24. I have been researching nutrition since I was 16 I love health hence the degree. I also did run a pct..nolva, clomid makes me feel horrible. I had a.i and use it on a as needed basis..my main issue is bloat. Even with low sodium intake and a crap load of water so it was useful every other day.

 

[Roush]

I understand, I'm 24. I have been researching nutrition since I was 16 I love health hence the degree. I also did run a pct..nolva, clomid makes me feel horrible. I had a.i and use it on a as needed basis..my main issue is bloat. Even with low sodium intake and a crap load of water so it was useful every other day.

you say you used an AI on an as needed basis, , but then you say you used it every other day. taking it every other day is the proper way to run an ai like arimidex. if you were having bloat issues I'm guessing you were not consistent with your AI protocol and having some estrogen issues.

in regards to future cycles, and if you do struggle with bloat and estrogen sides. Try running a new non aromatizing compound with the next cycle along with a lower dose of test .
examples
test with tren
test with high dosage of mast
test with an oral like Tbol
**

don't go running an oral like dbol, or even adding deca in the mix UNTIL you've gotten your AI protocol and estrogen managed with test alone. mid cycle blood work and checking e2 is a good idea. then adjust from there.

** note: only add one new compound for a new cycle. but once your familiar with these compounds you can stack them all together . like Test/Tren/Mast

 

[Bronny92]

When I refer to a.i on a as needed basis I ment if I diddnt feel I needed it at that time I wouldn't take it but, if I notice I needed to run it that's when the every other day. And test does bloat me pretty bad I came to realize so an A.I will be uses. I know people react differently but I have not heard anything real great about deca. Dbol was great as far as strength but alot was water I felt. Test is test. I have been very curious about tren, Iv just heard alot of great stuff about this compound.

 

[bigben66]

If you have an issue with bloating and dialing in your AI dosage, I wouldn't add any other compounds until you have run a successful cycle and nailed these down.

Keep it simple, stick with Test (perhaps a slightly higher dosage) and run your AI regularly, consistently and don't miss days.

Get that cycle under your belt, see how your 'bloat' is then. And perhaps on your second cycle run the same Test dose with 500mg Deca - upping your AI dose to accommodate it.

The problem with D'Bol, is that you don't run it for the same length of time as you do the Test, so therefore you have to not only worry about the AI dose for Test and D'Bol, but you also then have to worry about the adjustment as you move on to Test only...

Whereas if you run Deca and Test, you run them along side each other throughout. (Apart from the last week as you'll be stopping Deca 1 week before Test)

You catch my drift?

 

[Roush]

When I refer to a.i on a as needed basis I ment if I diddnt feel I needed it at that time I wouldn't take it but, if I notice I needed to run it that's when the every other day. .

unless you were getting a blood test done DAILY , then you would have no idea if you needed it or not . the sides of high estrogen you were feeling were AFTER your estrogen was sky rocketed. you could have elevated estrogen and not 'feel' a thing,, thats why you need to take an AI pro actively with your cycle and get mid cycle bloods done .

not wait until side effects happen and THEN take it . thats like deciding to wear a condom sleeping with sluts AFTER you already got an std . the goal is to prevent getting an std in the first place.

an AI is to prevent estrogen spikes in the first place, not fix if after the fact

 

[Bronny92]

Totally understand, I can manage the bloat fine if my diet is very clean with plenty of water. I was considering test C at 500. And tren A at 50 every other day. With pct and a.i or course. Mabe 12 to 15 week test and 6 or 8 tren.

 

[bigben66]

know people react differently but I have not heard anything real great about deca. Dbol was great as far as strength but alot was water I felt. Test is test. I have been very curious about tren, Iv just heard alot of great stuff about this compound.

You're sending mixed messages right here!

Are you training for hypertrophy (aesthetics) or are you training for strength?

Two totally separate goals that require two different training methods, two different diets and quite possibly two different AAS intakes.

If I am bodybuilding - muscle gain is my goal. I train for hypertrophy using lots of intensity, supersets, drop sets, low recovery periods etc.
My diet is set up to gain muscle but keep fat gain to a minimum, I would perhaps cycle carbs to ensure leg and back days I got more fuel, but then carbs were kept to a minimum on smaller bodypart days, I would incorporate HIIT and LISS training to address bodyfat concerns
I would ensure my chosen AAS were appropriate for helping me with regard to muscle gain and add in orals if I was cutting bodyfat.

Alternatively if I am training for strength, I lower my reps, perhaps follow a 5 x 5 protocol, longer recovery periods between sets, I'm not worried about muscle isolation and time under tension etc, my single goal is to improve my lifts and nothing else.
My diet is calorie laden, I don't care if bodyfat is added, calories do not need to be tracked.
With regard to AAS, I would add in drugs that aid aggression such as Halotestin and I'd make my cycles shorter and more frequent to tie in with meets.

So, as you can see, unless you actually know what your goal is - you can't work out a route to achieve it!

And if you try and do both - you're destined for very little success whatsoever!

 

[Bronny92]

I appreciate the help and not sarcastically at all but I diddnt mention I trained to be a weight lifter or power lifting, I'm training for hypertrophy. I want to compete. I do understand the difference between the two (I have my CPT through NASM also. I just merely ment with dbol there was a huge strength and endurance difference regardless my training. I do count calories every meal. I do hitt cardio for general well being. Question why do you say short more frequent cycles. Rather than what I mentioned. Thanks again.

 

[Roush]

I appreciate the help and not sarcastically at all but I diddnt mention I trained to be a weight lifter or power lifting, I'm training for hypertrophy. I want to compete. I do understand the difference between the two (I have my CPT through NASM also. I just merely ment with dbol there was a huge strength and endurance difference regardless my training. I do count calories every meal. I do hitt cardio for general well being. Question why do you say short more frequent cycles. Rather than what I mentioned. Thanks again.

If your lifting for 'hypertrophy' and not strength alone , then strength increases are still of benefit . as a stronger muscle means you can put more 'mechanical tension' and 'time under tension' on the muscle, and more endurance means more 'volume' as well .. all three are critical for hypertrophy. so yes, if an anabolic steroid makes you 'stronger' it will certainly aid in muscle hypertrophy for bodybuilding as well.

 

[Bronny92]

I agree buddy, I am going to get blood work done next week and again in a few months b4 I start cycling that will give me time to start increasing my cals. And dial in my macros, with all that cleared up what drugs would help most helpful for my bodybuilding goals for some very surpassed test and then test dbol. Pct and a.i. Training and diet will be on key.

 

[Milton]

I agree buddy, I am going to get blood work done next week and again in a few months b4 I start cycling that will give me time to start increasing my cals. And dial in my macros, with all that cleared up what drugs would help most helpful for my bodybuilding goals for some very surpassed test and then test dbol. Pct and a.i. Training and diet will be on key.

looking forward to your blood results!

 

[Roush]

I agree buddy, I am going to get blood work done next week and again in a few months b4 I start cycling that will give me time to start increasing my cals. And dial in my macros, with all that cleared up what drugs would help most helpful for my bodybuilding goals for some very surpassed test and then test dbol. Pct and a.i. Training and diet will be on key.

nothing wrong with going with a classic test/deca cycle for a moderate long term bulk . I say long term cause deca is best ran upwards of 14 weeks . if you don't want to run that long of a cycle then go with NPP instead of deca (just a faster acting nandrolone).

 

[Bronny92]

Have you personally ran deca yourself, if so do you mind sharing your thoughts about the drug. Like did you feel it more efficient at a certain dosage range. I just hear alot of mixed feeling about deca. (I guess like anything else though).

 

[bigben66]

Deca is my favourite compound for adding muscle.

Having said that, I am proficient at dosing my AI to avoid aromatisation, so therefore I do not suffer the adverse effects of it, only the positive.

I pretty much guarantee that the only bad reports you've heard about Deca - are from people who don't manage estradiol properly.

 

[Roush]

Have you personally ran deca yourself, if so do you mind sharing your thoughts about the drug. Like did you feel it more efficient at a certain dosage range. I just hear alot of mixed feeling about deca. (I guess like anything else though).

yes I have plenty of times . also , I now usually run Deca along with NPP (fast acting deca). I front load NPP, the short ester nandrolone, along with Deca, the long ester nandrolone. that way I get more results in a shorter amount of time. Deca by itself usually takes a good 7 weeks or so to kick in. when I front load it with NPP it starts kicking in at week 3, and then I don't have to run it 14+ weeks either when doing this.

HOWEVER.. Like big ben mentioned, you really really have to be on top of controlling your estrogen otherwise all the negatives you've heard about deca will be apparent. the term "Deca dick" is not actually caused by deca at all, its caused by guys not controlling estrogen and prolactin. you have to stay on top of it. but if estrogen is controlled you will get just the positives.

note: deca is highly anabolic, some of the sides that are not 'estrogen' related can still be apparent.. anabolic sides like - aggression, feeling hot, sweating a lot, anxiety for some, sleep apnea (for me anyways).. when your anabolic as hell and putting on a lot of muscle quickly from a very good compound like deca, it can be slightly uncomfortable (these are not necessarily negative sides like you may experience from high estrogen and prolactin). just something to be aware of.
when running just test alone at moderate doses, i do not get these 'anabolic' sides, but I do with deca and test together.
- some guys look forward to these sides knowing the gear is fully kicked in.

 

[Bronny92]

I really appreciate you helping me your very knowledgeable, I think I might be best off right now to run a moderate dose of test alittle higher than usual and go with dbol again and really work on my a.i and pct protocol and perfect it 110% with blood work then try deca and npp like you mentioned. That would give me more time to do even more research on that. Do you tell much of a diff fro 500 to 600 or up on test E...I do understand more is not always better but I'm sure sometimes it can be if done correctly.

 

[Roush]

I really appreciate you helping me your very knowledgeable, I think I might be best off right now to run a moderate dose of test alittle higher than usual and go with dbol again and really work on my a.i and pct protocol and perfect it 110% with blood work then try deca and npp like you mentioned. That would give me more time to do even more research on that. Do you tell much of a diff fro 500 to 600 or up on test E...I do understand more is not always better but I'm sure sometimes it can be if done correctly.

if you have experience in the past running test and dbol, then at least you know how you react to those compounds . so yeah I do think its a good idea to try that again for a bulk and really get to know your body and how it responds and aromatizes and really dial in your AI and use blood work . thats a good idea. You'll get more out of your cycle that way and you'll learn more.

as far as bumping up from 500 to 600 mg of test on your next run. sure. you may not notice a lot of difference, but blood levels will be higher (which means super physiological levels will be higher and thus more gains possible). there does become a point of 'diminishing returns' where more will not be any better , and will just mean more sides with little to no additional gains. BUT I do not think the 500-600mg a week of test range is any where close to the level of 'diminishing returns' (we are all different though,, 1000mg or so a week is about where my max range is).