Adding to another thread about BA and BB.

[cause4alarm]

I've been brewing my own gear for the past year or so at what I've seen recommended 2%BA and 18%BB. (I've seen the BB fluctuate from 15-20% depending on the ester) Well every time I shot my enanthate I had a lump for about 4-5 days afterwards. Not really painful but aggravating because for all the years I've been juicing I never had those lumps. I actually used the same percentages with deca and it was quite painful, which deca really isn't suppose to be.

SO, after digging through a huge bag of empty vials (don't ask me why I've kept them over the years) I found some vials which had the percentages of each chem on the label. What I found was that for this particular lab (most likely some UGL) used 5%BA and 2%BB. I can't remember a single injection being painful or giving me any lumps for days on end.

After reading into this some more, I found out that most long esters don't even need to be suspended in BB (enanthate, deca, etc.) but what does need such large amounts of BB are the short esters or for people trying to suspend a high dosed solution.
So this has me thinking, have I been using wayyy too much BB for all this time?
I wasn't going to follow that labs percentages exactly, mainly because I don't feel any need for 5%BA but I was thinking about doing my usual 2%BA but instead drop the BB to 5%.

If anyone has any opinions, views, concerns or experience with these percentages please feel free to share!! Thank you!!

 

[Matthew121]

I wish I knew the answer bro, I am just getting ready to do my first batch.
I was planning on making some 325mg/ml test e. I was only going to do 12%bb just because I here you dont need much with test e. But now I am wondering with making it higher concentration if I should use the standard 15-18%.

 

[jamesl0822]

I have had the same issues with test e leaving painful lumps and I have ruled out most everything.

I bought an autoclave bc I was worried about my vials not getting sterilized enough.
I took out all EO
I have not played with BB percentages but I have taken different shots of plain oil with different bb an ba percentages (filtered of course) but no reactions or lumps.

I figured it was just the hormone was strong and I have heard that Test with the enanthate ester can be tougher to take for some people...but I have never had this with any other enanthate?

I would love to hear from some more knowledgeable guys bc I have quite a bit of Test E just waiting to be brewed but my test C is so sweet I havent bothered.

 

[cause4alarm]

I have had the same issues with test e leaving painful lumps and I have ruled out most everything.

I bought an autoclave bc I was worried about my vials not getting sterilized enough.
I took out all EO
I have not played with BB percentages but I have taken different shots of plain oil with different bb an ba percentages (filtered of course) but no reactions or lumps.

I figured it was just the hormone was strong and I have heard that Test with the enanthate ester can be tougher to take for some people...but I have never had this with any other enanthate?

I would love to hear from some more knowledgeable guys bc I have quite a bit of Test E just waiting to be brewed but my test C is so sweet I havent bothered.

I started with no EO but then experimented by adding only 5% with no changes in the post-lump.

Trust me, I'm no pansy when it comes to pain as I've experienced some rough injections with my first brew (still have a huge piece of scar tissue where I think a sterile abscess formed from my very first cloudy brew). This pain isn't terrible and is definitely bearable but I just feel as though it can be reduced. If others are doing this without the lumps then I should be able to as well.

My next batch won't be made for a few weeks but I've been doing more reading and I'm going to almost completely remove the BB from the solute. I will first try at 5% unless anyone has any objections

 

[jamesl0822]

Shit man give it a try...let us know

I'd love to use the Test E its cheap and its so much easier to brew not nearly as finicky as the test cyp.

 

[ChrisWho?]

Yes with most long esters you can get away with BA only. The main reason for most labs and brewers using 15-20% bb is to lower oil viscosity, not to try try and hold solution.

 

[ChrisWho?]

You'll do just fine with no BB in enanthate/decanoate, may be a little thick but well worth it. The less solvents the better imo. There was a lab that used BA only and supposedly their gear was extremely smooth, never got a chance to try it though.

Good luck with this, I have a feeling how it'll turn out and am really contemplating doing the same for a small batch.

 

[Matthew121]

How do you guys feel about using minimal bb (5-10%) on a batch of 200ml @ 350mg?
Should I still be good, or does the higher concentration need more bb? Or is that irrelevant

 

[cause4alarm]

You'll do just fine with no BB in enanthate/decanoate, may be a little thick but well worth it. The less solvents the better imo. There was a lab that used BA only and supposedly their gear was extremely smooth, never got a chance to try it though.

Good luck with this, I have a feeling how it'll turn out and am really contemplating doing the same for a small batch.

Thank you for the advice and from what I've been reading BB really isn't all that great for the body, especially at such high concentrations. I also have gear from another lab that doesn't include BB on their label but that was my very first cycle 7 years ago. I do vaguely remember it being somewhat harder to push through the 23g but I can't remember any other issues.

Even though EO at high concentrations isn't all too great for being injected either, I think I will increase from 5% to maybe 10% to help with the loss of viscosity from the BB. I always warm the syringe in my hand for 10-15 mins prior to injecting which makes it easier to flow anyways.

This now has me excited to make the next batch and I'll definitely post the results!

Thanks again for all the input everyone.

 

[Animalized]

My first batch was made with BA only, never had any post injection problems at all. The batch I'm using now, after recommendations, was made with BB and BA and I'm now regreting it. My legs hurt like hell after a shot, usually the next day, and that never happened with the first batch. Did an injection in my shoulder yesterday and today I have swelling and the same pain as in my leg..

Next time I'll be leaving the BB out again!!

Will say this, I tried making Tren Enth without BB and couldn't keep if from crashing (cyrstalizing) had to put a small amount in that

 

[cause4alarm]

My first batch was made with BA only, never had any post injection problems at all. The batch I'm using now, after recommendations, was made with BB and BA and I'm now regreting it. My legs hurt like hell after a shot, usually the next day, and that never happened with the first batch. Did an injection in my shoulder yesterday and today I have swelling and the same pain as in my leg..

Next time I'll be leaving the BB out again!!

Will say this, I tried making Tren Enth without BB and couldn't keep if from crashing (cyrstalizing) had to put a small amount in that

Thank you for that info! It's much appreciated!

 

[UserAt204]

Chris is correct. Now if you have been brewing for a year my brother you should know that things like test E and deca don't require BB, but its used to thin the solution and just makes it easier to hold.

I would not use more than 2% BA for pretty much anything. You don't want more.

I still use BB in everything. BB is not causing painful injects and will probably do the opposite because you are thinning out the final solution. So it could be your powders, or your brewing like adding too much hear, could be sterile accesses (non living).

Even with short esters using 2/20 I've never had any pain or lumps. Many of my favorite labs use 1% BA/ 2%BB for many of their oils and they are painless. And some labs lie about the amount of solvents so don't always trust the stickers.

Thebest thing to do is record temps at which your powders go into solution, try using different amounts of solvents to see what you like. The oil I use is pretty thin, and I use varying amounts of BB in my oils.

More importantly to me is powder weight when figuring out you ratios. Many people just stick with .75 for the calculation but you will notice that with many items you end up with quite a bit more final product. I originally made this mistake and still never had a complain.

Now I actually go higher on everything and even though I may lose a few ml in the final solution, at least I know my potency is accurate or slightly above. I'm not a fan of overdosed gear but I'd rather end up with 388ml of TE. At around 257mg/ml and it helps account for purity issues since im assuming no one is getting 100% pure raw.

You don't have to use BA, you could try methylparaben in it's place. If you think BB is causing the problem, you could reduce the amounts, or try EO in it's place or any combination of BB/EO or all EO if you really want to waste you money.

If all your raw is from the same place, try another source and se if you have the same problem.

 

[tommbstone]

I use the same amounts or ba/bb in every test e or c batch every time, I use the minimal heat and still once in a while a batch hurts a little. I think its the raw not possibly not being a pure batch or some other contamination in it.
But i'm speculating here.

 

[Buttman3]

I use the same amounts or ba/bb in every test e or c batch every time, I use the minimal heat and still once in a while a batch hurts a little. I think its the raw not possibly not being a pure batch or some other contamination in it.
But i'm speculating here.

You can test it out without having to speculate, to find out what really caused the pain.

It's really simple. Here is how:

1. Create 2 small batches, 10ml each.
2. On batch #1, use 2%ba, 20%bb.
3. On batch #2, don't use any ba/bb.

4. Inject your left glute with batch #1;
Inject your right glute with batch #2

5. See which glute is painful after several hours.

If your left glute is painful while the right glute is not, then you know it was the ba/bb that caused the pain.