Daily injection TRT? food for though.

[gruntwerk]

After reading around more I am noticing there's a lot of guys doing the SUBQ method, which seems to require less medicine to achieve the same TT and IM, or so I've read there can be better absorption.

Pinning in the belly with a 28g slin pin is nothing, not to mention they waste practically nothing.

I've read in the books about using prop ED for a more normal hormonal balance, but what about using cyp or eth ED at lose doses?

You figure 120mg of cyp a week is right around 17mg a day, so in theory could you inject the 17mg ED in order to get a more natural test level? Wouldn't you have a peak and a trough ED just like a normal healthy man not on TRT would? How would controlling estrogen be on a protocol like this? And same for HCG... 500iu a week split daily would be about 71iu, any real benefit from this?

Thinking I may like to try it but curious to know the science about it, or the evidence/and-or/experiences you guys have?

In my thinking, it seems most natural to the bodies own cycle right.... T rises in the morning and slowy goes down throughout the day, so would this effect be people with cyp or eth? or would you need to run prop only? It seems like even ED cyp would still be close to more homeostasis.

Thoughts?

Also does supplementing DHEA really have any benefits on TRT? I've read a few guys do it and it's mentioned in the books but no one explains why it's good for your protoco.

I'm also going to have IMT hook me up with the lab RX to get prolactin checked.

 

[Gainjin260]

Why stop at daily injections? You can find these cheap on Amazon!

View attachment 564867

Good luck injecting 71iu of hcg

 

[Megatron28]

I don't want to get into the whole thing right now, but I will make a few comments.

Injecting daily is fine if you are up for it. You could do it twice daily even. Or IV drip. It is all about cost vs. benefit. Yes, increasing the frequency helps, but each increase results in diminished incremental returns. And the cost goes up. More scar tissue. More pinning. More expense on needles. More hassle.

Subq does not use less medication than IM nor is there better absorption. It just has a slower absorption rate than IM. This can help reduce aromatization by maintaining steadier hormone levels and thus potentially resulting in less aromatization.

I am confused a little by your desire to use Prop to have bigger swings in your hormone levels while at the same time wanting to go to daily dosing to in theory reduce the swings.

 

[gruntwerk]

I don't want to get into the whole thing right now, but I will make a few comments.

Injecting daily is fine if you are up for it. You could do it twice daily even. Or IV drip. It is all about cost vs. benefit. Yes, increasing the frequency helps, but each increase results in diminished incremental returns. And the cost goes up. More scar tissue. More pinning. More expense on needles. More hassle.

Subq does use less medication than IM nor is there better absorption. It just has a slower absorption rate than IM. This can help reduce aromatization by maintaining steadier hormone levels and thus potentially resulting in less aromatization.

I am confused a little by your desire to use Prop to have bigger swings in your hormone levels while at the same time wanting to go to daily dosing to in theory reduce the swings.

I'm not going to to use prop, I was just curious becsuse the book by jay cambell has a doc write in saying one if the best ways to do TRT is prop ED, because this gives your body the most natural feel. I myself would not use prop.

I was basically asking by using eth/cyp injections ED couldn't you create a very stable pattern?

I am following though with the diminished returns, makes a lot of sense too.

Thanks guys.

 

[Jimstigator]

Increased Testosterone From Frequent Injections

I have tried all the different frequencies and seem to always fall back on every other day.

-Jim

 

[gruntwerk]

Thanks for sharing Jim, good read for sure. I may try something like ED or EOD at some point, I kinda like injection days now, doesn't seem like it would be terrible if ou rotated subq in with IM.

Is that cool to do anyway? Using subq and IM thru your rotation of shot areas? Seems like the release times may be a little different so just curious. I am going to try a subq shot on Tuesday just for comparison.

 

[3J]

ask yourself, how long are you going to be able to deal with daily injections before you get tired of it or you gain too much scar tissue??

it isn't practical

 

[gruntwerk]

Not really sure how long I could tollerate it, I think with subq it wouldn't be a bother really but it is much less pratical of course. I was actually just doing the math on syringe cost on the long run which isn't pretty.

I suppose what I was trying to find out is if ED injections would mimic your bodies own production of testosterone better, but I see what you fellas mean that it's just more hassle vs. what you can actually see or feel from it.

Still curious if it's okay to mix IM and subq shots through ones rotation though, mega stated there's different absorption times. I ask because I'm currently using my thighs but I have severe nerve damage in my left leg and sometimes it results in increased sensitivity in what nerves are still intact, basically I cannot feel much from my knee down but my thigh is extremely sensitive to any touch.

Would be nice to rotate my right thigh and belly, not a huge fan of using gluted or delts thus far.

 

[3J]

have you tried sub q injections?? i tried it when i started trt.. i had a lump for 3 weeks lol.. not for me

 

[Megatron28]

Not really sure how long I could tollerate it, I think with subq it wouldn't be a bother really but it is much less pratical of course. I was actually just doing the math on syringe cost on the long run which isn't pretty.

I suppose what I was trying to find out is if ED injections would mimic your bodies own production of testosterone better, but I see what you fellas mean that it's just more hassle vs. what you can actually see or feel from it.

Still curious if it's okay to mix IM and subq shots through ones rotation though, mega stated there's different absorption times. I ask because I'm currently using my thighs but I have severe nerve damage in my left leg and sometimes it results in increased sensitivity in what nerves are still intact, basically I cannot feel much from my knee down but my thigh is extremely sensitive to any touch.

Would be nice to rotate my right thigh and belly, not a huge fan of using gluted or delts thus far.

Delts are super easy. My favorite spot. Have you tried ventroglutes yet? Another easy spot. Goes in like butter.

If you do subq you can literally pin almost anywhere. Shoulders. Triceps. Biceps. Chest. Stomach. I and down legs. You have ,100's of sites with subq.

 

[gruntwerk]

Delts are super easy. My favorite spot. Have you tried ventroglutes yet? Another easy spot. Goes in like butter.

If you do subq you can literally pin almost anywhere. Shoulders. Triceps. Biceps. Chest. Stomach. I and down legs. You have ,100's of sites with subq.

Every time I try delts I pretty much move the syringe so much that I bruise myself bad, I can't steady my left hand to poke my right shoulder but when I use my right hand to hit my left shoulder I seem to wiggle it too much when injecting.

haven't tried the ventroglute yet, never knew of it actually so thank you. Seems fairly easy to locate. I like the idea of so many areas with subq, I think I'm going to give it a go because my right thigh is tired.

Thanks again man appreciate the help.

 

[halfwit]

I inject 6-9 times a day as I have to inject insulin to survive. I assure you that while it does become second nature, it's a royal pain in the ass. I wish I could just do two insulin pins a week and be gtg, but medicine has a bit to grow before we get there.

I'm all for experimentation, but felt as I do have some experience injecting quite frequently, it may help.

 

[Billegitimate]

I have experience with this. I did use prop, nightly, in an effort to try to get a small overnight spike to emulate what happens naturally. Tiny shots with a 31g .3cc syringe. Took less than 2 minutes, so 14 minutes a week for the best I've ever felt on TRT.

I reduced my dose compared to Cypionate to account for the different ratios of T to ester and sure enough my levels were within a few percentage points. Basically identical but I felt and performed better with prop.

Subq is so easy (and it was a .13ml shot!) and easy to rotate sites. I had enough locations on stomach, upper thigh and glute that each spot had more than 2 weeks between shots. Occasionally I'd get a small lump but with a tiny injection volume it was gone in a day.

And EVERYTHING felt better. Unfortunately the prop had what I believe to be ethyl oleate in it and my body processes that stuff and then it oozes out of my skin. And it stinks. Well, I think it stinks. My wife thought it absolutely freaking stinks like crazy.

No use in off the chart libido when I reek to my wife, so I tried to find alternatives but ended up back on Cypionate. But I've never felt as good on TRT before or since the nightly prop shots. I'd do it again in a heartbeat. Sports and sex performance much better, libido even more so.

I keep hoping to find some T acetate to try since it should spike a little faster and it might be better, plus it usually doesn't need the EO to stay in solution. One can hope.

Anyway, one voice from experience and I say nightly shots are no biggie if they're subq with tiny needles!

 

[Megatron28]

Every time I try delts I pretty much move the syringe so much that I bruise myself bad, I can't steady my left hand to poke my right shoulder but when I use my right hand to hit my left shoulder I seem to wiggle it too much when injecting.

haven't tried the ventroglute yet, never knew of it actually so thank you. Seems fairly easy to locate. I like the idea of so many areas with subq, I think I'm going to give it a go because my right thigh is tired.

Thanks again man appreciate the help.

I lean forward and brace my elbows on the counter in my bathroom. Then my arm/hand is stable for pinning my delt. Helps a let! Give it a try.

 

[Megatron28]

I have experience with this. I did use prop, nightly, in an effort to try to get a small overnight spike to emulate what happens naturally. Tiny shots with a 31g .3cc syringe. Took less than 2 minutes, so 14 minutes a week for the best I've ever felt on TRT.

I reduced my dose compared to Cypionate to account for the different ratios of T to ester and sure enough my levels were within a few percentage points. Basically identical but I felt and performed better with prop.

Subq is so easy (and it was a .13ml shot!) and easy to rotate sites. I had enough locations on stomach, upper thigh and glute that each spot had more than 2 weeks between shots. Occasionally I'd get a small lump but with a tiny injection volume it was gone in a day.

And EVERYTHING felt better. Unfortunately the prop had what I believe to be ethyl oleate in it and my body processes that stuff and then it oozes out of my skin. And it stinks. Well, I think it stinks. My wife thought it absolutely freaking stinks like crazy.

No use in off the chart libido when I reek to my wife, so I tried to find alternatives but ended up back on Cypionate. But I've never felt as good on TRT before or since the nightly prop shots. I'd do it again in a heartbeat. Sports and sex performance much better, libido even more so.

I keep hoping to find some T acetate to try since it should spike a little faster and it might be better, plus it usually doesn't need the EO to stay in solution. One can hope.

Anyway, one voice from experience and I say nightly shots are no biggie if they're subq with tiny needles!

Why not try the same protocol with Cyp?

 

[Billegitimate]

Why not try the same protocol with Cyp?

I have. Cyp is so much more slowly absorbed that it doesn't produce the spike that prop does. Injected cyp every night for a few weeks then went back to twice a week. Felt no difference. My whole reason for nightly injections was to try to mimic the natural ebb and flow of t levels and cyp just doesn't absorb quickly enough to do it.

I still suspect that test acetate would be nearly perfect for nightly TRT shots but it's not readily available. Some people react poorly to prop and acetate usually doesn't have any pip so would make it available to them as well.

 

[gruntwerk]

I inject 6-9 times a day as I have to inject insulin to survive. I assure you that while it does become second nature, it's a royal pain in the ass. I wish I could just do two insulin pins a week and be gtg, but medicine has a bit to grow before we get there.

I'm all for experimentation, but felt as I do have some experience injecting quite frequently, it may help.

I understand what you're saying for sure, I am going to take a rain check on trying ED shots for now. I think I might try subq today though.

 

[gruntwerk]

I have experience with this. I did use prop, nightly, in an effort to try to get a small overnight spike to emulate what happens naturally. Tiny shots with a 31g .3cc syringe. Took less than 2 minutes, so 14 minutes a week for the best I've ever felt on TRT.

I reduced my dose compared to Cypionate to account for the different ratios of T to ester and sure enough my levels were within a few percentage points. Basically identical but I felt and performed better with prop.

Subq is so easy (and it was a .13ml shot!) and easy to rotate sites. I had enough locations on stomach, upper thigh and glute that each spot had more than 2 weeks between shots. Occasionally I'd get a small lump but with a tiny injection volume it was gone in a day.

And EVERYTHING felt better. Unfortunately the prop had what I believe to be ethyl oleate in it and my body processes that stuff and then it oozes out of my skin. And it stinks. Well, I think it stinks. My wife thought it absolutely freaking stinks like crazy.

No use in off the chart libido when I reek to my wife, so I tried to find alternatives but ended up back on Cypionate. But I've never felt as good on TRT before or since the nightly prop shots. I'd do it again in a heartbeat. Sports and sex performance much better, libido even more so.

I keep hoping to find some T acetate to try since it should spike a little faster and it might be better, plus it usually doesn't need the EO to stay in solution. One can hope.

Anyway, one voice from experience and I say nightly shots are no biggie if they're subq with tiny needles!

Thanks for sharing your experience with it, thats crazy your body was expelling something out of the prop. Did you have an infection or something like that?

 

[gruntwerk]

Decided to try the ventroglute today versus subq, smooth as can be with a 25g 1 inch to pin... Will continue to throw that spot in now.

Appreciate it mega.

 

[juced_porkchop]

why pin every day if its not needed? 1-2x a week. we naturally have small dips and spike in t level and i feel most over blow it a bit on fluctuations. every pin is still a risk of infection and/or scare tissue regardless how careful you are. in one month you could have had your whole years worth of shots. just not worth it to me IMO