Carbs post work out

[rmonks]

What is 3j's real name? I just mentioned a couple of people who I highly doubt 3j is more knowledgeable than when it comes to training and nutritional science. That being said, I don't know 3j so I can't make a conclusive comment, just an assertion.

Hey if what you know works for you...thats all that matters..I just know 3J knows how to structure meal plans that work and they really work for gains or decreases.

 

[germaine07]

Hey if what you know works for you...thats all that matters..I just know 3J knows how to structure meal plans that work and they really work for gains or decreases.

I'm not knocking 3j in any way. If he knows his stuff then great. I'm always willing to learn more because there's always more to learn.

I was just stating who the current leading people were in the sports nutrition field.

 

[3J]

whats up guys.. i appreciate my boys backing me up here... and all the kind words

there are two philosophies involved in post workout nutrition.. there are some that will swear you need fast acting carbs and some that will swear you can slowly build glycogen stores up over time and do not need it..

if you notice i dont use extremely simple carbs post workout in my clients.. white bagels are more complex then dextrose yet less complex then oats..

i believe a bagel works very well for post workout because its in the middle of the two philosophies... based on my own experience and my experience with my clients there is no reason why i believe i should change it...

but there is a truth about diet philosophies.. there isn't just one.. the idea is to pick one and work with it for a while.. because what works for one doesn't work for another..

i would lie if i said i didn't do dextrose for a while.. and then try oats for a while... and then try some other non-sense that no one has heard of lol.. the idea is to experiment..


so dont get into a hard debate about this.. trust me i have tried for years with other nutritionists.. for every study thats out there that says a fast acting carb is better there will be one trying to debunk it and vice versa...

 

[germaine07]

I think what some people don't understand is that you don't actually come close to depleting glycogen stores during a single workout. Maybe you should clarify that for them.

 

[3J]

I think what some people don't understand is that you don't actually come close to depleting glycogen stores during a single workout. Maybe you should clarify that for them.

the idea is to bring about the most optimal results.. so even if you deplete a little you wanna get that back...

 

[Youngblood43]

I think what some people don't understand is that you don't actually come close to depleting glycogen stores during a single workout. Maybe you should clarify that for them.

even if you don't deplete all of them i still wanna replenish what i did deplete. and i only know one of the people you mentioned and that is layne Norton, smart guy for sure. and why are u jot a fan of Chris? he trains somen of the best bodybuilders on the planet and is a very smart guy. and hany rambod also trains pro bodybuilders, Chris, rambod are considered some of the best trainers in the world

 

[germaine07]

the idea is to bring about the most optimal results.. so even if you deplete a little you wanna get that back...

Glycogen stores even when depleted take 20 hours to replenish. So if you have only depleted them slightly, and are not training again the same day, what's your rush?...

 

[3J]

Glycogen stores even when depleted take 20 hours to replenish. So if you have only depleted them slightly, and are not training again the same day, what's your rush?...

lol at this.. seriously?

 

[MattyIce]

rida5d... I agree with knowing that carbs are essential to growth and overall well-being. Non-carb diets are in the long term sense bad for your overall health.

Post W/O meal for me is always before bedtime... I eat like a horse. The pre-bedtime meal is ESSENTIAL. Sleep is the only time you are anabolic. You NEED the nutrients and macro's in order to recover and rebuild. I'll eat hypothetical:

5-6 eggs
2 chix breast
2 cups brown rice w/ 1 hash brown'd potatoe
1 cup spinach saute in a pan and top with veggy salsa... yummy

 

[SolomonGrundy]

If you want to burn fat and do high intensity interval training like sprint 8 then you want to avoid carbs and sugar for 2 hours after exercise to maximize HGH production and fat burning, once you eat your body will switch and priorities carb burning from fat burning
I should add it is possible to have some protein after if carbs are low and you're a person with high metabolism

 

[olddawg]

You have to look at nutrient transport. I mean that's what we're talking about right? This whole argument, respectfully so far-good job boys-is about how we can get what we need into our muscles the most efficient way possible. So what you all need to do is to read some science, not people's opinion about post workout insulin spike vs insulin sensitivity. What you will need to come to understand is whether a post workout insulin spike does more to drive nutrients into your muscles in that magic hour, than not doing a spike and having your insulin sensitivity high for 24 hours of the day. Take a day or so, read up on the benefits of insulin sensitivity and come back and see if the science has given you new info.
Old school was sugar post workout. Old school also thought that heavy squats release more testosterone when natty, and science says it doesn't. Times are a changing.

whats up guys.. i appreciate my boys backing me up here... and all the kind words

there are two philosophies involved in post workout nutrition.. there are some that will swear you need fast acting carbs and some that will swear you can slowly build glycogen stores up over time and do not need it..

if you notice i dont use extremely simple carbs post workout in my clients.. white bagels are more complex then dextrose yet less complex then oats..

i believe a bagel works very well for post workout because its in the middle of the two philosophies... based on my own experience and my experience with my clients there is no reason why i believe i should change it...

but there is a truth about diet philosophies.. there isn't just one.. the idea is to pick one and work with it for a while.. because what works for one doesn't work for another..

i would lie if i said i didn't do dextrose for a while.. and then try oats for a while... and then try some other non-sense that no one has heard of lol.. the idea is to experiment..


so dont get into a hard debate about this.. trust me i have tried for years with other nutritionists.. for every study thats out there that says a fast acting carb is better there will be one trying to debunk it and vice versa...

 

[3J]

Your entitled to your opinion. I have a system of running things that is effective for my clients that I like to use. If not doing an insulin spike post workout works for you then all the power to you

 

[Rida5d]

whats up guys.. i appreciate my boys backing me up here... and all the kind words

there are two philosophies involved in post workout nutrition.. there are some that will swear you need fast acting carbs and some that will swear you can slowly build glycogen stores up over time and do not need it..

if you notice i dont use extremely simple carbs post workout in my clients.. white bagels are more complex then dextrose yet less complex then oats..

i believe a bagel works very well for post workout because its in the middle of the two philosophies... based on my own experience and my experience with my clients there is no reason why i believe i should change it...

but there is a truth about diet philosophies.. there isn't just one.. the idea is to pick one and work with it for a while.. because what works for one doesn't work for another..

i would lie if i said i didn't do dextrose for a while.. and then try oats for a while... and then try some other non-sense that no one has heard of lol.. the idea is to experiment..


so dont get into a hard debate about this.. trust me i have tried for years with other nutritionists.. for every study thats out there that says a fast acting carb is better there will be one trying to debunk it and vice versa...

Our nutrition king speaks out

 

[olddawg]

Your entitled to your opinion. I have a system of running things that is effective for my clients that I like to use. If not doing an insulin spike post workout works for you then all the power to you

They are not my opinions, you missed the point. the point is, what others in the thread have said..."I do this, I think this...." without any evidence that they are the most efficient ways to go for gaining muscle and losing fat. Do you know anything about insulin resistance? or sensitivity? And I mean, not what your opinion is but from any research atricles. I'll post two here, 1 is a short summary of insulin resistance, the other deals with insulin and it's role in fat burning. We can brolore all day long at 140 lbs, or we can be open to new research, understand why a hundred year old tradition in bodybuilding might not be the best way to go anymore, and give our clients cutting edge advice based on science. Remember, these articles are not my opinions, they are proven research by others.


January 7th, 2010 - Research has shown that people with type II diabetes and metabolic syndrome (i.e. insulin resistance) have significantly lower testosterone levels than regular men. (1,2) Insulin resistance is basically a condition where the insulin created by the body is insufficient to drive nutrients into the muscle and fat cells. This stems from having chronically elevated blood insulin levels.

Under constant stimulation from insulin, cellís become less sensitive to its effects, requiring more and more insulin to get nutrients into the cells. Therefore, anything which drives up blood sugar ***8211; like sugar, rice, pasta, beer, carbs of all kinds ***8211; and thus insulin levels can lead to a reduction in insulin sensitivity. Reduced insulin sensitivity equals lower testosterone levels.

References -

1. The dark side of testosterone deficiency: II. Type 2 diabetes and insulin resistance.

Traish AM, Saad F, Guay A.

J Androl 2009 Jan-Feb;30(1):23-32


2. Low testosterone levels are common and associated with insulin resistance in men with diabetes.
Grossmann M, Thomas MC, Panagiotopoulos S, Sharpe K, Macisaac RJ, Clarke S, Zajac JD, Jerums G.

J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2008 May;93(5):1834-4


Insulin Causes Hyperthermia by Direct Inhibition of Warm-Sensitive Neurons

 

[Youngblood43]

They are not my opinions, you missed the point. the point is, what others in the thread have said..."I do this, I think this...." without any evidence that they are the most efficient ways to go for gaining muscle and losing fat. Do you know anything about insulin resistance? or sensitivity? And I mean, not what your opinion is but from any research atricles. I'll post two here, 1 is a short summary of insulin resistance, the other deals with insulin and it's role in fat burning. We can brolore all day long at 140 lbs, or we can be open to new research, understand why a hundred year old tradition in bodybuilding might not be the best way to go anymore, and give our clients cutting edge advice based on science. Remember, these articles are not my opinions, they are proven research by others.


January 7th, 2010 - Research has shown that people with type II diabetes and metabolic syndrome (i.e. insulin resistance) have significantly lower testosterone levels than regular men. (1,2) Insulin resistance is basically a condition where the insulin created by the body is insufficient to drive nutrients into the muscle and fat cells. This stems from having chronically elevated blood insulin levels.

Under constant stimulation from insulin, cellís become less sensitive to its effects, requiring more and more insulin to get nutrients into the cells. Therefore, anything which drives up blood sugar ***8211; like sugar, rice, pasta, beer, carbs of all kinds ***8211; and thus insulin levels can lead to a reduction in insulin sensitivity. Reduced insulin sensitivity equals lower testosterone levels.

References -

1. The dark side of testosterone deficiency: II. Type 2 diabetes and insulin resistance.

Traish AM, Saad F, Guay A.

J Androl 2009 Jan-Feb;30(1):23-32


2. Low testosterone levels are common and associated with insulin resistance in men with diabetes.
Grossmann M, Thomas MC, Panagiotopoulos S, Sharpe K, Macisaac RJ, Clarke S, Zajac JD, Jerums G.

J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2008 May;93(5):1834-4


Insulin Causes Hyperthermia by Direct Inhibition of Warm-Sensitive Neurons

so are you saying spiking ur insulin a couple timess a day is enough to decrease insulin sensitivity significantly, because i dont see that anywhere. and this research doesn't mean anything for pepole serious about bodybuilding since slin is used so much these days.

 

[3J]

They are not my opinions, you missed the point. the point is, what others in the thread have said..."I do this, I think this...." without any evidence that they are the most efficient ways to go for gaining muscle and losing fat. Do you know anything about insulin resistance? or sensitivity? And I mean, not what your opinion is but from any research atricles. I'll post two here, 1 is a short summary of insulin resistance, the other deals with insulin and it's role in fat burning. We can brolore all day long at 140 lbs, or we can be open to new research, understand why a hundred year old tradition in bodybuilding might not be the best way to go anymore, and give our clients cutting edge advice based on science. Remember, these articles are not my opinions, they are proven research by others.


January 7th, 2010 - Research has shown that people with type II diabetes and metabolic syndrome (i.e. insulin resistance) have significantly lower testosterone levels than regular men. (1,2) Insulin resistance is basically a condition where the insulin created by the body is insufficient to drive nutrients into the muscle and fat cells. This stems from having chronically elevated blood insulin levels.

Under constant stimulation from insulin, cellís become less sensitive to its effects, requiring more and more insulin to get nutrients into the cells. Therefore, anything which drives up blood sugar ***8211; like sugar, rice, pasta, beer, carbs of all kinds ***8211; and thus insulin levels can lead to a reduction in insulin sensitivity. Reduced insulin sensitivity equals lower testosterone levels.

References -

1. The dark side of testosterone deficiency: II. Type 2 diabetes and insulin resistance.

Traish AM, Saad F, Guay A.

J Androl 2009 Jan-Feb;30(1):23-32


2. Low testosterone levels are common and associated with insulin resistance in men with diabetes.
Grossmann M, Thomas MC, Panagiotopoulos S, Sharpe K, Macisaac RJ, Clarke S, Zajac JD, Jerums G.

J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2008 May;93(5):1834-4


Insulin Causes Hyperthermia by Direct Inhibition of Warm-Sensitive Neurons

one of the studies is focused on diabetics..

do you want me to bring 10 "studies" that will debunk these? so you can bring 10 more to debunk mind, and i can bring 15 more to debunk yours?? seriously bro if your going to be open to something you also have to worry about credibility and bias...

its a bit insulting at the least the way you present this stuff.. as if us "older timers" are out of the loop or something.. its ridiculous

we have something those "scientific experiments" dont.. real world experience...

also.. if you didn't know you should look up genetic variance and that not all people react the same to things.. there are people who are insulin sensitive just based on their genetics and there are people who are not... that's why good nutritionist microcalibrate diets

 

[Rida5d]

rida5d... I agree with knowing that carbs are essential to growth and overall well-being. Non-carb diets are in the long term sense bad for your overall health.

Post W/O meal for me is always before bedtime... I eat like a horse. The pre-bedtime meal is ESSENTIAL. Sleep is the only time you are anabolic. You NEED the nutrients and macro's in order to recover and rebuild. I'll eat hypothetical:

5-6 eggs
2 chix breast
2 cups brown rice w/ 1 hash brown'd potatoe
1 cup spinach saute in a pan and top with veggy salsa... yummy

Bro u big.. Fair enough lool

 

[Getbig0325]

Old school saying. "Your body is like a car. After you drive you need to feed it with gasoline. Same goes with your body after you workout." I'm sure I speak for a vast majority when I say that simple carbs post workout with whey has gotten us to be RIPPED! Why change? Or follow. New theory that isn't 100% proven?

 

[olddawg]

I realize the one was diabetic, thank you for pointing that out. So no bodybuilders are diabetic then and the results will have no implications on non diabetics-- gotcha. I have no need to debate this but would suggest to everyone reading that they do an exhaustive review of the literature and draw their own conclusions. Following an opinion blindly will have chance results. There are many variables to this topic, one cannot generalize. if you read up on current research, you will have the gift of knowledge and won't depend on opinion.

one of the studies is focused on diabetics..

do you want me to bring 10 "studies" that will debunk these? so you can bring 10 more to debunk mind, and i can bring 15 more to debunk yours?? seriously bro if your going to be open to something you also have to worry about credibility and bias...

its a bit insulting at the least the way you present this stuff.. as if us "older timers" are out of the loop or something.. its ridiculous

we have something those "scientific experiments" dont.. real world experience...

also.. if you didn't know you should look up genetic variance and that not all people react the same to things.. there are people who are insulin sensitive just based on their genetics and there are people who are not... that's why good nutritionist microcalibrate diets