Question for those who suggest Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) during cycle

[W153GUY]

You should start your own thread, threadjacking is frowned upon to say the least. Thats way to many compounds for your 2nd cycle and you obviously need to read some stickies. So many red flags from that post. Never run nolva the entire cycle. You should always at least have an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) (arimidex/aromasin) on hand and I recommend running it through every cycle. 500iu HCG per week will just tickle your nuts, double it. What do you mean is clomid necessary? You have to run some SERM for post cycle therapy (pct) like nolva or clomid. Deca is a 19nor and you start running into prolactin issues; thats a whole other can of worms. Read man.

I appologise if i have tread jacked im new to these forum thing. but thanks for your help

 

[Cheebaweebie]

Wanted to post a question to this thread regarding HCG. Starting first cycle Sustanon (sust), mast, and test... plan on running HCG 250iu 2x per week throughout cycle (12 weeks) should a blast at the end be needed if your running throughout ? (500iu per day for 10 days) then start post cycle therapy (pct)
Thanks

one more question, what week should hcg be started... thinking in week 4

 

[Chilihead]

Thank you for the intelligent post.

 

[bigben66]

Hi all... some good intelligent posts here....

Quick question, I want to run my Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) from start to finish of my 10 week Test 400/Equipoise 300 cycle at 500iu's twice a week.

Does it matter if I take the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) on the same day I pin the Test and Equipoise? I can do the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) on a different day if it matters...

Also, I hear some people recommending to take a week off from Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) after five weeks on - would I need to do this on just a 10 week cycle? (ie: 5 weeks on, 1 week off, 4 weeks on?)

I am going to run a 2 week blast cycle of Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) at 750iu's per day after my last pin - until I start my Clomid/Nolva PCT.

Any advice would be welcomed as I REALLY messed up my HCG/PCT on the last cycle and shutdown big time! :-(

 

[BIGHENCH]

Didnt really bother reading through all the replies, but i swear by Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) for a faster and smoother recovery and i speak proof of this as im currently in post cycle therapy (pct) day 17 and i feel like a normal being.

 

[BIGHENCH]

Hi all... some good intelligent posts here....

Quick question, I want to run my Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) from start to finish of my 10 week Test 400/Equipoise 300 cycle at 500iu's twice a week.

Does it matter if I take the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) on the same day I pin the Test and Equipoise? I can do the Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) on a different day if it matters...

Also, I hear some people recommending to take a week off from Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) after five weeks on - would I need to do this on just a 10 week cycle? (ie: 5 weeks on, 1 week off, 4 weeks on?)

I am going to run a 2 week blast cycle of Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) at 750iu's per day after my last pin - until I start my Clomid/Nolva PCT.

Any advice would be welcomed as I REALLY messed up my HCG/PCT on the last cycle and shutdown big time! :-(

You can PIN Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) on the same day as you pin test and Equipoise!

 

[bigben66]

Cheers BigHench, I knew it was probably trivial, but figured best to check!

 

[Swifto]

This was written by Swifto.

So how important is HCG?

When our HPTA's are "shutdown" we have to distinguish between short-term inhibtion and long-term dysfunction.

Short-term inhibition of testosterone production comes primarily from negative feedback at the pituitary and hypothalamus, which reduces LH output. This could be described as a reduction in the signal to produce testosterone. This LH suppression recovers quickly.

However, with time, it leads to testicular dysfunction. Without LH from the pituitary, the testes atrophy from disuse. This testicular dysfunction could be described as a reduction in the responsiveness to a signal to produce testosterone.

The hypothalamus and pituitary seem to recover fairly quickly following the use of androgens. GnRH, LH and FSH rise fairly quickly post cycle, but endogenous testosterone levels dont. As confirmed in this review by William Llewellyn. It shows that LH levels rise fairly quickly (on the 3rd week) after Testosterone Enanthate injections of 250mg weekly for 21 weeks. So it seems the hypothalamus and pituitary are not the problem in restarting endogenous testosterone production post cycle.

After recent correspondance with Dr.Crisler (Swale) he confirmed ganadotrophin levels were not to blame in restarting the HPTA. So what is?

If LH levels rise post cycle (the majority of the time) the reason why endogenous testosterone levels DONT rise, is the testes. Or testicular dysfunction. Testicular dysfunction is when the testes become atrophied from disuse or desensitised to ganadotrophins, such as LH. This could also be described as being the onset of primary hypogonadism.

Primary hypogonadism is when the testes no longer respond to LH. The testes have a lowered sperm concentration/production and endogenous testosterone level, although LH and FSH are above normal levels. This can be due to desease (Klinefelter's syndrome), over use of anabolic steroids, as described in this study or overuse of HCG. The simple answer to primary hypogonadism is HRT.

So if the testes (testicular dysfunction) are the main culprit in restoring testosterone production post cycle how can we maintain testicular function and endogenous testosterone production even when "shutdown" using andorgens? Simple - HCG.

HCG has the ability to maintain endogenous testosterone production and ITT (Intra-Testicular Testosterone) by stimulating the testes (directly) even when shutdown from androgens, such as Testosterone Enathate, shown in this study.

HCG is VERY important in cycles IMHO. It prevents the main reason the HPTA doesnt recover immediately post cycle - testicular dysfunction. It should be a staple of EVERY cycle causing shutdown IMHO.

I suggest Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) be used at 125-250ius 2-3 times weekly (as per Dr.Crisler's advice) with an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) throughout the cycle lasting 6-12 weeks. This will maintain testicular size and function and prevent testicular dysfunction. It should also be noted that administering over "500ius will cause an increase in estrogen and progesterone, further hindering recovery" - Dr.Crisler.


For those wanting to convert their Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) doses into something more managable. Here's how:

HCG comes in 1500ius and 5000ius amps. Usually from Pregnyl. Chinese suppliers also stock their Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) in these two denominations too.

You need to get some sterile empty 10ML glass serum vials. You can get these from AR-R.

You also need to get some bac. water. If you were to mix 5000ius with 10ML bac. water, 1ML = 500ius. If you were to mix 1500ius with 10ML bac. water, 1ML = 150ius.

Once mixed, refridgerate. I tend to use my mixed Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) within 30-45 days.

Its really that simple.


This thread has been written on correspondance from Dr.Crisler (Swale), Concilliator and my own research gathered.

Yes it was.

 

[vmax700]

Something keeps striking me as odd with one of the main arguments against hcg usage at 500iu twice/week is that it can desensitize you to the hcg and yet there hasn't been anything shown that desensitizing occurs at such a low dosage. However, the alternative suggested is 3 times that and at a dosage that has been shown to desensitize you.


I think this is one of those things that will either stand the test of time because it works or it won't, but it won't be 'proven' anytime soon.

has this protocol stood the test of time? it's been ten years. has it been proven to work?

 

[PrinceDianabol]

has this protocol stood the test of time? it's been ten years. has it been proven to work?

Hcg @ 500iu weekly and not in PCT is still the current protocol. I'd never cycle without it imo.