New to AAS

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ian512
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As I said in a previous post, I'm not affraid of needles and really what I wanted was a injectables style cycle, but a friend talked me out of it and I thought oral would be a safer bet for my first cycle. How can I tell if my body has recovered from lack of a poor PCT? I read that stacking sustanon-250 gives explosive HUGE gains when on a d-bol cycle. What would you think of a 6 week cycle? Can anyone explain to me a little bit more about the nova? I got mixed messages, both saying that I didn't need to take the nova throughout the entire cycle, or only if I felt I was begining to see gyno? From the sounds of it I should really wait until I have enough funds to stack some form of test with this cycle......but it would take months for me to get those kind of funds....
 
hey Ian512 LOOK UP IN THE STERIOD PROFILES CLICK ON IT SCROLL DOWN AND LOOK FOR NOLVA IT WILL HELP YOU UNDERSTAND OR GIVE YOU A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF IT...HOPE THIS HELPS
 
Fair enough, your right. I'm not to noobie to admit when I've been proved wrong or told otherwise, thanks for the quick reply btw. Haha still no answer to my question though!! I was planning on taking something I could by at GNC i.e arimatest or an LG product. I also have a full bottle of supervol, which is a barely legal prohormone that gave me great results; which could be used as a PCT? (it has factors in it that prevent Test to Estro conversions.) That last statement made it sound like I don't know what a PCT is, but I do for anyone wondering. I'm not afraid to try injectables, I just figured being this my first go at AAS I'd try an oral. Do you recommend I take the nova as a PCT instead? From the research I did D-bol can have very potent estrogenic effects causing severe gyno. Many of the more legitment AAS sites also recommend stacking similiar products when on a D-bol cycle. The stack I ordered(which I havn't recieved yet) gave instructions to take a varying amount of D-bol depending on the week you were on, and 1 nova per-day.

wow r u serious u were thinking about buying something at GNC to stack with ur d-bol and ur only 165lbs and be in the gym for 2yrs u should train naturally for a few more years before u take anything and if u r gonna take anything take test e thats all u need for a first cycle and no one suggested that u run the novla wit the cycle u only run it if u get a bad case of gyno but just get some test e and som clomid for ur first cycle and save the d-bol for a second cycle
 
hey Ian512 LOOK UP IN THE STERIOD PROFILES CLICK ON IT SCROLL DOWN AND LOOK FOR NOLVA IT WILL HELP YOU UNDERSTAND OR GIVE YOU A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF IT...HOPE THIS HELPS

I dont like the profile here much as its inaccurate from the first sentence calling nolva a potent anti estrogen. Heres a better profile.


Nolvadex
(Tamoxifen Citrate)
Nolvadex and Gynocomastia
This drug is used as a first line defense against breast cancer. In the late 80´s, Dan Duchaine speculated that it could also be used by bodybuilders to halt the development of another type of tumor in the mammary gland, Gynocomastia. He introduced this find to the Steroid-using-community in his "Contest Prep" issue of the UnderGround Steroid Handbook Update Newsletters (the contest prep-issue was actually 3 issues in one, for those who had a subscription to the newsletter).

Nolvadex is commonly referred to in quite a few ways: as a SERM (Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulator), as an anti-estrogen (that is actually incorrect, as we will later see), and finally as a triphenylethylene. I happen to stick with calling Nolvadex a SERM, because out of my three options, it happens to be correct (as we know that calling it an anti-estrogen is incorrect), and pronouncable (as we know that I have no idea how to say "triphenylethylene"). Selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs) act as either estrogen receptor agonists or antagonists in a tissue-selective manner, lets see what that means to us&

Nolvadex actually has quite a few applications for the steroid using athlete. First and foremost, it´s most common use is for the prevention of gynocomastia. Nolvadex does this by actually competing for the receptor site in breast tissue, and binding to it. Thus, we can safely say that the effect of tamoxifen is through estrogen receptor blockade of breast tissue (1), especially since total body estradiol increases with use of tamoxifen. Clearly, if you are on a cycle which includes steroids which convert to estrogen, you may want to consider nolvadex as a good choice to run along side them.

Nolvadex Cycle
Nolvadex, however, is not the most potent ancillary compound we can use on a cycle, but it is probably the safest considering it doesn´t actually reduce estrogen in your body keeping some estrogen floating around could have many benefits on muscle growth, as well. Estrogen is also important for a properly functioning immune system, and not only that, but your lipid profile (both HDL and LDL) should also show marked improvement with administration of tamoxifen (4). Many bodybuilders actually use this stuff during their cycle for the health benefits provided by it. If, however, you are preparing for a bodybuilding contest, you need to use something which will suck most (if not all) of the estrogen out of your body. I am speculating that you may be able to use Nolvadex for the majority of a contest prep cycle, to keep yourself relatively healthy, and then switch over to Letrozole for the last 8 weeks.

Nolvadex also has some important features for the steroid using athlete. In hypogonadic and infertile men given nolvadex, increases in the serum levels of LH, FSH, and most importantly, testosterone were all observed (2)(3). The best (rough) estimate I can give you from my research is that 20mgs of Nolvadex will raise your testosterone levels about 150% (5)...and this would of course greatly aid post-cycle-recovery. What this means to us is that if you take Nolvadex after a cycle, when you are trying to raise your levels of testosterone, LH, and FSH back to normal, it will greatly aid recovery. In fact, if I were limited to just one compound to aid me in post-cycle-recovery, Nolvadex would be my choice. If you want a comparison, it would require 150mgs of Clomid to accomplish that type of elevation in testosterone, but nolvadex also significantly increased the LH (Leutenizing Hormone) response to LHRL (5), after 6 weeks.

Some of the more harsh ancillary compounds available today will give you a more "dry" look that nolvadex can´t, but nolvadex is simply safer to use in long (over 16 week) cycles.

Nolvadex Side Effects
Unfortunately, Nolvadex isn´t perfect. Anecdotally, it has been linked to reduced gains in some bodybuilders. This isn´t due, as previously thought, to its reducing estrogen levels (which it doesn´t), but rather to it´s ability to possibly reduce IGF (Insulin-like-Growth-Factor) levels, which are important for muscle growth.
 
Thanks for that info estrey. I wasn't looking to stack something from GNC with my cycle, I was proposing an idea that maybe I could use a product such as arimatest as my post cycle therapy (pct). If I wanted to get picky I could say I've been training for 6 years, it wasn't until 2006 that I started bodybuilding. 4 years of highschool sports taught me alot. Just want an opinion on a cycle idea I just came up with, and granted I'm a newbie at this don't hesitate to tell me it's a bad idea. I was thinking of now stacking the d-bol, then the supervol(in hopes that I could retain more from the d-bol cycle), then PCT'ing with the nova? Off topic, but does anyone know anything about arimatest?
 
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Nolva is not an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) and it does not lower estrogen levels.



That being said, its just really not necessary to run it the whole cycle. Use it if symptoms of gyno start to appear.

uhm, im not sure if u read my statement right, i said people USUALLY USE AN Aromatase inhibitor (AI) TO PREVENT GYNO during a cycle, i in no way said that nolvadex is an aromatase inhibitor-AI. But it is an anti-estrogen.
 
Anyone have any opinions on my idea for the cycle I thought up in my last post?
 
uhm, im not sure if u read my statement right, i said people USUALLY USE AN Aromatase inhibitor (AI) TO PREVENT GYNO during a cycle, i in no way said that nolvadex is an aromatase inhibitor-AI. But it is an anti-estrogen.

Youre still wrong.

Anti-estrogen and Aromatase Inhibitor are teh same thing. They work by preventing the aromatase enzyme from converting test into estrogen thus lowering circulating estrogen levels. Nolvadex is neither, its a SERM. It does not lower estrogen levels, it simply prevents estrogen from binding to the receptor on breast tissue which is the most effective way to stop/prevent gyno. You said "running nolva during a cycle isn't the smartest thing to do as u need some estrogen to grow" as if nolva is gonna reduce your estrogen levels. It wont.
 
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Thanks for that info estrey. I wasn't looking to stack something from GNC with my cycle, I was proposing an idea that maybe I could use a product such as arimatest as my post cycle therapy (pct). If I wanted to get picky I could say I've been training for 6 years, it wasn't until 2006 that I started bodybuilding. 4 years of highschool sports taught me alot. Just want an opinion on a cycle idea I just came up with, and granted I'm a newbie at this don't hesitate to tell me it's a bad idea. I was thinking of now stacking the d-bol, then the supervol(in hopes that I could retain more from the d-bol cycle), then PCT'ing with the nova? Off topic, but does anyone know anything about arimatest?

Dont stack the 2, supervol is highly toxic thats why most people feel like shit when they take it. Adding dbol will just put more stress on your liver. As for the arimitest i wouldnt trust something over the counter for post cycle therapy (pct). Nolvadex works, use it.
 
Just for clarification, I mean run an entire cycle of dbol, then a supervol cycle, then PCT with nova
 
Copy that, Just want to give a big thanks to everyone that posted useful and relevent information. I'll be trolling the site from now on, learning.
 
Stats:
lbs; 165
age; 24
years of training; 2
diet; 3,500-4,800 calories a day (right now it's christmas and I just finished a potent prohormone cycle so I'm taking nothing atm, havn't lifted in about....7 days. Just giving my body a break.

3,500-4,800 calories/day, huh? But 165 pounds.

I'll never quite understand how most lifters count their calories.

We tend to give a lot of shit to people doing dbol only cycles for their first cycle. With reason, really. But I wouldn't say they are a complete waste.

I'm trying to remember if nolavdex is contradicted in the case of dbol gyno but I can't remember off the top of my head.

Anyway, you have a problem that you need to fix before you cycle and it was to do with your apparent inability to gain more weight.

Do you happen to also have your carb/protein/fat g breakdown?
 
At the end of my supervol cycle I was weighing 170. I can gain weight, I've gone from 135(2007) to 170(a month ago) at my peak to 165(now). It's hard for me to answer some these questions now because I'm not training atm or journaling my food. When I was journaling and counting calories and such, I was intaking about......210(not ideal, but it's what I did) grams of protein a daygranted this was when I was weighing 140-160. Carbs and fat wasn't something I was worried or took the time to count because I was trying to put on fast mass.
 
well atleast your listining to people!! THANK GOD!!
somany come here ask somthing then get pissed when we try to steer them in right direction like eg. this guy that likes to reuse needles "but cleans then with bleach and water so its ok" hahahah i hope hes not dead yet from the bleach.
 
remembe that legal stuff you bought IS liver toxic and hard on liver so dotn run it right after eather maybe extend the dbol an extra week but dont runn another oral right after. also i would take mulkthistle the whole time.
shit i runn it right now and im not even taking any orals just test and a bit of deca lol.
BE HEALTHY AND LEARN!!!
:-) gud luck
 
Youre still wrong.

Anti-estrogen and Aromatase Inhibitor are teh same thing. They work by preventing the aromatase enzyme from converting test into estrogen thus lowering circulating estrogen levels. Nolvadex is neither, its a SERM. It does not lower estrogen levels, it simply prevents estrogen from binding to the receptor on breast tissue which is the most effective way to stop/prevent gyno. You said "running nolva during a cycle isn't the smartest thing to do as u need some estrogen to grow" as if nolva is gonna reduce your estrogen levels. It wont.

Oh, i see what you mean, but i've also seen alot of people suggesting not to take nolva the whole cycle but rather an Aromatase inhibitor (AI). Care to clarify why that is? i remember someone mentioned that nolva is toxic but still not sure on the EXACT reason why Aromatase inhibitor (AI) like arimidex is suggested over nolva whole cycle. Arimidex vs Nolva in price around here is like Platinum vs Iron.
 
why do you say nolva is toxic ?

Didn't say it was, i said i recall reading it on these forums before. I don't think u read my post carefully, or i poorly wrote it, i asked estray "why do people suggest AI's like arimidex for the whole cycle, rather than nolvadex? I've read before that nolva is toxic, is that why its not to highly suggested to run the whole cycle? But rather an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) like arimidex?"
 
Oh, i see what you mean, but i've also seen alot of people suggesting not to take nolva the whole cycle but rather an Aromatase inhibitor (AI). Care to clarify why that is? i remember someone mentioned that nolva is toxic but still not sure on the EXACT reason why Aromatase inhibitor (AI) like arimidex is suggested over nolva whole cycle. Arimidex vs Nolva in price around here is like Platinum vs Iron.

As far as i can see, the only real cons against taking nolva are the possibility that long term administration can possibly lead to cancer. I say possibly because this has only been shown to be true with women but then again most of the long term studies on nolva are done on women so draw your own conclusions.

The upside is nolva has been shown to improve your ldl/hdl profile.


Nolva is not gonna help with bloating so imo its really only needed when you get itchy nips and for post cycle therapy (pct). Arimidex will help with bloating and reduce the chances of gyno but may also lead to smaller gains and theres still no guarantee it will prevent gyno. If youre prone to gyno, nolva is the only sure thing.
 
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